View Poll Results: Police actions at stockwell
Voters: 12. You may not vote on this poll
Police another murder they get away with
17-07-2006, 07:21 PM
#41
Working without a permit - if he can't earn money he couldn't afford to stay, if he couldn't afford to stay he shouldn't have been in the UK. And before anyone starts spouting off that's racist, if they do that's a load of old bollocks. So don't even feckin' start on that tack..........
It's a fact. Yes, a mother has lost a son and I do feel for her but whatever happened or occured, he should have stopped. End of.
It's a fact. Yes, a mother has lost a son and I do feel for her but whatever happened or occured, he should have stopped. End of.
17-07-2006, 07:22 PM
#42
PassionFord Post Whore!!
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: in the sticks
Posts: 6,389
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by Mr S1
Working without a permit - if he can't earn money he couldn't afford to stay, if he couldn't afford to stay he shouldn't have been in the UK. And before anyone starts spouting off that's racist, if they do that's a load of old bollocks. So don't even feckin' start on that tack..........
It's a fact. Yes, a mother has lost a son and I do feel for her but whatever happened or occured, he should have stopped. End of.
It's a fact. Yes, a mother has lost a son and I do feel for her but whatever happened or occured, he should have stopped. End of.
17-07-2006, 07:24 PM
#43
just finding my feet
what you mean a person whos in this country traveling and legally here and the government are aware of him is the same as a person whos here and if he was shot tommorow they would have no record of who he is nor how he got here
mate please dont forget that he was fucking inocent,,,,,,,,, and the officer who cant shoot straights only crime was panicing as he also done nothing wrong either,,,,,,,, he was trying to protect the country like hes ment to and was doign as hes inteigence informed him and done his job as he was trained to do and for that tbh i do think he DOES NOT deserve to be punised,,,,,,,,, he should only be punished if he NEVER shot him as he would not being doing his job properly !!!!
mate please dont forget that he was fucking inocent,,,,,,,,, and the officer who cant shoot straights only crime was panicing as he also done nothing wrong either,,,,,,,, he was trying to protect the country like hes ment to and was doign as hes inteigence informed him and done his job as he was trained to do and for that tbh i do think he DOES NOT deserve to be punised,,,,,,,,, he should only be punished if he NEVER shot him as he would not being doing his job properly !!!!
17-07-2006, 07:24 PM
#44
PassionFord Post Whore!!
Originally Posted by b19bal
did ANY of you hear the chain of events ????
he used his oyster card to gain access to the train,, he was NOT running from the police,,, there was a plain clothes officer on the train who followed him as the other armed officers ran to catch up when he got on the train as he was just under servailance !!!!!! at the time hence the one officer
he was pointed out by the unarmed officer in civies and then pinned down as ONE armed officer shoots ELEVEN TIMES and hits him seven times in the head
at no point did he run away from officers shouting STOP ARMED POLICE as its claimed,,,,,,,, the reason for this is cause he could have set the bomb off straight away
the reason there was 1 officer and just one following him close ios cause they didnt wanna worry him so he let off the bomb
they lost radio contact on the underground and as such they had to react with NO orders to shoot other than there opinion and they did so
but he never fucking jumped the barrier nor ran from police in uniform like they claimed at the fucking time
how would you feel if your traveling to work then all of a sudden a bloke on the train jumps up when 5 other people run on the train and the one bloke shouts "thats him" and jumps on you, yopur gonna try to fucking stand up aint you
thats the point he got totally bundled and the 11 shots went off and he got assainated by accident
it WASNT the officers fault for the killing
the isuue there is IMO is what happend from that point onwards,. they discovered he was inocent a few hours later YET the police commisioner did a press converence claiming he jumped the barrier, was actign suspison and was running from officers who shouted to stop not to mention claiming he was wearing a long winter jacket that looked like it could hide explosives
he was wearing a denim jacet btw
OH AND HE WASNT A FUCKING ILLEGAL IMAGRANT FFS, HES WORK PERMIT HAD EXPIERED BUT HE WAS LEGALLY HERE !!!!!!
PLEASE DO A BUT MORE REASEARCH BEFORE WE BLAME A INOCENT PERSON OF COMMITING A CRIME OF GOING TO WORK ON A WEEKDAY MORNING AND NOT STOPPING OR WEARING A STRING VEST AND SHORTS ON HIS JOURNEY TO WORK AND A SEE THROUGH CARRIER BAG
HOPE THAT EXPLAINS A FEW MORE PARTS
btw thats what i remember so some of it could be wrong in sections but the main points aint
HE NEVER RAN FROM OFFICERS WHO ASKED HIM TO STOP
he used his oyster card to gain access to the train,, he was NOT running from the police,,, there was a plain clothes officer on the train who followed him as the other armed officers ran to catch up when he got on the train as he was just under servailance !!!!!! at the time hence the one officer
he was pointed out by the unarmed officer in civies and then pinned down as ONE armed officer shoots ELEVEN TIMES and hits him seven times in the head
at no point did he run away from officers shouting STOP ARMED POLICE as its claimed,,,,,,,, the reason for this is cause he could have set the bomb off straight away
the reason there was 1 officer and just one following him close ios cause they didnt wanna worry him so he let off the bomb
they lost radio contact on the underground and as such they had to react with NO orders to shoot other than there opinion and they did so
but he never fucking jumped the barrier nor ran from police in uniform like they claimed at the fucking time
how would you feel if your traveling to work then all of a sudden a bloke on the train jumps up when 5 other people run on the train and the one bloke shouts "thats him" and jumps on you, yopur gonna try to fucking stand up aint you
thats the point he got totally bundled and the 11 shots went off and he got assainated by accident
it WASNT the officers fault for the killing
the isuue there is IMO is what happend from that point onwards,. they discovered he was inocent a few hours later YET the police commisioner did a press converence claiming he jumped the barrier, was actign suspison and was running from officers who shouted to stop not to mention claiming he was wearing a long winter jacket that looked like it could hide explosives
he was wearing a denim jacet btw
OH AND HE WASNT A FUCKING ILLEGAL IMAGRANT FFS, HES WORK PERMIT HAD EXPIERED BUT HE WAS LEGALLY HERE !!!!!!
