Stavros

Blocks and heads all swap over I presume.

But could you fit a 2.3 bottomend to a Sierra twin cam 8valve head ok and run it?
What would the comression be? Valves hit pistons?

Basically asking if you can 2.3 a twincam 8valve sierra without massive problems

Ratty

iTrader: (1)

Been done here

2.3 8V in Sierra

http://fordsierraclub.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=20872

Engine printout

http://fordsierraclub.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=26156

Markb_s1

i believe not.. i think the dohc 2.3 engine is totally incompatible with the pinto bottom end but i'm sure someone else will poiunt you in the right direction.

guessing you know the dohc lump is a total piece of crap too...


edit - looks like ti can be done.. not read the thread but always heard it's nto a good idea.

zippyobrien

iTrader: (2)

i would have thought it would be fine as the bore on the 2.3 is slightly bigger than a 2.0 8 valve,

having said that i thought the 16v has additionall water and oil galeries, (but 8 valve is still a twin cam so not 1000 sure there)
and the 8 valve head desnt have massive amounts of lift so shoud be no valve piston cintact

if it was me, id just try to source a rs2000 top end and ecu to go with the 2.3 bottom, as the power is goint to come from the top end any way,
just imo,

and the compression would lower wouldnt it (like when you put an rs turbo head on the 1800cvh

Stavros

Its not a pinto bottomend mate

not for this, the point is it needs to be the twincam 8valve head

zippyobrien

iTrader: (2)

doch engine is very good and can make 280 bhp in n/a form,

and the sierra in this instance has an 14 bottom end, not a pinto

Markb_s1

missed that bit.. sorry... was thinking the dohc lump onto pinto.. not onto the rs2000 one.. in which case no idea.. ignore me!

i know you can get very decent power out of the rs2000 i4 engine.

zippyobrien

iTrader: (2)

hmmmm,
is this for a turbo application by chnace???

i no the rs head goes straigh on, so i gess you could compair a head gasket from an 8 valve and 16 valve, as long as all the water ways line up i cant see why it wont work,

give the 8 valve head a big skim though

Ratty

iTrader: (1)

How as I've never seen over 200bhp without a turbo on the 8v dohc

zippyobrien

iTrader: (2)

all the mk6 escort maxi cars used an i4, and 280 bhp on throttle bodies.

max power did one that made 250 ish to that pink thing

Markb_s1

iknow of someone with the mk5/6 rs2000 i4 engine in a mk2 making over 230 bhp but he has spent some decent cash on it...

Ratty

iTrader: (1)

There 16valves, Stavros wishes to use the 8v head

Markb_s1

i'm clearluy losing the plot after lunchtime stella.. i'm just gonna shut the fuck up!

zippyobrien

iTrader: (2)

yes, which is why i said the doch engine,
which can take many forms including the rs2000 engine,

can still make good power with the 8 valve head, they have massive valves dont they?

Ratty

iTrader: (1)

Thing is with the 8v is that no one has ever really tried to get power out of them

210ish bhp was the best I got in Jasesapphy's car but he had a T25 bolted onto the side of it

zippyobrien

iTrader: (2)

Stavros
what are you trying to achive with this engine,
are you just looking to changed the bottom end due to failiure and though would be a good upgrade,

or are you trying to make a performacne n/a
or turbo conversion out of it,???

ive alwaysed liked the i4, cant work out why more people dont do any thing with them,

got a rs2000 lump in the garage ready for when the 1.6 zetec in my fiesta gives up

make brillaint power at low boost to

Stavros

easy/cheap performance increase from what looks to the untrained eye like a stock looking (barring exhaust/filter maybe) twin cam sierra engine

zippyobrien

iTrader: (2)

go for it,

will need a bit of maths to work out the compression ratio (11 to 1 ) is the max i think you can go on the 2.3 bottom end,

so just need to work out how much to skin of the head.

Stavros

race fuel, job done

zippyobrien

iTrader: (2)

lmao,

whats the management on them,

is it a form of ofab/??

always wondard,

Ratty

iTrader: (1)

All the calcs are on the fsoc for this, from memory it'll be around 11.1 without 8v head mods anyway

thecrust

Yes.

Low down torque is really usable. Especially on standard 2.0 cams. The piper 285s I have in mine drop it a bit from idle, but really perks up the mid-range and top end.

