Twin Turbo YB
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Originally Posted by Chip-3Door
Originally Posted by SapphyMike
Originally Posted by Chip-3Door
Nitrous as antilag can be used happily on a daily driver.
On a L8 YB though, with the ability to retard ignition so easily, id be looking for 100bhp or bigger jets, but on a progressive buildup for an ideal solution, on a VERY sharp rise time though, so start at 40bhp and build to 100bhp+ in 2 seconds or less, then put a boost switch on to cut the nitrous off again at 20psi or whatever is appropriate, used like that for only a couple of seconds at a time, a bottle lasts a long time (like 100 instances of WOT from an 11lb bottle)
It really does make an immense difference to how they drive.
If going for a fix hit, 50bhp gets my vote.
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i guess using nos at the low end is pretty safe, even on a 500bhp+ cossie?
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By the way, what is this car for? Corners? Burning rubber? Killing Evos from traffic lights?
Chip I have absolutely no idea what would nitrous be for except in a drag-car.
Chip I have absolutely no idea what would nitrous be for except in a drag-car.
#43
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Originally Posted by Azrael
By the way, what is this car for? Corners? Burning rubber? Killing Evos from traffic lights?
Chip I have absolutely no idea what would nitrous be for except in a drag-car.
Chip I have absolutely no idea what would nitrous be for except in a drag-car.
Nitrous as antilag isnt really that great on a drag car as you never really come out of the boost threshold for long enough to need it once you are moving.
On a road car though its great, floor it and get instant punch rather than lag, great coming out of bends, or just when you put your foot down going from a 30 limit to a 60 limit or pull out to overtake a car.
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Originally Posted by Chip-3Door
Originally Posted by Azrael
By the way, what is this car for? Corners? Burning rubber? Killing Evos from traffic lights?
Chip I have absolutely no idea what would nitrous be for except in a drag-car.
Chip I have absolutely no idea what would nitrous be for except in a drag-car.
Nitrous as antilag isnt really that great on a drag car as you never really come out of the boost threshold for long enough to need it once you are moving.
On a road car though its great, floor it and get instant punch rather than lag, great coming out of bends, or just when you put your foot down going from a 30 limit to a 60 limit or pull out to overtake a car.
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
Anyway who needs big turbo and nitrous for pulling from 30 to 60 mph?!??!!? Even standard Escos does this far too fast
![Wink](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif)
#45
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Originally Posted by Azrael
Well it depends how high your boost threshold is. I know they use it that way, but I don't know much about drag racing anyway.
I tend to like things that work with every tank full and don't need toping up between oil changes
Anyway who needs big turbo and nitrous for pulling from 30 to 60 mph?!??!!? Even standard Escos does this far too fast
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
Anyway who needs big turbo and nitrous for pulling from 30 to 60 mph?!??!!? Even standard Escos does this far too fast
![Wink](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif)
If you had ever tried it, you would know what I mean, but clearly you havent so dont.
And I agree a standard small turbo escos has nice response, but people who want big power end up losing that, nitrous gives it back to you very simply.
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Originally Posted by Chip-3Door
Originally Posted by Azrael
Well it depends how high your boost threshold is. I know they use it that way, but I don't know much about drag racing anyway.
I tend to like things that work with every tank full and don't need toping up between oil changes
Anyway who needs big turbo and nitrous for pulling from 30 to 60 mph?!??!!? Even standard Escos does this far too fast
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
Anyway who needs big turbo and nitrous for pulling from 30 to 60 mph?!??!!? Even standard Escos does this far too fast
![Wink](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif)
If you had ever tried it, you would know what I mean, but clearly you havent so dont.
And I agree a standard small turbo escos has nice response, but people who want big power end up losing that, nitrous gives it back to you very simply.
My point was - why not use a bit smaller size turbo, have nicer torque curve and QUICKER car all around instead of chasing numbers.
We did this with a Scooby recently - the 350bhp one proved much faster then 400bhp one in the same weight shell. Of course it's A BIT slower in the straigh line but much much faster in most other conditions and easier to drive.