PLEASE DO A BUT MORE REASEARCH BEFORE WE BLAME A INOCENT PERSON OF COMMITING A CRIME OF GOING TO WORK ON A WEEKDAY MORNING AND NOT STOPPING OR WEARING A STRING VEST AND SHORTS ON HIS JOURNEY TO WORK AND A SEE THROUGH CARRIER BAG
HOPE THAT EXPLAINS A FEW MORE PARTS
btw thats what i remember so some of it could be wrong in sections but the main points aint
HE NEVER RAN FROM OFFICERS WHO ASKED HIM TO STOP
no smoke with out fire sorry, but it all brings relative to what Phil said
Mike
17-07-2006, 07:27 PM
#45
Originally Posted by b19bal
what you mean a person whos in this country traveling and legally here and the government are aware of him is the same as a person whos here and if he was shot tommorow they would have no record of who he is nor how he got here
mate please dont forget that he was fucking inocent,,,,,,,,, and the officer who cant shoot straights only crime was panicing as he also done nothing wrong either,,,,,,,, he was trying to protect the country like hes ment to and was doign as hes inteigence informed him and done his job as he was trained to do and for that tbh i do think he DOES NOT deserve to be punised,,,,,,,,, he should only be punished if he NEVER shot him as he would not being doing his job properly !!!!
mate please dont forget that he was fucking inocent,,,,,,,,, and the officer who cant shoot straights only crime was panicing as he also done nothing wrong either,,,,,,,, he was trying to protect the country like hes ment to and was doign as hes inteigence informed him and done his job as he was trained to do and for that tbh i do think he DOES NOT deserve to be punised,,,,,,,,, he should only be punished if he NEVER shot him as he would not being doing his job properly !!!!
17-07-2006, 07:28 PM
#46
just finding my feet
they found somthing that had NOTHING TO DO WITH HIM
he wasnt a fucking muslim ffs he only part that linked him was he came out of a address they belived to have a terroist plotting bombs
of which they was wrong
he was killed over a liburary card or a gym card i think,,,,,, that was the link
HE WAS TOTALLY INOCENT !!!!!!!
he NEVER RAN EITHER so he didnt deserve what he got, he was a victim !!! thats the fact was he was a victim
the criminal here is the the police commisioner who LIED to us when he new the trueth and THEN went to cover it up so we would never know
thats why all yo lot think that the guy ran,,,,, he never !!!!!!
he wasnt a fucking muslim ffs he only part that linked him was he came out of a address they belived to have a terroist plotting bombs
of which they was wrong
he was killed over a liburary card or a gym card i think,,,,,, that was the link
HE WAS TOTALLY INOCENT !!!!!!!
he NEVER RAN EITHER so he didnt deserve what he got, he was a victim !!! thats the fact was he was a victim
the criminal here is the the police commisioner who LIED to us when he new the trueth and THEN went to cover it up so we would never know
thats why all yo lot think that the guy ran,,,,, he never !!!!!!
17-07-2006, 07:31 PM
#48
just finding my feet
there was a program on brought about to tell the truth what happened and it was the reason why the independant commsision was brought into place
btw they DI NOT WANT THERE HELP AND THE INVEIGATED THEM SELVE FIRST AND DICOVERED ALL WAS WELL,,,,,,,,,,,
btw they DI NOT WANT THERE HELP AND THE INVEIGATED THEM SELVE FIRST AND DICOVERED ALL WAS WELL,,,,,,,,,,,
17-07-2006, 07:32 PM
#49
PassionFord Post Whore!!
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: in the sticks
Posts: 6,389
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by b19bal
btw they DI NOT WANT THERE HELP AND THE INVEIGATED THEM SELVE FIRST AND DICOVERED ALL WAS WELL,,,,,,,,,,,
17-07-2006, 07:33 PM
#50
PassionFord Post Whore!!
