First pictures of new engine/turbo .
27-07-2007, 02:53 PM
#161
Happily retired
Thread Starter
Back to Topic.
First i will start by saying that Perfect Bore are being very helpful over a problem that im pretty certain is not their fault.
Today ive been told the results of their test & the main thing is the block has passed all their tests & declared salvagable. It will require to be decked so its a full set of new Liners im afraid. Its a known problem of cast Blocks No 4 (furthest from the water pump) has moved 100 microns, its probably the case ITO that it wont move further & fitting new liners will be fine, but they suggest not risking finding out & offered 2 solutions to the problem. Im not a liberty to say what but my insider contact had tipped me off that a certain Top tuner (Dont speculate cos its none of the erks that frequent this board) uses one of the solutions (thanks contact who is on here). It has proved to solve the probs at these huge horsepowers.
Ive asked for a price which will either mean it gets done or we risk it,
mind you Mark when he gets back may have his own solution 
.
Cheers Rod
First i will start by saying that Perfect Bore are being very helpful over a problem that im pretty certain is not their fault.
Today ive been told the results of their test & the main thing is the block has passed all their tests & declared salvagable. It will require to be decked so its a full set of new Liners im afraid. Its a known problem of cast Blocks No 4 (furthest from the water pump) has moved 100 microns, its probably the case ITO that it wont move further & fitting new liners will be fine, but they suggest not risking finding out & offered 2 solutions to the problem. Im not a liberty to say what but my insider contact had tipped me off that a certain Top tuner (Dont speculate cos its none of the erks that frequent this board) uses one of the solutions (thanks contact who is on here). It has proved to solve the probs at these huge horsepowers.
Ive asked for a price which will either mean it gets done or we risk it,
mind you Mark when he gets back may have his own solution .Cheers Rod
27-07-2007, 02:55 PM
#162
Happily retired
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by JayCos
rod what was on it when i went out in it ?
.GT40 perhaps you can tell Mike about the lag
.
27-07-2007, 03:01 PM
#163
Originally Posted by MadRod
GT40 perhaps you can tell Mike about the lag .
.
. I KNOW what difference a 100-200cc extra makes, especially when dialling in the cams to suit - my old T4 engine made 15psi at 3150rpm and 32psi by 3500 .
27-07-2007, 03:12 PM
#164
Originally Posted by MadRod
Originally Posted by JayCos
rod what was on it when i went out in it ?
.GT40 perhaps you can tell Mike about the lag
.as i was just a passenger it felt like next to nothing rod wasnt playing around when demonstrating what the car could do ! it pulled very very strongly from 2k . I cant say when it came onto boost or when it peaked as it just felt seemless if you understand what i mean . quite truthfully im not a fan of which tuner/builder is best but that car at the time was amazingly perfect if you could discribe a car to that degree and after driving several t4 powered cars you begin to realise how shocking alot of car are setup compared to how rods was specced
27-07-2007, 04:17 PM
#165
DEYTUKURJERBS
Originally Posted by Mike Rainbird
Originally Posted by Chip-3Door
Mike, can you tell the difference between the latest roller bearing T4 and the original RS500 one?
If so, stavros is right that things have moved on when people said they wouldnt.
Regards
Chip
If so, stavros is right that things have moved on when people said they wouldnt.
Regards
Chip
. However, considering that the new T4 is a full ceramic roller bearing core (not like the early ones), I would like to think some improvements have finally been made.
Originally Posted by Stavros
500rpm is NOT the kind of crap people were saying back in the day, 500rpm isnt much, and a lot of RS500 T4 setups seem to be more like 4500, so no change at all.
I dunno about you but id not expect a significant increase in price of a build just becuase the rev range has been extened by 500rpm
And of course 2.5times increase (if your using same crank, rods, pistons, cams, inlet, ehxuast, etc etc etc as a RS500 T4 setup to get an extra 50-100bhp, im not sure how it can be 2.5times more expensive anyhow?) is huge, but still pales into comparison to what used to get spoke about.
And what im talking about was before we started to see the Norwiegan cars anyhow.
I dunno about you but id not expect a significant increase in price of a build just becuase the rev range has been extened by 500rpm
And of course 2.5times increase (if your using same crank, rods, pistons, cams, inlet, ehxuast, etc etc etc as a RS500 T4 setup to get an extra 50-100bhp, im not sure how it can be 2.5times more expensive anyhow?) is huge, but still pales into comparison to what used to get spoke about.
And what im talking about was before we started to see the Norwiegan cars anyhow.
. I think perhaps if they had a GT35 specced car, then they would still be boosting at 500rpm higher as well .You're forgetting that when you get to this power level you HAVE to have the block linered, as it is almost impossible to find a good early 200 block that isn't made of monkey metal
. So linered block - Ł2k ish.Also you have to change the 2wd manifold for anything over 600bhp, which then adds the cost of a tubular manifold and external wastegate - Ł1.5-Ł2k.