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Went very well thanks for asking
Harvey is a Top bloke went right out his way to make me feel welcome and Good how cool is his Grp A Escort
Left at just after 9:00am Thanet way Traffic, M2 Traffic, M25 traffic, M11 slow moving A14 Traffic, A1(m) Traffic and the small roads round Peterborough you guessed it traffic lol
got there just before 2pm
Waiting for me was a stupidly quick escos that im not sure i can talk about a few sierras and Mike Goldbums Escos that Harvey took me out in to show me what a real 500+ Hp car is like on the road
after a nose about in the workshop and at the customers cars Harvey Dropped me to the Local train station in Mikes car
one thing i did find out is My Turbo is a Grp A T34.63 with a maram shaft and because its a Grp A it has the exhaust blades cut so it can run moocho boostyo and while this is good for more power and torque its not good for the lag side
but saying that when i get it back i will have ALS and at least i know my current turbo is the most laggy turbo i will probably ever have on an engine
Its having longer studs put in the rear beam, water injection wired in, Coil pack fitted, Grey injectors fitted, Air injectors fitted, 2 stage boost, new rocker cover gasket and half moons and a total setup
All in all was a good Day cant wait to get her back now
![Big Grin](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_mrgreen.gif)
![drool](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/drool.gif)
Left at just after 9:00am Thanet way Traffic, M2 Traffic, M25 traffic, M11 slow moving A14 Traffic, A1(m) Traffic and the small roads round Peterborough you guessed it traffic lol
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
Waiting for me was a stupidly quick escos that im not sure i can talk about a few sierras and Mike Goldbums Escos that Harvey took me out in to show me what a real 500+ Hp car is like on the road
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/shocked.gif)
after a nose about in the workshop and at the customers cars Harvey Dropped me to the Local train station in Mikes car
![Big Grin](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_mrgreen.gif)
one thing i did find out is My Turbo is a Grp A T34.63 with a maram shaft and because its a Grp A it has the exhaust blades cut so it can run moocho boostyo and while this is good for more power and torque its not good for the lag side
![Sad](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_sad.gif)
![Smokin](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_smokin.gif)
Its having longer studs put in the rear beam, water injection wired in, Coil pack fitted, Grey injectors fitted, Air injectors fitted, 2 stage boost, new rocker cover gasket and half moons and a total setup
![Content](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/content.gif)
All in all was a good Day cant wait to get her back now
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Originally Posted by Azrael
By the way, what is this car for? Corners? Burning rubber? Killing Evos from traffic lights?
Chip I have absolutely no idea what would nitrous be for except in a drag-car.
Chip I have absolutely no idea what would nitrous be for except in a drag-car.
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Originally Posted by cossie4i
Originally Posted by Gatecrasher
Originally Posted by cossie4i
Originally Posted by Gatecrasher
Steve just had a quick look at Dastek RR, do you know if they are Accurate, i mean i would rather take a drive up the road a bit to go on a Dyno Dynamics RR as they seem to be the most accurate, or read the lowest ![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
So if i get loads more power then no it ain't accurate lol
Steve.
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Steve.
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#51
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Originally Posted by Chip-3Door
Originally Posted by SapphyMike
Originally Posted by Chip-3Door
Nitrous as antilag can be used happily on a daily driver.
It really does make an immense difference to how they drive.
If going for a fix hit, 50bhp gets my vote.
My turbo makes full boost at the moment at 3500rpm and i am happy with that so i want nitrous to just get it to 3.5k a bit quicker but once that turbos on full chat then no N20 at all but as soon as i drop down below 3500 the nitrous is back on
Can this be done through every gear and be limited to each gear from 0rpm to just 3.5k and if so how would you progress the nitrous and at what level would you use wat amount?
sorry for all the questions but i know you like explaining things
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
cheers
![Grin](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
#53
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Originally Posted by Gatecrasher
So in an ideal world what would be the best Kit for what i want
My turbo makes full boost at the moment at 3500rpm and i am happy with that so i want nitrous to just get it to 3.5k a bit quicker but once that turbos on full chat then no N20 at all but as soon as i drop down below 3500 the nitrous is back on
Can this be done through every gear and be limited to each gear from 0rpm to just 3.5k and if so how would you progress the nitrous and at what level would you use wat amount?
sorry for all the questions but i know you like explaining things
cheers![Grin](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
My turbo makes full boost at the moment at 3500rpm and i am happy with that so i want nitrous to just get it to 3.5k a bit quicker but once that turbos on full chat then no N20 at all but as soon as i drop down below 3500 the nitrous is back on
Can this be done through every gear and be limited to each gear from 0rpm to just 3.5k and if so how would you progress the nitrous and at what level would you use wat amount?
