TIFF

So would an injector failure be the fitter fault too?????????

Ian M500COS

Rene......she will kill you...then revive you and kill you again if a cheap headgasket turns your head into something that looks like the surface of the moon! Ask my missus...who I am currently communicating with through a peacekeeper!!!

JAP CRAP

Ian. You should do stand up mate

IMA, I can see this cossie rebuild of yours being fun

Rene

true there Ian ROFLOL

soz to hear what happend to you car mate

Ima-Racing500

Fitting a Cometic or a WRC gasket is not as easy as you may think BTW i am not saying Tiff didnt have a faulty one..i am saying on other occasions a crap fitter can not be ruled out.

Tiff....like i say even Rainbird could fit an injector....with the help of someone who knows what they are doing ROFL.

Fitting an injector incorrectly will just leak..thus not a injector fault...but you can fit a head gasket wrong particulary these multi layer seperate firewall ones

Rene

please tell me why it wouldnt be that easy? (to fit a gasket) as I dont see how that would be difficult? (i always want it 100% perfect so dont do whack it on and back with the head)

Ima-Racing500

Making sure the gasket doesnt move when putting the head on...you can of course use the ford tool to make that not happen..but that dont mean the seperate fire rings cant move to an incorrect position.

Rene

yeah ok but i got that covered

Disabled Account

Phil,

Believe me, wire "O" rings are LESS fiddly!

Yes, you need to take care to position the O rings initially, then place the ultra cheap standard late spec Escort Cos h/gasket on top, then the head on and clamp down - job done - And THEY WORK.........not cause I said so, because Karl & Paul Bailey said so

AD-RS1600i

[quote="Ima-Racing500"]There is NOTHING wrong with cometic gaskets
[quote]

your car never went anywhere though, let alone got near to getting a thrashing on a rolling road or trackday to properly test it

Sorry, Ima couldn't resist

Stavros

Why in fookin gods name do you want to run a T34? Mega heat and mega boost just to get yourself 400bhp.

A properly specced T4 setup will have just as big a powerband and far more power.

Waste of a perfectly good 8inj RS500 inlet to run a poofy T34 IMO too.

Its an RS500, RS500s have T4s, not T34s.

Ive heard of a tuner doing this to customers RS500s before many moons ago, but i reckon that was jus to make some money and get a nice big T4 for the collection, lol

RS500/364

the T4 is in my garage
AND ITS NOT JUST THE T4 THAT MAKES A RS500 IS IT
THE BLOCK HEAD BUMPER AND THE LIST GOES ON
OR I COULD PUT THE T4 ON MY SAFF AND CALL IT A 500 BUT WE KNOW IT ANT

Zzz...Zzz

I'm just beeing curious as we have only good experience with the comtic ones.

What is the reason for that a mountune gasket would not do the same damage as the cometic one did when it blew?
And as a general rule , the headgasket (steel ones) only let go if there is something wrong, a bad plug, 1 injector not flowing properly..and so on..

Rene

From what i understood is that the gasket had an design error which only could been seen with the car runningn

TIFF

The car was never even fired up, the coolent was poured in and it leaked from the side of the block

RS500/364

right so i need to look at the side of the block as the car is back today?
turbo side or ? was this sorted by them ?
signs to look for i may well get the wrc 1 but when armed sorts the car out as he needs it for a week to fit the loom and stuff

Ian M

if the engine never ran how did the gasket damage your head and block?

TIFF

The gasket damaged the head and block from where it was torqued down when it was rebuilt. You could not see the fault until the 3 layer gasket was taken apart, then it was VERY plain to see

I wouldnt run the risk TBH

Rs Gus

iTrader: (2)

no ian that was just your engine advantages engine

Rs Gus

iTrader: (2)

oh and l6 can run big injectors ask kenny@msd or tib

markk

iTrader: (2)

i have to agree here , ok so there may have been one failure that seams to have been a manufacturing fault , but come on how many are in use worldwide ??

tiff i feel for you because it happened to you , and i would be the same , but i wouldnt say that they were all shite full stop


im sorry but t his is seriously 'budjet' and thats that , wire ringing the block is just arrgggggggggghhhhhh crap , they dont last if your using the car properly at all , and thats from using lots of them as goes for the grp a gasket - just all inferior (tempory) measures of sealing the head to the block


i take it you had a high comp engine above this ratio ian ?? judging by this statment ???

so what happened to it ???

or was it somat to do with this ???


all seams a little strange , and the fact that alot of cometic gaskets are being blamed when from what ive seen of the evidence , non are to blame

just annoys me that a product is slated to death because of poss one bad item ???

mark

Disabled Account

Markk, not just one bad item, I have heard of/seen others!

Sib (Simon) had very similar problems!

Stavros

GT35 running 28psi on a 9:1 (i think) engine running a Cometic. Head gasket blew the first time car came on boost on test drive.

Fixed.

Second time road tested, 1st time on boost, 2secs later, rod came thru block...

