mattseries2

iTrader: (1)

Hi all!

I know this has probs come up loads of times before but been searchin the forum and cant really find anything up to date or very useful!

Can u lot who have done it tell me everything i need etc...??

Cheers

sean_rsts2

get yourself on oddkidds forum mate am pretty sure it tells u whats needed and what to do on there.

muz

Ring Jano, Matt, and tell him I sent you. 07984 071567. He'll sort you out.

muz

P.S. you might think it's cheaper and easier to source the parts yourself, but I would advice going direct to jano and buying from him. everything will be new, or tested, where as, from personal experience, half the stuff on eBay is shite, broken, blown up crap thats worthless. At least you know with janos stuff, IT WILL WORK.

mattseries2

iTrader: (1)

Thanks alot Muz ill give him a ring!

d4 rst

oddkidd is the man for you mate.

JokerDisco

iTrader: (4)

Not long finished putting cossie management on my S2.

Below I've tried to list as many things as possible (that I can remember anyway)

2wd cosworth Throttle body - linkage needs to be modified for accelorator cable
2wd cosworth ISCV
2wd cosworth loom
2wd cosworth Ignition amp & heat sink plate
Throttle switch pf09
3 bar map sensor
2wd cosworth ACT sensor & conversion to fit EFI Manifold
2wd cosworth Water Sensor & conversion to fit EFI manifold
2wd cosworthInjectors Yellow or blues
Level 6/8 or P8 ECU (L8 preferably)
Pectel board and chip
EFI Manifold from FRST - needs modification for 2wd throttle body
MFI adapter plate if using MFI standard head
FRST fuel rail
2wd cosworth fuel regulator
Mk5 escort fuel filter and bracket - will also need some braided hose and fittings
2wd cosworth crank sensor
2wd phase sensor
Bottom pulley and trigger ring - got mine from oddkidd
Phase sensor bracket and trigger ring - also available from oddkidd

It's not such a big job to convert - as stated some minor part modifications, bit of soldering and some patience.

Your looking at least 1500 quid for sourcing second hand parts, plus additional money for your pectel board and mapping.

Hope that helps

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

That is a lot of money for a 15year old ECU/loom and second hand parts!

You could have any number of brand new management systems for that, or if you can find someone local to map them there are far cheaper 'budget' options like Megasquirt, VEMS, Gotech etc... for around £700!!

EssexMikeSi

iTrader: (3)

Damn, didnt realise u needed to get a cossie fuel regulator, i thought i'd got that bit sorted when i got a frst fuel rail with its pressure regulator.

As said look tp spend about £1500, plus couple hundred more when u keep sourcing wrong parts like me lol.

JokerDisco

iTrader: (4)

You can use a fiesta fuel regulator but you wont be pushing anywhere near 200bhp. (assuming this is the main reason your going cossie management)

Obviously a 2wd cossie regulator will alllow increased fuel pressure as opposed to the fiesta reg

muz

yOu don't have to use a cossie FPR. FRST one will be fine.

muz

Janos complete package ready to bolt on and run is £1350 an you KNOW it will work.

JokerDisco

iTrader: (4)

Your right there mate, I went cossie managemnt route and to be honest I had a fair bit of hassle with it and contemplated fucking it off- but now its complete and running nigh on perfect - pretty much seeing bang on AFR and producing decent horsepower I'm glad I went down that route.

Cossie Management is old hat these days and something like Go-tech maybe more benefical if you not looking at doing the work yourself.

No matter who you ask about what management you should use, your always going to get a difference of opinion.

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

You dont mate the Fezzy one is fine!
Thats way off the mark fella, the fiesta regulator is fine for as much BHP as the cossie one or as any reg in fact, you only need to hold 3-3.5bar!
It's the injectors that you need to change when you reach their flow limit!

bad boy rs

iTrader: (7)

jamsport wouldnt map mine on dta with fiesta reg needed a cossy item

JokerDisco

iTrader: (4)

Exactly what I was told which is why I said you would need a Cos Fuel Reg.