Solid lifter top end (inc cams) to safely allow revs above 8k - Ł1k+
A suitable turbo will be Ł1,300ish.
Without mods, even the RS500 inlet becomes restrictive at 600bhp, so this needs changing / or modifying.
The costs just ramp up and up, as everything around it needs improving / changing as well (intercoolers / cooling systems).
I bet if you actually sat down and added up the costs even on the cheap you'd get to an horrendous figure.
Also, if you'd spent all that money, you wouldn't want to trust it all to the shonky OE loom and ECU
, so at least another Ł1.5k to get a good ECU and loom.All the above is without the internals (crank Ł1.5k, rods Ł750-Ł900, pistons Ł700 etc etc) and headwork yet
.
27-07-2007, 04:40 PM
#166
You can do just about 600bhp for around Ł2k more than a T4 500bhp spec, BUT it will be HORRIBLE to drive - just ask Lee and Doug, both of whom went down this route and one has downsized back to a GT30 and the other wants to do the same, as this set up is just TOO compromised with the standard engine capacity .
Perhaps you should ask Lee what he thinks about the spool up time and lag of his GT35, and also ask Doug why he switched back to a turbo that only flows a few more pounds of air than a T4 .
.Perhaps you should ask Lee what he thinks about the spool up time and lag of his GT35, and also ask Doug why he switched back to a turbo that only flows a few more pounds of air than a T4
.
27-07-2007, 05:44 PM
#167
I've found that life I needed.. It's HERE!!
Originally Posted by MadRod
Back to Topic.
First i will start by saying that Perfect Bore are being very helpful over a problem that im pretty certain is not their fault.
Today ive been told the results of their test & the main thing is the block has passed all their tests & declared salvagable. It will require to be decked so its a full set of new Liners im afraid. Its a known problem of cast Blocks No 4 (furthest from the water pump) has moved 100 microns, its probably the case ITO that it wont move further & fitting new liners will be fine, but they suggest not risking finding out & offered 2 solutions to the problem. Im not a liberty to say what but my insider contact had tipped me off that a certain Top tuner (Dont speculate cos its none of the erks that frequent this board) uses one of the solutions (thanks contact who is on here). It has proved to solve the probs at these huge horsepowers.
Ive asked for a price which will either mean it gets done or we risk it, mind you Mark when he gets back may have his own solution .
Cheers Rod
First i will start by saying that Perfect Bore are being very helpful over a problem that im pretty certain is not their fault.
Today ive been told the results of their test & the main thing is the block has passed all their tests & declared salvagable. It will require to be decked so its a full set of new Liners im afraid. Its a known problem of cast Blocks No 4 (furthest from the water pump) has moved 100 microns, its probably the case ITO that it wont move further & fitting new liners will be fine, but they suggest not risking finding out & offered 2 solutions to the problem. Im not a liberty to say what but my insider contact had tipped me off that a certain Top tuner (Dont speculate cos its none of the erks that frequent this board) uses one of the solutions (thanks contact who is on here). It has proved to solve the probs at these huge horsepowers.
Ive asked for a price which will either mean it gets done or we risk it,
mind you Mark when he gets back may have his own solution .Cheers Rod
,which made 874 bhp ,no gas last dyno.
apparently he has overcome those problems now tho .
puddy
27-07-2007, 06:40 PM
#168
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Originally Posted by Mike Rainbird
...............However, Harvey wasn't happy with the "dry" liner type of fitment that Perfect Bore seem to favour, and his concerns have obviously been proven correct looking at what happened to Rod's engine 
. The worrying thing is that Martin is also running the same dry liner set up 
.
. The worrying thing is that Martin is also running the same dry liner set up .
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27-07-2007, 06:51 PM
#171
Happily retired
Thread Starter
Originally Posted by puddy
julian? I know he has had alot of probs with my mates yb powered probe
,which made 874 bhp ,no gas last dyno.
apparently he has overcome those problems now tho .
puddy
,which made 874 bhp ,no gas last dyno.
apparently he has overcome those problems now tho .
puddy
27-07-2007, 07:16 PM
#172
DEYTUKURJERBS
Originally Posted by Mike Rainbird
Perhaps you should ask Lee what he thinks about the spool up time and lag of his GT35
and lag? where? you change up well in the powerband and its fookin relentless mate
30-07-2007, 11:38 AM
#174
Originally Posted by Captain Mike
Were is the Rainbum with the back peddle lol nice one Doug
mike
, IF you understood anything about engines, you would know that a taller block gives improvements EVERYWHERE on a YB engine. When Cosworth produce their own tall block, I will be the first in the queue . However, given that the costs and length of time my engine was taking have been slowly spiralling out of control, I had to draw the line somewhere.However, if I didn't have any budget or time constraints and wanted to build an engine that had the best of everything on it, then I would definitely follow the same route as Martin.
Also, if you note, Martin has clarified that although his block was prepped by the same people, it was done in a different way to Rod's, so shouldn't suffer the same issues
.So, to summerise, I stand by - tall blocks:
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