I am in no way condoneing what the Police Commisioner said but as you have clearly said the address he was staying at was under investigation and he lived there, now it is bloody unfortunate but if you are going to associate with people that arise suspicion like he flat mates must have then i am afriad that bad things will come of it, and it pains me to say he paid the ultimate price (and i am not happy about seeing innocent people die) but thats how the cookie crumbled on that day, wrong place wrong time,
Mike
Mike
17-07-2006, 07:40 PM
#51
just finding my feet
in london house are broken up into "studio flats" that are basically rooms with kitchen area inside them,,,,,,,, they may well have shared a house but they wasnt "flat mates" i dont belive but more like neighbours,,,,,,,,, is it fare your dad gets blamed for living in the same street as a serial killer and even though he knows nothing of it he gets murdered by accident and the world say the same thing like that,,,,,,, all cause he lived near one ???
like i said the police officers who made the desison are not guilty, no different to a member of the army that drops a bomb on bagdad and kills a small child who was sleeping near the bomb factory ect
th people afterwards deserve to be punished with the way they delt with it and treated his mother afterwards too as that was just fucking disrepectful IMO !!!!!!
like i said the police officers who made the desison are not guilty, no different to a member of the army that drops a bomb on bagdad and kills a small child who was sleeping near the bomb factory ect
th people afterwards deserve to be punished with the way they delt with it and treated his mother afterwards too as that was just fucking disrepectful IMO !!!!!!
17-07-2006, 10:27 PM
#52
Regular Contributor
Join Date: Feb 2006
Location: Sunderland
Posts: 233
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I have only read the first few posts, but my Uncle is in the police and works with firearms, some of the situations he has beem in scare the shit out of me. All the hype at the time off terrorism and there are no second chances with that sort of thing (bombs) he should have stopped when told to by the police, simple as that, he gave the police more than just cause to chase him and the guy was on a packed train, the police reacted the way they had been told to in that situation, if he did have a bomb and they didnt shoot...public fuckin outcry although... no bomb, they did shoot...public fuckin outcry. (the police reacted harsh to the officers...they obv had to show they were going to do summat about it, but lets face it, these guys do things we dont even get to read about in the newspapers and its all for our safety!! Not ususally a big fan of the Police but in this instance split second decisions and a situation few people can comprehend.. sorry if my view offends anyone but i couldnt leave it unsaid.
17-07-2006, 10:42 PM
#54
just finding my feet
thank fuck someopne noticed that !!!!
WHY WOULD THE PILICE ASK A MAN THERE ABOUT TO SHOOT POINT BLANK IN THE HEAD IN ORDER SO HE DONT DETINATE A FUCKING BOMB
" OI MAN WITH THE BOMB STOP SO WE CAN SHOOT YOU BEFORE YOU LET THE BOMB OFF"
THEY HAD TO SUPRISE HIM, PART OF THAT WAS NOT GIVING HIM A FEW MOMENTS NOTICE
BUT AS I SAID THE OFFICERS DID NOT DO ANYTHING WRONG AS THEY ONLY ACTED UPON THE INTELIGENCE THEY WAS GIVE AND THATS WHAT THEY HAVE TO WORK WITH !!!!!!!
all this bollox about my uncles sisster dog sitters best mates boyfriend one spoke to a so19 officer balh blah blah, they treated em harsh bullshite
they done nothing wrong , they have usd this to hide the true fact that the police commisioner LIED to the public and nothing was done about that !!!!!
the poor bloke was inocent but at the time there was no way of knowing as they was told he had a bomb,,,,,,,,,, him living in the same building is not justifacation to kill him,,,,,,,,,, him having a ork permit expire isnt either ffs
WHY WOULD THE PILICE ASK A MAN THERE ABOUT TO SHOOT POINT BLANK IN THE HEAD IN ORDER SO HE DONT DETINATE A FUCKING BOMB
" OI MAN WITH THE BOMB STOP SO WE CAN SHOOT YOU BEFORE YOU LET THE BOMB OFF"
THEY HAD TO SUPRISE HIM, PART OF THAT WAS NOT GIVING HIM A FEW MOMENTS NOTICE
BUT AS I SAID THE OFFICERS DID NOT DO ANYTHING WRONG AS THEY ONLY ACTED UPON THE INTELIGENCE THEY WAS GIVE AND THATS WHAT THEY HAVE TO WORK WITH !!!!!!!
all this bollox about my uncles sisster dog sitters best mates boyfriend one spoke to a so19 officer balh blah blah, they treated em harsh bullshite
they done nothing wrong , they have usd this to hide the true fact that the police commisioner LIED to the public and nothing was done about that !!!!!
the poor bloke was inocent but at the time there was no way of knowing as they was told he had a bomb,,,,,,,,,, him living in the same building is not justifacation to kill him,,,,,,,,,, him having a ork permit expire isnt either ffs
17-07-2006, 10:42 PM
#55
Breathe Ginge....
How would u know what actual events tookplce at the station/ on the train? were u on the train? No! Have u read it in a paper? Yes! No-one will really know what went on...except those involved...
Imagine if they had let him go and blow up the underground?...Christ more fatalities
London got hit by 3 bombs. Th armed police made sure the number didn't increase....
How would u know what actual events tookplce at the station/ on the train? were u on the train? No! Have u read it in a paper? Yes! No-one will really know what went on...except those involved...
Imagine if they had let him go and blow up the underground?...Christ more fatalities
London got hit by 3 bombs. Th armed police made sure the number didn't increase....