sorry for all the questions but i know you like explaining things
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
cheers
![Grin](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
You need:
Single injector nitrous kit : http://www.noswizard.com/product_inf...products_id=58
Digital progressive controller : http://www.noswizard.com/product_inf...roducts_id=101
Boost switch : http://www.aquamist.co.uk/sl/plist/p...5/806-155.html
TPS interface : http://www.noswizard.com/product_inf...products_id=10 (these are a tenner cheaper if bought with a kit)
If you wish to limit it against rpm you can do so on the controller but I dont think you should do so personally.
On my car for example if im at part throttle at 4500rpm and I go WOT the turbo spools MUCH quicker with the nitrous than without, so I think you would still want it at those rpm too until the turbo is spooled, this is the value of the boost switch, it means that you wont EVER have the nitrous on once the turbo is spooled anyway which I suspect is what you really want, not to rpm limit it.
Is your ECU an L8, and if so has it been modified at all?
Ideally you need to still have the octane wires in place.
#54
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Originally Posted by Gatecrasher
Originally Posted by Azrael
By the way, what is this car for? Corners? Burning rubber? Killing Evos from traffic lights?
Chip I have absolutely no idea what would nitrous be for except in a drag-car.
Chip I have absolutely no idea what would nitrous be for except in a drag-car.
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Originally Posted by Chip-3Door
Mike / Tony@Turbosystems / Stu
One (or more) of them will know, hence Ive asked Mike, if he doesnt know, we can start a thread asking the others.![Top](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/smile011.gif)
One (or more) of them will know, hence Ive asked Mike, if he doesnt know, we can start a thread asking the others.
![Top](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/smile011.gif)
#62
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That makes it a little more involved then, cause you are going to need to retard the timing to get away with a big dose of gas.
You can do it via the temp sender though I suspect, but you would need to talk to whoever maps it for you.
Basically you use a relay to swap the resistance of the temp sender out to a different value that you know you wont ever reach (like 150 degrees) and for that value you have a correction in the map that takes a few degrees off the timing.
You can do it via the temp sender though I suspect, but you would need to talk to whoever maps it for you.
Basically you use a relay to swap the resistance of the temp sender out to a different value that you know you wont ever reach (like 150 degrees) and for that value you have a correction in the map that takes a few degrees off the timing.
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Problem with that at the monet is the car isnt going ti be mapped until i get the new engine and for the moment i would still like Nos on my current setup.
Any other ideas, could Won not do it if i had them do the instal?
Any other ideas, could Won not do it if i had them do the instal?
#64
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Originally Posted by Gatecrasher
Originally Posted by Chip-3Door
Originally Posted by SapphyMike
Originally Posted by Chip-3Door
Nitrous as antilag can be used happily on a daily driver.
It really does make an immense difference to how they drive.
If going for a fix hit, 50bhp gets my vote.
My turbo makes full boost at the moment at 3500rpm and i am happy with that so i want nitrous to just get it to 3.5k a bit quicker but once that turbos on full chat then no N20 at all but as soon as i drop down below 3500 the nitrous is back on
Can this be done through every gear and be limited to each gear from 0rpm to just 3.5k and if so how would you progress the nitrous and at what level would you use wat amount?
sorry for all the questions but i know you like explaining things
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
cheers
![Grin](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif)
You don't want NOS you should go for my external gate GT30 set up, I'm sure Doug S will agree.
#67
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Originally Posted by Gatecrasher
This car is for FUN!
![Big Grin](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_mrgreen.gif)
tony mannock did a tt yb back when kylie and jason were still singing
in the bed together,i think the reason it didn't go further was it wasn't as
good as a nice big single one.
how do you drive it ben?? do you pootle until 3.5 then get going
or do you swap cogs and get it going faster quicker if you know
what i mean
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#68
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Originally Posted by cozzfather
Originally Posted by Gatecrasher
This car is for FUN!
