JamesH

iTrader: (21)

As above Mike is right (as usual ) , the Stg1 ADR 6° rear beam is only adjustable for camber, and not toe, to do camber AND toe you would require the stg2, Charlie (my father) chose the stg1 because he was advised that he did not require toe adjustment for fast road use, which is also suggested in ADR's layout of their prices for their 6° rear beams (he never and will not track the car); and he is also not as flush as some on here

However he did have the car setup yesterday, toe on front and camber on rear as per Mike's settings (Thanks for answering the phone yesterday Mike ). Charlie is VERY pleased with it, and with a quote of £180 + VAT to exchange his stg1 arms for stg2's (including the extra rose joints) it is something that he is not looking at doing in the near future. Namely because he is very happy with the car as it is, and is uncertain just how much benefit toe adjustment on the rear would make to a road car that is not very often really driven to the limit of the cars handling capabilities/tyres. And also that making the front completely adjustable (to match) and reliable by not putting stress on other components is extremely expensive.

Personally if you feel camber AND toe adjustment on the rear is necessary ADR's stg2 because it is all done with rosejoints whereas Ahmed's is slotted in the beam I believe, I am not sure how this compares, I trust Mike will know the answer though.

James

Twellsie

iTrader: (1)

but Mike it was you that was comparing the Ahmed beam to the Adrenaline stg1 beam by saying that the Adrenaline beam is not fully adjustable

Mad Matt

iTrader: (2)

Prices for adrenaline setups :

Does than mean if I add 100£ I will get a NEW rear beam AND arms or ?

Btw Tim could you just post more feedback about the back end of the cars rather than just 2 words ?

jb fletch

iTrader: (1)

Back to Mike

Mike Rainbird

iTrader: (3)

And I thought that I had adequately explained the reasoning behind that as well, but obviously not . I was pointing out that the £1k Ahmed one is fully adjustable, so should only be compared like for like with the Stage 2 version of the Adrenaline beam, to prevent anyone from making a mistake believing that the the Stage 1 version of the Adrenaline beam would (at far less cost) do the same thing as the AB beam, only to find that it didn't adjust the toe . I really hope this clarifies to yourself and the thin one, before I lose the will to live .

JamesH

iTrader: (21)

I wonder who shitout and thought that originally

Mike is just trying to let others learn where tohers have possibly mis-understood too

Mike Rainbird

iTrader: (3)

James,
I didn't want to name names, but your Dad sprang to mind when I was posting this .

Mad Matt

iTrader: (2)

All is clear Mike, no problem, well the group A setup doesn't looks that much interesting regarding the price compared to the stage 2 adrenaline setup or ahmed's rear beam, but other than the material used (mag arms, ...) it must be stronger, and better isn't it ? Has anyone even tried that setup on a car to compare with standard modified ones, or is that just theory to say the 6° is better than the 9° ?

Trying to push the discussion further.

Mike Rainbird

iTrader: (3)

They would not be brand new, but reconditioned second hand items .

Mike Rainbird

iTrader: (3)

If you want a Grp A 9° one, Escosracer has one for sale that is sitting in my garage .

ian sibbert

It would be ludicrious to go down the WRC esc route....it'd cost you about 3K before you even buy a diff....all would have to be on either 9" or 7.5" drive shafts, stub shafts and drive flanges. The rear wrc hubs are unique to the WRC esc, they are as you say gravel fronts, but from the WRC esc....they are 15mm shorter and use a different bearing than that used on a grp'a' saph or esc, the use of these hubs has a bearing on the geometry...the esc wrc does have near perfect geometry but it takes a lot of fiddling to dial it out......un-equal lateral links dont make perfect geometry

IMO fully adjustable rear beams are a complete waste of time and money on anything other than a competetion car......escorts are renowned for being twichy under geometry change....simple answer is, just get a sierra... the longer wheelbase makes a far better package.......

lead_foot

iTrader: (1)

Buy an S14 full adjustable kit front and back for £400.

JamesH

iTrader: (21)

Hopefully everything is clear now Mike

I would just say, if you cannot afford to spend £1000 on a rear beam (like Charlie couldn't) but can spend £700 and just get adjustable camber as you can always trade in your stg1 arms for stg2 at a later date As I believe the main issue is the camber anyway, and not the toe?