I'm building a second one at the moment as I think I accidentally "overbored" the current one a bit when I honed it by hand for the new rings so it blows smoke when it's hot.

Still goes like a missile compared to how it did as a stock-ish 2.0 tho. Hmmm. Having said that, perhaps it's more like a red arrow.....

James

i was thinking of you and your problems the other day actually!

thecrust

You were?

Poor bleeder, nothing better to think about than the UK's first two-stroke Sierra!

James

hehe i know! i dunno what made me think of it!

dojj

iTrader: (3)

the cheapest way to do it, imho, is to go and find a 2.3 manual car first off
then you have all the bottom end to play with as well as the flywheel (it's different on the 2.3's to take the bigger clutch they use, which is different again to any other clutch i've seen as it looks more like a bmx wheel than a clutch)

you can basicly use the same efi as the 8V uses but you need to play around with injectors sizes

the only other problem you are left with is the compression ratio being a bit too high, 11:1 which jim's dropped to around 10.5:1 which is a little better, plus he's got different cams, a chip, different exhaust, filter and stuff

there is also the problem with the balancer shafts, but i'll let jim explain that as he's going to use a different method this time i think

thecrust

Er, no mate, I'm not.

Although I now know what I would need to do to the 2.3 sump to make it fit the sierra without catching the crossmember, I'm still fitting the Sierra 8v sump like I did with the first one as the starter won't fit if I keep the 2.3 auto sump - the "cut out" is on the wrong side....

Mind you, don't think I'll hacksaw any bits off my donor 2.0 block to fill the gap left by the balancer drive chain this time - going to make a fillet piece up by hand from steel stock at work so I can get a better fit.

As for injector sizes, I now think that 24lb / 250cc injectors are about right. If anything they're on the small side of "about" - the RS2000 16v has 254cc items as standard and the RS boys that do 2.3 bottom ends finish up fitting Escort Cossie small turbo fuel pressure regulators to bring their fuel pressure up to 3.5bar so they can get more fuel and improve responsiveness so I think I'll be trawling ebay for some larger items soon.

Standard Sierra 8v ones are 191cc. The 210cc vauxhall items I'm using at the mo are shite - I dread to think what running horribly weak for the last 1000 miles has done to it.

SafetyFast

Hello,

I am bit new to this. There was some thought in here about 8V (N9A or N9E) and it being under developed. Are there any supplies that have cams for these? Any one recommend someone familiar with porting these heads?

Thanks,

dojj

iTrader: (3)

other than a bit of a clean up, i'd not go too far with it
you get your extra bit of power from your cams and you get the raised compression ratio with the head work in the chambers but i think jim had a few haeds to pa with so knew how far to take the grinding and be safe

once the engine is together it's all about optimising the various bits to make it run right, and he was making mildly tuned V6 power with 2.0 economy

SafetyFast

Another question. Is the bolt pattern the same for the type 9 gearbox and mtx75 gearbox the same. I have a type 9 gearbox, that I would like to fit to the I4 (N9A or N9E) 8V engine.

Thanks,

dojj

iTrader: (3)

yes it is

BUT

the 2.3 uses a different flywheel/clutch combo, although the 2.0 sierra version from the dohc will bolt on wihtout a problem

the 2.3 clutch however, is cossie sized as opposed to being rsturbo sized

RSturboJET

A 2.0 zetec flywheel fits and it takes a 240mm clutch

The i4 has a very strong block. Plenty of metal between the mains and top face.

Powermax engineering in Derry is making 460 BHP at 20 psi with a 16v 2.3. He just needs bigger injectors to make more power.

The only problems I can see you having with a 2.3 8v are:

1- Compression- You will have 11.8:1 unless you modify the combustion chambers and use a thicker head gasket.
2- There will be a gap at the front of the block when you use the 2.0 sump so this will need a piece of metal machined to fill this.
3- Fuelling/Mapping- the 8v EEC-IV can be mapped with a chip- (http://www.moates.net/index.php?cPath=25_35)

dojj

iTrader: (3)

the I4 has an offset stud pattern on the flywheel bolts, but if the other flywheels fit them

RSturboJET

Zetec has the same offset pattern but the i4 bolts are a tad smaller. Mondeo 2.0 fly fitted straight onto mine.