17-07-2006, 10:49 PM
#56
just finding my feet
smit i NEVER said they done anything wrong ,,,,,,,, seriously i agree they done there job veyr well apart from the bloke cant shoot straight point blank
im going by the events that caused the enquiry and also by the info we was told ON THE DAY and then the following day about him being inocent but he jumped the barrier,,,,,,,, about him withdrawing cash before he got on the train what was that for,,,,,,,,,, bribe st peter at the gate or somink, why would a man whos about to die draw out cash
i wastch the program on tv as i DONT read papers as i can never be bothered
i did how ever hear what happened on the train at the first hearing
the 1 person following then the break of radio coms so then they follow and the man stands up, shouts there he is, taclkes him to the ground and shoots 11 times and hits him 7 in the head and once in the shoulder,,,,,,,, res on the floor
the officers DONE NOTHING WRONG BUT TRY TO SAVE PEOPLE !!!!! and i wont change my agreement on that !!!
but i wont ever say the bloke deserved to die when he obviously never done anything wrong !!!!
im going by the events that caused the enquiry and also by the info we was told ON THE DAY and then the following day about him being inocent but he jumped the barrier,,,,,,,, about him withdrawing cash before he got on the train what was that for,,,,,,,,,, bribe st peter at the gate or somink, why would a man whos about to die draw out cash
i wastch the program on tv as i DONT read papers as i can never be bothered
i did how ever hear what happened on the train at the first hearing
the 1 person following then the break of radio coms so then they follow and the man stands up, shouts there he is, taclkes him to the ground and shoots 11 times and hits him 7 in the head and once in the shoulder,,,,,,,, res on the floor
the officers DONE NOTHING WRONG BUT TRY TO SAVE PEOPLE !!!!! and i wont change my agreement on that !!!
but i wont ever say the bloke deserved to die when he obviously never done anything wrong !!!!
17-07-2006, 11:02 PM
#57
Too many posts.. I need a life!!
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Exeter
Posts: 541
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Originally Posted by b19bal
there was a program on brought about to tell the truth what happened and it was the reason why the independant commsision was brought into place
btw they DI NOT WANT THERE HELP AND THE INVEIGATED THEM SELVE FIRST AND DICOVERED ALL WAS WELL,,,,,,,,,,,
btw they DI NOT WANT THERE HELP AND THE INVEIGATED THEM SELVE FIRST AND DICOVERED ALL WAS WELL,,,,,,,,,,,
There has not been an independant commision. Evert death where the Police are involved or is a serious incident gets refered to the Independant Police Complaints Commission for investigation.
The incident is a bit more complex than you have described and it appears the Police on the day made numerous mistakes.
It appears the block of flats were under surveillance by a Police / Army team. At some point deMenezes leaves the block of flats and is mistaken as one of the targets.
The surveillance team follow and call upon some armed back up. Unfortunately the armed team do not arrive until deMenezes has entered Stockwell tube station and onto the platform. When deMenezes left the flat there has been a radio message from the surveillance team to the operations room about a "possible suspect" being sighted. This messgae gets misenterprated as "the suspect" and passed to the firearms team. Apart from the description of deMenezes and the information he is a suspect followed froma target address they have no more information about him.
Now bearing in mind the events of the previous day think about whats going on in the minds of the firearms team as they arrive at Stockwell tube station.
As they reach the platform deMenezes is on the train. The instructions they have from their training in regards to suicide bombers is to shoot to kill. You cannot shoot to disarm him or challenge him and tell him to stop etc. He has to be shot.
So because of a chain of events and mistakes by probably a number of people an innocent bloke has been killed. Very unfortunate but certainly not murder.
17-07-2006, 11:07 PM
#58
just finding my feet
the main part i was attempting to get across was HE NEVER RAN OR REFUSED TO STOP !!!!
not to mention he was totally inocent !!!!!
aswell as the officer who shot him was not guilty of a crime either anyway but doing as he is trained to !!!!!
not to mention he was totally inocent !!!!!
aswell as the officer who shot him was not guilty of a crime either anyway but doing as he is trained to !!!!!
17-07-2006, 11:13 PM
#60
just finding my feet
i dont have a issue with with what they done tbh
i just dont see how a senior officer can blaitantly lie and make up stories to make the ENTIRE CONTRY blame the poor bloke who done nothing wrong and get away wth it
let alone vote that tosser ken livingstone into being mayor,,,,,, but ill start another post about that
i just dont see how a senior officer can blaitantly lie and make up stories to make the ENTIRE CONTRY blame the poor bloke who done nothing wrong and get away wth it
let alone vote that tosser ken livingstone into being mayor,,,,,, but ill start another post about that
17-07-2006, 11:52 PM
#61
Brap!
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: N-Town
Posts: 5,214
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
If he'd been a suicide bomber and they hadnt acted and he'd killed a shit load of people you'd be the exact same people saying the police should of acted sooner should have shot him blah blah blah.
You think the cops involved took the decision to shoot him lightly? When they shot him they believed 100% that he was a suicide bomber.
It would of been a fucking disgrace if anyone had been found guilty because of this.
You think the cops involved took the decision to shoot him lightly? When they shot him they believed 100% that he was a suicide bomber.
It would of been a fucking disgrace if anyone had been found guilty because of this.
17-07-2006, 11:58 PM
#62
PassionFord Post Whore!!
Originally Posted by b19bal
smit i NEVER said they done anything wrong ,,,,,,,, seriously i agree they done there job veyr well apart from the bloke cant shoot straight point blank
Originally Posted by b19bal
i just dont see how a senior officer can blaitantly lie and make up stories to make the ENTIRE CONTRY blame the poor bloke who done nothing wrong and get away wth it
The Police fucked up big and got the wrong bloke, but at least they are showing they mean business against these bastards.