![Big Grin](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_mrgreen.gif)
tony mannock did a tt yb back when kylie and jason were still singing
in the bed together,i think the reason it didn't go further was it wasn't as
good as a nice big single one.
how do you drive it ben?? do you pootle until 3.5 then get going
or do you swap cogs and get it going faster quicker if you know
what i mean
![Wink](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_wink.gif)
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
![Confused](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif)
My problem stems from supprise customers, so for EG im minding my own and then someone wants a go, And anyone who owns an escos will know to well happens all the time, i have to drop it and then still wait for what i think would be called Boost thresh hold rather than Lag and this is what pisses me off
once gunning the car Lag isnt a problem through the gears is it is quite aggresive at 350+HP
![Big Grin](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_mrgreen.gif)
My car was built to eat my mates M3 E46 and my current engine just isnt cutting the mustard and after me driving his over the week end in a little race and him in the my cossie i was a little disapointed at the Grunt is from 0rpm and does pull quiet nice
![Red Faced](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_redface.gif)
I wont have it tho
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
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#69
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Originally Posted by Gatecrasher
Problem with that at the monet is the car isnt going ti be mapped until i get the new engine and for the moment i would still like Nos on my current setup.
Any other ideas, could Won not do it if i had them do the instal?
Any other ideas, could Won not do it if i had them do the instal?
You could get away with a smaller dose without needing it, but you didnt ask for my input into a simple system, you asked for the ideal setup, lol
Martin's GT30 setup sounds good, but TBH if you drove that back to back wit ha T34 on nitrous (as a power adder not just as antilag) you WOULD prefer the T34, but only for 10 mins till the bottle ran out, lol
GT30 is a great match to the YB, take martin's advice, its money better spent than an expensive nitrous kit that costs the same, and keeps needing refilling, a bit of lag makes cars fun anyway
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#73
DEYTUKURJERBS
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I vote stuff the nitrous, madness to fit a 0-3500rpm nitrous kit, wizards of nos will have to sell it as the granny booster or summat, nobody needs power boost at a revs almost no performance engine on earth n/a or turbo has good power at
GT30 and external gate like Martin says i reckon, and learn to go over 3500rpm
Now to go in to Ginge-spec waffle mode... (but not about what he did at the gym today or how gangsta his mates are
)
I can understand (from experience) that having no decent power before 4.5k becomes a chore, but 3.5k+ powerband sounds ideal, unless your driving round in 5th all the time surely your there or there about constantly?
Revving the car or not is a subconcious thing IMO down to noise.
Do you drive a normal n/a little engined daily driver? Surely your barely ever under 3.5k in that to drive pretty much anywhere? Your average 1.8-2litre n/a engine needs a whole lot more than 3.5k to accelerate.
BUT because its got a standard quiet exhaust it feels more normal to rev hit harder, as you dont hear it.
Personally I deffo end up revving cars harder when they have quieter exhausts, its a subconious thing.
On the other end of the scale though, rotaries are incredibly loud, so is my Chaser, but they both feel normal to pootle around even at silly rpms like 6.5k+ as they feel so smooth (due to rotaries and short stroke straight6s being like that) its like the rev counter is lying to you.
Amen
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
GT30 and external gate like Martin says i reckon, and learn to go over 3500rpm
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
Now to go in to Ginge-spec waffle mode... (but not about what he did at the gym today or how gangsta his mates are
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
I can understand (from experience) that having no decent power before 4.5k becomes a chore, but 3.5k+ powerband sounds ideal, unless your driving round in 5th all the time surely your there or there about constantly?
Revving the car or not is a subconcious thing IMO down to noise.
Do you drive a normal n/a little engined daily driver? Surely your barely ever under 3.5k in that to drive pretty much anywhere? Your average 1.8-2litre n/a engine needs a whole lot more than 3.5k to accelerate.
BUT because its got a standard quiet exhaust it feels more normal to rev hit harder, as you dont hear it.
Personally I deffo end up revving cars harder when they have quieter exhausts, its a subconious thing.
On the other end of the scale though, rotaries are incredibly loud, so is my Chaser, but they both feel normal to pootle around even at silly rpms like 6.5k+ as they feel so smooth (due to rotaries and short stroke straight6s being like that) its like the rev counter is lying to you.