Micky The Finn

and if your a decent driver,you can just drive around any shit handleing charactaristics the escort has anyway.









and if your not a decent driver,then subaru and mitsubishi can help you.

Twellsie

iTrader: (1)

ok Mike, i am glad you have got your head round it now

Mike Rainbird

iTrader: (3)

Okay stupid .

col cos1

iTrader: (5)

good thread will be after 1 of these next year

Mad Matt

iTrader: (2)

I have the possibility to buy a full rear beam group A setup with mag links (was used on a gravel car) but my question was to know if the group A setup was really better than a standard-modified rear beam setup, because there is a price difference, the parts are harder to find and of course more expensive, so without a quite noticable difference, I don't know why I should go for the group A setup.

Charlie Chalk

iTrader: (1)

Are the Ahmed items new then

Micky The Finn

in 3 years time the group A square axle will be worth 50% more than it is now,whereas the welded up standard item will be worth very little,or will have snapped under use (not that that happens though eh!!).

Mad Matt

iTrader: (2)

Yes quite a big problem because you never know how have been used the parts so I would be only interested in new parts (beam and arms). I know the rear beam can be found on ebay, but unsure for the arms.

Don't know if I should start going the group A route yet.

Btw Mike which type or rear beam Michael has for sale (tarmac, wide tarmac, gravel) and how much ?

Mike Rainbird

iTrader: (3)

Charlie,
Either your existing beam is modified as per the pictures that YUM posted up and then powder coated, or it is done on an exchange basis using a second hand beam.

Personally I have never heard of one of the AB beams breaking and my one landed from a 7ft high jump and only bent one of the arms like a banana (but it didn't break), so I don't know to what type Tim is referring.

Xen,
You will have to ask Michael, but it is green like the one Tim posted a picture of (if they are colour coded)?

Charlie Chalk

iTrader: (1)

Yeah thats what I though.. I remember Dave telling me his was away to be modified, Just got muddled up with the way you worded it, as if Adrenalines arn't new, but Ahmeds are.

Micky The Finn

green is gravel black is tarmac and widetrack,blue is sapphire.

Mad Matt

iTrader: (2)

Which can sometimes be wrong. Some are listening green beams as wide tarmac, and there are also some red ones.

ian sibbert

Matt,

Is your car a competition or road car?

If its a road car, be careful putting mag arms on....they will deteriorate very quickly on the road and these definately do snap, ive seen even good ones snap.....

Ian

Micky The Finn

green rear arms are gravel,period.not up for discussion.

red,somebody has had the painters in then.

Mad Matt

iTrader: (2)

Ian the car will mostly be used on hillclimb races/stages, sometimes on racetrack, sometimes just to have fun in the moutains so won't be used a lot.

So I guess that if I clean up the underside of the car carefully and if I dry carefully every bit of water on mag parts and then put these under a high-flow air-pressure jet they shouldn't rust and then crack ?

But with your experience, how greater do you recon the group A rear setup can be compared to the modified standard rear beams ?

Sorry for my english...

Spiky

iTrader: (1)

my mate has a malcom wilson esc cossie

on there rear it has a grp a beam and it's blue with mag arms

what is that?? tarmac? gravel?


are they worth much?

Micky The Finn

nope,what you do is before fitting them you clean them dry them then repaint covering all exposed parts very well,should last for years and years if looked after.

Micky The Finn

try being a little more vague!!!!

Mad Matt

iTrader: (2)

Ok thanks for the advice. Should I remove the existing paint before repainting over or not ?

Micky The Finn

i never have,done over 50 events in a group A escort and never had any mag arms break,in 10 years rallying ive only seen one brake,and that car was a dog.

Spiky

iTrader: (1)

this is what it looks like

Micky The Finn

thats a very old sapphire rear axle.

Mad Matt

iTrader: (2)

Tim so you just repaint the arms and links and its' all ? Sounds easy.

Spiky, looks like a saph group A setup.

Spiky

iTrader: (1)

ok cheers guys

can i ask how you tell??? lol i have no idea, nor does my mate

Micky The Finn

they deteriate with age,magnesium is eaten by oxegen in the air,they do require looking after but in my opinion are worth it.

Spiky

iTrader: (1)

Cosworth Rallyesport


is that beam any good? worth much?

Charlie Chalk

iTrader: (1)

Id get the arms bead blasted, but use a plastic media.. One thing though, Mag is a cunt to have painted as it as air bubbles in the surface