PS Ginge, Sort your spelling out, my dog could type better
18-07-2006, 12:59 AM
#63
Ive not bothered reading all of the replies, as some are like fucking novels!!
Someone said about they took more than 1 shot, 1 shot isnt enough imo, It can only put them to the ground and stun then maybe kill, (all depends on where and what type of round it is) but not instantly, If i was under the impression that someone else could have been out there with a bag full of explosives, and a man ran due to being asked to 'stop', And my command was to get them down I would put a few rounds in them....
Sounds harsh, But then thats life, He had something to hide, Looked liked he could have been a suspect, He ran and it cost him his life
Shit, But then if 3 suicide bombers hadn't done what they done he would still be alive...
Someone said about they took more than 1 shot, 1 shot isnt enough imo, It can only put them to the ground and stun then maybe kill, (all depends on where and what type of round it is) but not instantly, If i was under the impression that someone else could have been out there with a bag full of explosives, and a man ran due to being asked to 'stop', And my command was to get them down I would put a few rounds in them....
Sounds harsh, But then thats life, He had something to hide, Looked liked he could have been a suspect, He ran and it cost him his life
Shit, But then if 3 suicide bombers hadn't done what they done he would still be alive...
18-07-2006, 07:21 AM
#64
Advanced PassionFord User
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Beds
Posts: 2,376
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Doubt anyone would have been killed on that day, IF some extremist religous nutters hadnt murdered British citizens by blowing themselves to bits the day before or whenever 
If his permit to work had run out why was he still here, ok you used the argument about tourists that come here without anything, but they LEAVE when ther holiday over ! Did he not know when his permit run out
if he did and he wanted to stay and legally work in the country why had he not re-applied in good time for whatever they need to do to allow him to continue. IF he decided he no longer wanted to remain on British soil, why did he not leave when / BEFORE it finally expired
Ginge do you KNOW that the house he lived in was all "seperated" internally as you saying, or are you saying "some" London houses are like this, BET the Police DID know what type house it was
The Police had their reasons for "suspecting" him, we aint talking bout some arsey copper that pulls you over for doing 31mph, this a little bit more serious than that !
Why did he draw money out of a bank ? wouldnt of if he was gonna go blow himself up would he ? Wouldnt he, maybe he needed to go pay for some bombs/detonators whatever, basically MAYBE he needed the money to make his mission possible. "seal a deal"
There is arguments to everything BOTH ways
NOBODY HERE knows any of these answers, and NEVER will, some of us will get our info from 1 paper saying one thing others from another paper, oh and Ginge wil get his from the telly, which will obviously be the best as we can all rely on the TV, not to lie to as AT ALL
Was he innocent or not ? That NOT the question here, Did the officer/s that pulled the trigger "BELIEVE" he was a bomber or not is the question, and you can believe 110% that they did. They would have been told from above by the men that give them their orders who have done the investigations, the men that they "TRUST WITH THEIR LIVES" that he WAS.
IF these men made mistakes it is these men that should be being investigated not the blokes doing the best they could in what could only be described (due to my first statement) as VERY TENSE situation.
How many times have our armies and soldiers, pilots, sailors acted on commands from "ABOVE" and marched, flown, sailed to their deaths due to incorrect intellegence
Feel sorry for the families involved if an innocent man died, feel for the families if a guilty man died as not their fault either way
Also feel for the officers involved for doing what they had to and then getting more problems to worry about, you can believe they will feel bad enough as it is but then to get tarnished as murderers just aint right, they were doing the job they were trained to do.
If im at work trying to fix a broken machine and in doing so I break something else that makes it unrepairable do I deserve sacking for trying to do what I am meant to do, is it my fault the metal was suffering from fattigue and when I applied pressure to something, another piece failed, that couldve of course caused more catastrophic damage at a latter date anyway
I'll stick to my first statement that if some extremists hadnt decided to kill British and whatever races and cultures happened to be on the tubes and buses on the 7th then "probably" the lad shot wouldnt have been shot dead on that day ! The authorities would have felt they had more time to continue "just investigating" rather than feeling they "had to" do something So it is the extremists that are the ones who are guilty of this lads death as well as all the others they took
My 2 penneth
Steve
If his permit to work had run out why was he still here, ok you used the argument about tourists that come here without anything, but they LEAVE when ther holiday over ! Did he not know when his permit run out
if he did and he wanted to stay and legally work in the country why had he not re-applied in good time for whatever they need to do to allow him to continue. IF he decided he no longer wanted to remain on British soil, why did he not leave when / BEFORE it finally expired Ginge do you KNOW that the house he lived in was all "seperated" internally as you saying, or are you saying "some" London houses are like this, BET the Police DID know what type house it was
The Police had their reasons for "suspecting" him, we aint talking bout some arsey copper that pulls you over for doing 31mph, this a little bit more serious than that !
Why did he draw money out of a bank ? wouldnt of if he was gonna go blow himself up would he ? Wouldnt he, maybe he needed to go pay for some bombs/detonators whatever, basically MAYBE he needed the money to make his mission possible. "seal a deal"
There is arguments to everything BOTH ways
NOBODY HERE knows any of these answers, and NEVER will, some of us will get our info from 1 paper saying one thing others from another paper, oh and Ginge wil get his from the telly, which will obviously be the best as we can all rely on the TV, not to lie to as AT ALL
Was he innocent or not ? That NOT the question here, Did the officer/s that pulled the trigger "BELIEVE" he was a bomber or not is the question, and you can believe 110% that they did. They would have been told from above by the men that give them their orders who have done the investigations, the men that they "TRUST WITH THEIR LIVES" that he WAS.