Apologies if wrong but just going on personal experience as mine only made 177bhp with fiesta fuel reg. Pretty awful seen as it was running over 180bhp without the cos management

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

Strange.....a mate of mine has his car going on the rollers this Sunday that should be making over 250bhp with a Fezzy reg so we'll soon know! lol
But it's running a Stage 3 T3 (.48/55) at 25psi and the AFR's are spot on so I dont think there is a problem with the fuel pressure...... it would be lean and detonating

creator

i was told by a tuner you dont need to run a cossie fpr a frst is fine but the cossie one is just more stable at the top end.

studabear

does a cossie fpr fit direct to the fiesta fuel rail?

muz

Yeah it's a direct fit Stu. I kept to my FRST one as it's slightly smaller and the Cossie one fouled my throttle body. I will probably re-locate it this time.

mattseries2

iTrader: (1)

Thanks for your helps guys! Defo something im considering to do next purely because mfi is wank!

Muz - You seam to know alot about what Jano does...How much does he charge to suply and fit it all up?

studabear

About £450-£500 To fit,

sweetpea

is it defo a 2wd regulator required, loads of old lists said 4wd??

muz

As Stu said he charges about £450-500 drive in drive out depending on what extras you need.

EssexMikeSi

iTrader: (3)

Seems ive opened a can of worms asking about that fuel regulator. As a side note i'll be running green injectors (803's).

What about idle valve? are all cosworth ones the same, whether they're 2wd or 4x4? I noticed pattern ones being sold on ebay are listed as sapphire and escort cosworth, oh and ford mondeo lol.

Janos fitting price is a bargain imo. Alot of places would charge alot more than that. Thats why he deserves to do well as hes no way gready (spelling), and is also a top bloke who is full of knowlege, im always learning stuff from him whenever i go up there, and he takes the time to explain how things work etc.

muz

I only stuck with the FRST FPR as it was smaller but I have a cossie one here I will be relocating when I re build it.

I THINK the ISCV's are the same, but check with Jano.

Yeah Jano's a top bloke, never ripped me off, saved me alot of money telling me bits I didn't need to buy etc.

1223456

iscv is built into the cossy throttle body afaik and the frst is a seperate module bolted onto the side of the throttle body.

The fiesta fp-reg can be adjusted by removing the anti tamper bung and using an allen key with a gauge to adjust.

M-tech automotive can do everything including all the mapping for around th 1100 mark, this includes picking the car up i think, plus their latest ecu does pretty much everything and can be mapped by anyone with the capability to customise the interface. Megasquirt is pretty much the same but you need to make sure it has been built correctly.

Either way you will need to install a cps, the cossie management needs a cam sensor as well i think and its pretty limited to who can map it.

Gotech can run straight off the dizzy for crank position info but Ive heard people complaining about idling issue's, its more of an all out power ecu, not as refined for round town driving (so im told, ive never used it)

Ive converted to M-Tech V4, it has all the features I would ever need and shed loads that I wont even use (at no extra charge)

Ive yet to show the software to a mapper who says NO, im not mapping it and the price was unbeatable.

Speak to Matt @ M-tech or Simon @ sitech for more info, I know your after cossie management but it would not hurt to hear what other options ar available, especially when they do the same thing for half the price and in most case better as well

Hope this helps

Raj

muz

ISCV on the Cossie is indeed built into the throttle body but is removable. FRST idle valves are bolted onto the side of the inlet manifold on later cars, not TB and early cars had them mounted on the bulkhead, as did XR2i's.

1223456

well its not a million miles away,

cheers for the correction matey

Versus_Creations

iTrader: (1)

Hey Raj,

Thought id add a little..

Is the other management systems you spoke about offering a fully sequential system at that price. I guess not as you say that only the Weber setup (Cosworth) requires the cam sensor.

All the top cars running any engine use sequential management systems for a reason, if thats for top speed runs like Christian, or mapability like tonyturbo, track abuse like my own, or just an everyday drive with good low down idle and emssions throttle response etc..

Next is regarding the manifold and throttle setups and the crank sensor setup.