Amen
#74
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Originally Posted by Stavros
I vote stuff the nitrous, madness to fit a 0-3500rpm nitrous kit, wizards of nos will have to sell it as the granny booster or summat, nobody needs power boost at a revs almost no performance engine on earth n/a or turbo has good power at
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
#75
DEYTUKURJERBS
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what?
quoting who?
i dont see any quotes or names
you think i was serious about a "wizards of nos granny booster" ?
i was taking the piss out of him wanting to do it
need to lay off the crack pipe dude, youve gone nuts
![Confused](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif)
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
![Confused](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif)
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
![Confused](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif)
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
you think i was serious about a "wizards of nos granny booster" ?
![Confused](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif)
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
![Confused](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif)
need to lay off the crack pipe dude, youve gone nuts
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#79
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Originally Posted by Stavros
I vote stuff the nitrous, madness to fit a 0-3500rpm nitrous kit, wizards of nos will have to sell it as the granny booster or summat, nobody needs power boost at a revs almost no performance engine on earth n/a or turbo has good power at
GT30 and external gate like Martin says i reckon, and learn to go over 3500rpm
Now to go in to Ginge-spec waffle mode... (but not about what he did at the gym today or how gangsta his mates are
)
I can understand (from experience) that having no decent power before 4.5k becomes a chore, but 3.5k+ powerband sounds ideal, unless your driving round in 5th all the time surely your there or there about constantly?
Revving the car or not is a subconcious thing IMO down to noise.
Do you drive a normal n/a little engined daily driver? Surely your barely ever under 3.5k in that to drive pretty much anywhere? Your average 1.8-2litre n/a engine needs a whole lot more than 3.5k to accelerate.
BUT because its got a standard quiet exhaust it feels more normal to rev hit harder, as you dont hear it.
Personally I deffo end up revving cars harder when they have quieter exhausts, its a subconious thing.
On the other end of the scale though, rotaries are incredibly loud, so is my Chaser, but they both feel normal to pootle around even at silly rpms like 6.5k+ as they feel so smooth (due to rotaries and short stroke straight6s being like that) its like the rev counter is lying to you.
Amen
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
GT30 and external gate like Martin says i reckon, and learn to go over 3500rpm
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
Now to go in to Ginge-spec waffle mode... (but not about what he did at the gym today or how gangsta his mates are
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
I can understand (from experience) that having no decent power before 4.5k becomes a chore, but 3.5k+ powerband sounds ideal, unless your driving round in 5th all the time surely your there or there about constantly?
Revving the car or not is a subconcious thing IMO down to noise.
Do you drive a normal n/a little engined daily driver? Surely your barely ever under 3.5k in that to drive pretty much anywhere? Your average 1.8-2litre n/a engine needs a whole lot more than 3.5k to accelerate.
BUT because its got a standard quiet exhaust it feels more normal to rev hit harder, as you dont hear it.
Personally I deffo end up revving cars harder when they have quieter exhausts, its a subconious thing.
On the other end of the scale though, rotaries are incredibly loud, so is my Chaser, but they both feel normal to pootle around even at silly rpms like 6.5k+ as they feel so smooth (due to rotaries and short stroke straight6s being like that) its like the rev counter is lying to you.
Amen
![Rolling Eyes](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_rolleyes.gif)
my exhaust noise does not bother me one bit as i cant here it over the gearbox unless you are caning it and yes i love the sound of both so no i don’t drive round in 5th looking for an excuse to moan about Lag its just something that im trying to overcome if i didn’t like my car being noisy i would sell the escos and just use my daily run around A4 TDI
My Current T34 is more laggy than Mike Rainbirds T4 on his current Engine in his car which i went in Monday
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
I don’t Care what anyone says if you can have unlimited boost as in Turbo spools up from 0rmp and by say for E.G. 2000Rmp you was on full boost and the power was unlimited, everyone in the country would be doing what you are doing not just Cosworth owners
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#80
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Originally Posted by Stavros
what?
quoting who?
i dont see any quotes or names
you think i was serious about a "wizards of nos granny booster" ?
i was taking the piss out of him wanting to do it
need to lay off the crack pipe dude, youve gone nuts![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
![Confused](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif)
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
![Confused](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif)
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
![Confused](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif)
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
you think i was serious about a "wizards of nos granny booster" ?
![Confused](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif)
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
![Confused](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif)
need to lay off the crack pipe dude, youve gone nuts
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)
![Surprised](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/bigcry.gif)