IF these men made mistakes it is these men that should be being investigated not the blokes doing the best they could in what could only be described (due to my first statement) as VERY TENSE situation.
How many times have our armies and soldiers, pilots, sailors acted on commands from "ABOVE" and marched, flown, sailed to their deaths due to incorrect intellegence
Feel sorry for the families involved if an innocent man died, feel for the families if a guilty man died as not their fault either way
Also feel for the officers involved for doing what they had to and then getting more problems to worry about, you can believe they will feel bad enough as it is but then to get tarnished as murderers just aint right, they were doing the job they were trained to do.
If im at work trying to fix a broken machine and in doing so I break something else that makes it unrepairable do I deserve sacking for trying to do what I am meant to do, is it my fault the metal was suffering from fattigue and when I applied pressure to something, another piece failed, that couldve of course caused more catastrophic damage at a latter date anyway
I'll stick to my first statement that if some extremists hadnt decided to kill British and whatever races and cultures happened to be on the tubes and buses on the 7th then "probably" the lad shot wouldnt have been shot dead on that day ! The authorities would have felt they had more time to continue "just investigating" rather than feeling they "had to" do something
So it is the extremists that are the ones who are guilty of this lads death as well as all the others they took My 2 penneth
Steve
18-07-2006, 07:31 AM
#65
PassionFord Post Troll
b19 bal 
remember people, he was not asked to stop. he was wearing a light denim jacket. he didn't jump the barrier. seven shots to the head.
Now what was his job? Oh yeah, electrician. What were the initial reports on 7/7? Power surges. Maybe he was the man who knew too much?
remember people, he was not asked to stop. he was wearing a light denim jacket. he didn't jump the barrier. seven shots to the head.
Now what was his job? Oh yeah, electrician. What were the initial reports on 7/7? Power surges. Maybe he was the man who knew too much?
18-07-2006, 08:11 AM
#66
PassionFord Post Whore!!
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 4,431
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Graham mate, as I explained to you a while ago there was nothing dodgey about 7/7 at all.
The fact was that 4 religious nutters set bombs off on the london underground.
No freemasons.
No alterior motives.
I've heard so much bullshit about "Demedez was sacrificed by the old bill as some peace offering!" lol.
Wrong place. Wrong Time. Bad intelligence. That's all it was.
The fact was that 4 religious nutters set bombs off on the london underground.
No freemasons.
No alterior motives.
I've heard so much bullshit about "Demedez was sacrificed by the old bill as some peace offering!" lol.
Wrong place. Wrong Time. Bad intelligence. That's all it was.
18-07-2006, 08:16 AM
#67
PassionFord Post Troll
did I mention Freemasons?
If it's such an open and shut case, why aren't people receiving compensation and insurance?
And whats your view on the 21/7 happenings?
If it's such an open and shut case, why aren't people receiving compensation and insurance?
And whats your view on the 21/7 happenings?
18-07-2006, 08:22 AM
#68
PassionFord Post Whore!!
Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 4,431
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I just said that as an example of what people have been saying - not saying you said anything about that!
7/7 was a mad day. DaveEscCos on here can varify that I was getting news reports an hour before the media - so I knew exactly what was going on well before the news.
The innitial reports about power surges where reported to the media from "Joe Everyman".
As for insurance claims everyone on here can tell you how long insurance payouts take..
7/7 was a mad day. DaveEscCos on here can varify that I was getting news reports an hour before the media - so I knew exactly what was going on well before the news.
The innitial reports about power surges where reported to the media from "Joe Everyman".
As for insurance claims everyone on here can tell you how long insurance payouts take..
18-07-2006, 08:26 AM
#69
PassionFord Post Troll
Re: Police another murder they get away with
Originally Posted by charlie luciano
As I predicted no charges are to be brought against bacon officers for the stockwell whacking
Goes to show best off staying out the way from police as they can kill you and get away with it even if ya innocent
C L
Goes to show best off staying out the way from police as they can kill you and get away with it
even if ya innocent C L
The police should not be procecuted. They did their job. They could not take the risk.
It is unfortunate, but it was his actions that got him shot.
18-07-2006, 08:30 AM
#70
PassionFord Post Troll
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: Wolverhampton
Posts: 3,058
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I tell what is truely wrong.
When people risk their own lives to protect people by jumping on someone they know could be packed with explosives.
And because they were working on the wrong intelligence they are refered to as murdering cunts by the general public.
Terrorism is one thing, poor police intelligence is another, but it's the childish mob mentality of this country that truely scares me.
When people risk their own lives to protect people by jumping on someone they know could be packed with explosives.
And because they were working on the wrong intelligence they are refered to as murdering cunts by the general public.
Terrorism is one thing, poor police intelligence is another, but it's the childish mob mentality of this country that truely scares me.
18-07-2006, 08:35 AM
#71
As Si T has said reall, was a tragic accident imho. The officers were not really in the wrong tbh. As for all this "he deserved to get shot because his work permit had ran out" crap. No he didn't.