First the system you have spoken about, does this inclued a decent manifold like an EFi one with a decent throttle body like a cosworth one and also std type fitting fuel rail, regulator and injector placing as designed by Ford or any large costing CAD design?

How about the CPS setup? How do you go around this? Do you remove the flywheel and fit a 36-1 flywheel and drill the block or make something that has a pickup?

Some systems are very crude indeed where they have no idle valve fitted and requires the idle to be set via a bleed screw. I would guess again that the system you offer wouldnt be this crude.

Out of intrest what is the cost for the mapping to be done for these systems, is the charge less than the other systems on offer?

1223456

Is this Jano? who ever it is I will speak very carefully as I know I am in great danger of being shot down, my knowledge is very limited.

Firstl;y I dont offer any systems from my company, we do interiors and composites mainly.

Right here we go, as far as I know the v4 is fully sequential, gotech is either batch for the bottom of the range one, semi seq. for the gotech pro and fully for the mini pro x.

I was told by a&b garage in hawereden who are specialists in DTA that although the dta system i was looking at a while ago was fully sequential oncve it reaches the higher rpm's the ecu runs on batch as the engine is spinning so fast that there would be no gains power or economic to run full seq.

Im not to sure about how the v4 can be deq. without the cam sensor, but I know the gotech can use the dizzy rotor for the crank position.

The V4 uses the existing inlet so if its an escort it would be best to purchase a frst inlet, or a injector adaptor. The only way I know to get a crank sensor in the block is to get a fiesta one or machine a bose, but this is going to cost.

As for mapping, mtech offer an all in cost of £999 (est) which includes the parts, installation as well. CPR in warrington quoted me £400 for a full map for my car on v4, this is on a blank ecu as well which I thought was a very good price.

Emerald do their system with 3 maps, the cost is £250 for all three

Sitech again was around the £400. When I have looked into the cost of cossie management mapping sessions they are in excess of £500. And to add there are only a hand full of people who can do this.

I have gone for the v4 because it has loads of features with it such as boost control, launch control, anti lagg, switchable maps, etc etc. All the features you would associate with a full race ecu 3 times the price. With the cossie management features such as anti lag, full throttle launch etc etc are all extra's which people charge for.

I know my V4 it will never be as sophisticated as say a motec or autronic but for my lickle fiesta it should be more than enough.

Please understand that im learning myself, in all honesty, you have probably forgotten more than I will ever know about engine managements, mapping etc so please bare with me

Now, let me put my bullet proof vest on

s1cab

iTrader: (1)

ive had cossie management for 2years now also fitted by jano. im so happy with it and it completly transformed my car. I chose cossie management because u only have to look around and see how many cosworths are still driving around today with the same ecu. imo just because newer managment option's are available doesn't mean they're any better, but at the same time im sure some are more than capable of doing an amazing job.

EssexMikeSi

iTrader: (3)

Amonst other reasons, ive also chose cossie management as i admit my knowledge of engines etc is limited, im learning more and more everyday. So for this alone, with cossie management its all pretty much standard stuff that has basically just been slightly altered to work on a rs turbo cvh. Its easy to know about once you've learnt it and most tuners will know their way around a rs turbo engine bay and their way around a weber marelli system, but i also need'nt worry about other tuners as Jano is only half hour up the a12 from me and is always about to help and offer advice. So, in my case especially, its not necessarily about how good a system is, its about the customer aftercare if i ever had any problems. Plug in the monitor and it'll tel us whats wrong.

Also, and please correct me if im wrong but people who have experienced problems with cossie management not working properly- how have they sourced their parts? If they're being a bit tight fisted (none of us like to spend more money than we need do we), and they buy all 2nd hand parts such as sensors etc then obviously they're going to giv up the ghost after a while. But if like me, you buy the parts spread over a few months then you can buy all new sensors like the all important throttle position switch. Go on step further and you can lose the distributor and have the coil pack conversion, again something im doing. Places like motorsport developments supply all the sensors at very reasonable prices. Avoid Burtons or Ford and your onto a winner lol.