TIFF

Mark

You right mate, my gasket was probably a one off and i was VERY unlucky. I know that 99.9% of them are probably fine but i would not use one again...........ever

I FUCKING HATE COMETIC GASKETS but feel free to use one if you want

markk

iTrader: (2)

and you have seen these and proved that the fault WAS the gasket ????

i have also seen blown cometic gaskets but wouldnt defo say that the fault was the gaskets - i think there are other issues that people are missin out on that im not going to go on about here !!


same again really steve , was it rebuilt same specs and same gasket ?? (but new )

suggest to me there were other issues here ?


ik not sticking up for cometic or anything like that just seeing products/manufactures being slated for non justified reasons , i mean , we could go on wit unsubstanciated claims about every product / manufacturer / slaes person / company on here couldnt we

Stavros

no idea of the faults or reasons, i got no issues with cometic gaskets, thought they were good, jus were trying to answer your questions

markk

iTrader: (2)

once bitten and all that - fully understand that m8

i have been - and quite for some time m8

markk

iTrader: (2)

TIFF

Jammy coont

Rs Gus

iTrader: (2)

me and my bro use cometic gaskets and have had no probs at all my m8 had a mountune wrc one fail on him wouldnt say it was te gaskets fault because his new gasket has been fine and ians engine what can i say

J
O
K
E

Rs Gus

iTrader: (2)

AND I REMEMBER YOU TELLING MY M8 WE HAD BIULT HIS LOW COMP 7.2-1 ENGINE WRONG AND WASTED HIS MONEY BUT HEY HIS IS STILL GOING 4 YEARS ON @400 PLUS HORSE IS YOURS???????






















































ERRRRRRRRRRRRRR NO

Ian M500COS

I stand corrected then! And a lot poorer!

Nowt wrong with high comp..... but with smaller turbo's and controlled boost at high rpm!!

Fastmaul

I don't understand the high comp ratios with some of you guys?? Is it only the Cossie engines that don't like it? My tuner has built several high HP XR's and NONE of them had/has low comp pistons. His car's also 548@the wheels now drives it 1 1/2 hours to the track races and then drives home, and he's doing 11's flat. I guess it's different over here in the US then??

Stavros

Its funny, most/all big bhp turbo engines in the US seem to claim to have really high compression.

Unless yall on race fuel, i dont really get it, unless you measure it differently, or lie, lol.

Then again most Jap turbo cars over here claim high comp, but they prob all as all get pussied around on low boost and only run at anywhere near full power when on race fuel.

Lots of tuners like to claim or drop hints of high-comp (without giving the number out) when they not actually running high comp, wether its to show off, or throw others off the scent, i dunno.

Austrailia and NZ are generally more realistic, almost all the BIG power turbo cars ive ever seen details of, be them European, Oz, or Jap origin, have compression ratios youd expect for that boost pressure, power per litre, and fuel type if you were comparing them to your average cossie.

Most the "real" details of comp ratios ive seen on the mad scandinavian cars are similar to ours too, tho seen a few claiming high and TBH im sceptical.

What makes me think bullshat somtimes is comparing power graphs, some cars downunder with 6.5:1 or similarly mega low compression and it has no worse lowedown power than a similar specced car (say a jap car tuned in the UK) with a claimed 8.5:1 comp.

Comp ratio is a Karl/Stu type essay job i reckon, lol

Fastmaul

I can't really answer for any of the other turbo cars you speak of, but I Know for sure what comp pistons my tuner uses, even Rhys asked him about low comp pistons and he told him he doesn't use them (he thinks it's old school) Oh and that HP I quote was at 26lbs of boost.
I know, it's not a skyline so it can't be true..

Stavros

What fuel you using for say 26lb boost and "high-comp" (whatever that is)?
And is that 26psi HELD to the limiter, or a peak of 26psi dropping back as the revs rise?

Its not just internal pressures being to high, its det, on pump fuel, to not have det with high boost, youd need to run fuck all ignition, retarded loads, and theres more gains from lower comp and lots of ignition than there is high comp and retarded ignition.
On race fuel life is different as if FAR less suseptable to det/pre-ignition so can run higher comps and more advanced ignition without a problem.

BTW...
Your Skyline jokes are soooooooooo tired, esp as they not relavant as i think 99% of the Skyline tuning scene in the UK is total no nothing ripoff bullshit bollocks and i dont like em and dont have owt to do with em

And TBH almost all of what i said in the above post i was thinking of other cars rather than Skylines

RSrussell

[quote="Fastmaul"]oh really, what comp pistons does you tuner have I think you'll find you know the CR of the engine, or what type of pistons he uses, but to know the compression off a piston

Also your tuner uses an 8 valve head yeah, bit pointless in comparing then

Ian2wdsaffcos

You're forgetting Lee (TIB) ran this "budget" set-up for about 25,000miles with no problems & I don't think you could EVER accuse Lee of not using the car "properly" or not running high boost

Disabled Account

Good example Ian.....and I keep quoting the Paul Bailey car too - just about the fastest thing out there on trackdays, engine/head has not been out of Pauls car for 7 years, T4 + 32 PSI + loads of abuse.......and those budget "O" rings

Karl

What total nonsense that wire ringing is'nt effective markk!!!!! Wiring ringing IF done correctly is an excellent method of allowing increased cylinder pressures without head gasket failure.

As for high comp engines and high boost on a large turbo, ROFLOL!!!

Some people really are so short sighted!!!

It really is VERY simple engineering. I'm not going to quote figures here as it's not relevant,but put simply, we have to keep within certain cylinder pressures, dependant on the fuel type we use. This means that the C.R you use should be a function of the engine capacity, fuel type and power/torque@rpm.

This is how we determine the C.R we must use in our road cars.

Some people treat C.R as pub talk as if the higher the number the bigger your cock. Its laughable.

I'm happy to tell you that my cossie is 5.8:1, and there's good reason for it being so too! At just over 1800cc and 680bhp if it was'nt the cylinder pressures would require fuel with a far better resistance to detonation than can be bought from your local filling station. So far my engine has covered 15,000miles and been totally reliable. Now you know why!

Hope some of you can come out of the clouds and realise this!

High comp and BIG bhp on small capacity engines DOES NOT WORK reliably for road cars. END OF STORY