The rantings about immigrants that are always on this forum are racist I am afraid, look closer to home for the reasons we have a benifits problem. The laws we have setup in this country are preventing loads of skilled immigrants doing what they came here to do, work! There are very few immigrants in this country who just want to sit around claiming benefits, certainly less than the amount of fuckers who were born here who just dont fancy working! And they ain't "stealing our jobs" either, we still have a massive void of jobs to fill in the UK, from the totally unskilled ones that noone wants to do to the highly skilled ones that we don't have enough people to do.
This country was built on immigrants, the relatives of some of those early immigrants are on these very forums. They came here to work back then, same as they do now, just now there are a bunch of bullshit laws to make it very hard for them
Maybe certain people on here should remember that next time they go for a kebab / curry / chinese / a operation / dentist / optiction etc etc
The rantings about immigrants that are always on this forum are racist I am afraid, look closer to home for the reasons we have a benifits problem. The laws we have setup in this country are preventing loads of skilled immigrants doing what they came here to do, work! There are very few immigrants in this country who just want to sit around claiming benefits, certainly less than the amount of fuckers who were born here who just dont fancy working! And they ain't "stealing our jobs" either, we still have a massive void of jobs to fill in the UK, from the totally unskilled ones that noone wants to do to the highly skilled ones that we don't have enough people to do.
This country was built on immigrants, the relatives of some of those early immigrants are on these very forums. They came here to work back then, same as they do now, just now there are a bunch of bullshit laws to make it very hard for them
Maybe certain people on here should remember that next time they go for a kebab / curry / chinese / a operation / dentist / optiction etc etc
18-07-2006, 09:35 AM
#72
Too many posts.. I need a life!!
Join Date: Oct 2003
Location: Surrey
Posts: 648
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
OMG, what a bunch of ignorant muppets we have on here.
Get your facts right!!!
Fuck, its embarrassing how WRONG and UNINFORMED so many of your can be!!!
For the record... HE WAS NOT ASKED TO STOP. HE NEVER RAN. HE DID NOT JUMP OVER THE TICKET GATE.
Those are facts.
He emerged from some flats that were under surveillance.
He was wearing jeans and a light denim jacket.
Police thought he may look like a suspect so plain clothes officers were told to follow him.
He walked to the bus stop. He boarded a bus. He got off at Stockwell tube, stopped to pickup a free Metro newspaper, and paid at the ticket barrier using his Oyster card. He descended esculator calmly. He got on the tube and sat down. He was almost certainly unaware that he was even being followed at this point.
Plain clothes officers boarded the tube and challenged him, holding him down in the seat. He was shot 7 times in the head and once in the shoulder. 3 bullets missed.
Police intelligence chiefs / government, or those giving orders should be charged and convicted IMO. Officers involved directly, if they followed correct proceedure, should not be charged.
Media and Police should be held accountable for so much mis-information, hence the reason why non of you guys actually seem to know what really happened. (apart from B19bal!).
steve
Get your facts right!!!
-- Is this the one that ran away from the coppers? and got shot a few times in the head?
-- If an armed Police Officer says to you STOP... do you not agree it is fucking stupid to ignore them and run ???
-- fair play.. shouldnt have run should he
-- Shit happens, bloke should have stopped.
-- It was silly of him to run, just made him look guilty.
-- He runs, you think 'FUCK' you start to shoot,
-- Terror suspects have to be terminated.
-- he was told to stop, and didn't. As I understand it, and if I'm wrong please correct me, he was told to stop by armed Police on more than one occasion and failed to do so.
-- He ran away, coppers had no option.
-- And as said before, he should not have run from the police.
-- he was ordered to stop, he didn't so he paid the highest price.
-- If he had nothing to hide then why did he run ???
-- did he have a reason to run , we will never know
-- The guy has to take some of the blame for running!!
-- he should have stopped. End of.
-- he should have stopped when told to by the police, simple as that, he gave the police more than just cause to chase him
-- He ran and it cost him his life
-- when asked to stop, decided to run.
-- If an armed Police Officer says to you STOP... do you not agree it is fucking stupid to ignore them and run ???
-- fair play.. shouldnt have run should he
-- Shit happens, bloke should have stopped.
-- It was silly of him to run, just made him look guilty.
-- He runs, you think 'FUCK' you start to shoot,
-- Terror suspects have to be terminated.
-- he was told to stop, and didn't. As I understand it, and if I'm wrong please correct me, he was told to stop by armed Police on more than one occasion and failed to do so.
-- He ran away, coppers had no option.
-- And as said before, he should not have run from the police.
-- he was ordered to stop, he didn't so he paid the highest price.
-- If he had nothing to hide then why did he run ???
-- did he have a reason to run , we will never know
-- The guy has to take some of the blame for running!!
-- he should have stopped. End of.
-- he should have stopped when told to by the police, simple as that, he gave the police more than just cause to chase him
-- He ran and it cost him his life
-- when asked to stop, decided to run.
Fuck, its embarrassing how WRONG and UNINFORMED so many of your can be!!!
For the record... HE WAS NOT ASKED TO STOP. HE NEVER RAN. HE DID NOT JUMP OVER THE TICKET GATE.
Those are facts.
He emerged from some flats that were under surveillance.
He was wearing jeans and a light denim jacket.
Police thought he may look like a suspect so plain clothes officers were told to follow him.
He walked to the bus stop. He boarded a bus. He got off at Stockwell tube, stopped to pickup a free Metro newspaper, and paid at the ticket barrier using his Oyster card. He descended esculator calmly. He got on the tube and sat down. He was almost certainly unaware that he was even being followed at this point.
Plain clothes officers boarded the tube and challenged him, holding him down in the seat. He was shot 7 times in the head and once in the shoulder. 3 bullets missed.
Police intelligence chiefs / government, or those giving orders should be charged and convicted IMO. Officers involved directly, if they followed correct proceedure, should not be charged.
Media and Police should be held accountable for so much mis-information, hence the reason why non of you guys actually seem to know what really happened. (apart from B19bal!).
steve
18-07-2006, 05:48 PM
#74
just finding my feet
i just think nobody is reading what happened here and some people here seem to think I belive the officers done wrong
7 times in the head seems harsh, but tbh he was dead aftter 3 and i can understand the panic a FUCKING BRAVE officer too to jump on the bloke who he belived had a bomb and kill him,, sooooo many of us "heros" would have stopped at the barrier incase the worst happened,,,,,,, them officers never and so they made sure they seen there family that night
sory but i dont blame them for that at all !!!!
he done nothing wrong though and was killed by accident and the people we rely on to protect us lied to cover up there fuck ups and make a incoent man seem like he gave reason to be accidently killed ,,,,,, that was the part i feel is wrong and thats what im against !!!!
i dont do conspriocy theorys anymore,,,,,,,,,, dont mean i dont belive about the free masons !!!!!
but i dont belive a peace killing bolloxs
7 times in the head seems harsh, but tbh he was dead aftter 3 and i can understand the panic a FUCKING BRAVE officer too to jump on the bloke who he belived had a bomb and kill him,, sooooo many of us "heros" would have stopped at the barrier incase the worst happened,,,,,,, them officers never and so they made sure they seen there family that night
sory but i dont blame them for that at all !!!!
he done nothing wrong though and was killed by accident and the people we rely on to protect us lied to cover up there fuck ups and make a incoent man seem like he gave reason to be accidently killed ,,,,,, that was the part i feel is wrong and thats what im against !!!!
i dont do conspriocy theorys anymore,,,,,,,,,, dont mean i dont belive about the free masons !!!!!
but i dont belive a peace killing bolloxs
18-07-2006, 06:02 PM
#75
.
Join Date: May 2004
Location: .
Posts: 6,373
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I'd much rather live in a world where the police aren't scared to shoot someone whom they feel is a threat to many..
Bad intelligence or not..as above..if he had have been a suicide bomber..and they hadn't shot..there'd have just been a different ''poll''.
Had the police have been individually charged for this the remaining armed officers would be too scared to shoot the next ''suspect'' in case he was another innocent electrician...this sets a president that we won't punish officers on a manslaughter charge for attempting to protect society..
The police will never win over every single sceptic or shake off every single bad view..by the same token they won't ever make 100% accurate decisions, they are humans..
At the end of the day the shoot to kill policy is the only option in the case of terrorists..what's the point of shooting him in the knees so then he can just set off his explosives anyway?
A great mistake, I feel for the family. Bad communications..horrible accident..but could have been so much worse...
Bad intelligence or not..as above..if he had have been a suicide bomber..and they hadn't shot..there'd have just been a different ''poll''.
Had the police have been individually charged for this the remaining armed officers would be too scared to shoot the next ''suspect'' in case he was another innocent electrician...this sets a president that we won't punish officers on a manslaughter charge for attempting to protect society..
The police will never win over every single sceptic or shake off every single bad view..by the same token they won't ever make 100% accurate decisions, they are humans..
At the end of the day the shoot to kill policy is the only option in the case of terrorists..what's the point of shooting him in the knees so then he can just set off his explosives anyway?
A great mistake, I feel for the family. Bad communications..horrible accident..but could have been so much worse...
18-07-2006, 06:07 PM
#76
just finding my feet
A great mistake, I feel for the family. Bad communications meant the man ran away ''needlessly'' and such instigated the chase which resulted in his death. Horrible accident..but could have been so much worse...
18-07-2006, 06:10 PM
#77
.
Join Date: May 2004
Location: .
Posts: 6,373
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
I edited ginge...I haven't read any comprehensive reports on it..so was trying to comment on the idea of shooting someone ''suspect''..I can't help but think if it was me with the gun..I'd have shot..
18-07-2006, 06:20 PM
#79
just finding my feet
Originally Posted by Lee Reynolds
Totally agree...Police have enough restraints as it is....Glad they didnt get done
and katie tbh i can honestly say hand on heart that i would NOT have shot the man,,,,,,,,,,, and i KNOW i would never have ran down the tube station to attack a man that could have killed me and i would have prob stood back and made a discrace of the police department for being a coward
i would have atleast made a second thought about risking my own life,,,,,,, them officers never and we need people JUST LIKE THAT protecting my family from harm
18-07-2006, 06:37 PM
#80
Advanced PassionFord User
more cheap labour .thanks to tony blair
the next time they don't shoot someone dead and a bomb or whatever goes off and kills a load of people,i bet the complaints come in saying they should have killed them. he shouldn't have been here,so made himself a suspect.