Anyone ever grafted in wishbones, inner wings etc from a Focus or Mk5 Escort or similar?
Wouldn't loosing the TCAs in favour of 3 locating points at the bottom end be good for big power Mk3/4s as it would make them a lot more stable under hard acceleration in particular...?

 

I'll take that as a no then?

 

Easier to put the powerful engine in a mk5?

 

ade what are you plotting now?

 

Theres got to be a way, and could be done with money, The FRS is a good handling car for a FWD motor, The Adrenaline front bars they made for the FRS would be good on a Mk3/4 imo, I'm sure something could be done, Just need a guinea pig!

 

I'm a fan of 80s Escorts, 90s ones can be nice eough but just aren't for me.

Just thinking aloud!
There must be a way to give silly powered 80s Escorts a bit more directional stability.......? My V6 Alfa has about the same power as my Estate but it runs perfectly straight and true during 100% abuse, whereas the Estate torque steers and spins up like a mad bastard

It's all just metal after all, sure the key bits can be adapted to fit...

 

yeah then you could change wishbones every other month like all the other mk5/6 owners 8)

 

As soon as I posted that I remebered just how crap they are on the late Escorts

That idea anyway, but definately not actual MK5 wishbones

 

lol, i got rid of my mk5 td coz i was sick of changin the arms, 6 sets 1 year, all under waranty, on and off the ramp in 15mins

 

i would imagine apart from better lower arm design the main
diffarance on your alfa is its got equal length drive shafts.

 

are you lot crazy!!!

The mk5/6 escort setup is terrible, shocking to say the least!!! just as bad as the Fiesta XR2i or RST setup.

The S1 or RS16i has the best handling and geomtry setup that ford have put on to a factory road car!

A S1 and rs16i has a genuine MOTORSPORT ROLLBAR which allows the adjustment of very important castor angles.

There is not another car that comes from the factory with True motorsport parts attached, even the cosworth does NOT come with a motorsport setup, it has some re-designed setup for a road car, as the magnesuim rear end for motorsport use was too expensive to be able to bolt on to a road car. So for this reason the cosworth has a crap geometry setup and costs alot to put right.

Unlike a decent mk3 or mk4 escort running a S1 or 16i rollbar.


So you asking if you could use a mk5 or mk6 setup is ridiculous. The only setup you would ever want is using a S1 or 16i rollbar.

 

Just to add.

The TCA setup that is used on a Mk3/4 Escorts and all Cosworths, are great! Buy some adjustable ones or make them your self and you have a solid and reliable TCA setup. The bushes last a long time, the TCA's take alot of abuse.

Compare your running gear to a Race or Rally car.

The TCA's used on a Grp A Cosworth are rose jointed and adjustable in situ, they also have drop link bars attached, which in turn connect to an ajustable rollbar. This setup is the best you could expect and works 100% it is the same setup you want to implement.


NOT a mk5 escort which was built for going shopping in, what would you expect from its handling? Its a fact that the wishbone setup on late fords are the worst design made by them for years.

XR2i
FRST
Mondeo
Escort Mk5/6
Fiesta Mk3-5

All have the same setup and generate alot of money in spare wishbone parts sales for Ford.

 

fitted S1 set up on the front of my orion,isnt tht hard to do,few extra holes,replaced all the bushes with polys,cant wait for it to see the road to try it!!
if anyone wants pics of wht to modify,just ask ive took millions of pics

 

Did you do it without using a S1 box ?

 

used the S1 box sadly,

 

cosworth compression struts

 

Nothing wrong with the RS1600i front setup I use, but I have been toying with the idea of fitting a complete Focus rear beam to a mk3 Escort. I really like the design. The only thing hindering me is the legal issue of doing it.

 

i know that i could fit focus suspension to an escort 3 or 4 its just a case of fitting the engine bed and mounts from a focus not to dificult just time consuming

 

Why don't people use powerflex polybushes instead of getting standard new wishbones on Fiestas/Escorts. A front set costs about the same as a pair of wishbones and have balljoints in them. They're a top job!

 

Would you be so kind as to explain to us what the problems are with the geometry on a mk5/6 Escort? Or perhaps the Mk3 Fiesta if you're more familiar with it?

 

Bump?

 

Hey sorry missed this post.

The Fiesta Mk3 onwards, mondeo, Escort Mk5 onwards, puma, etc etc.. all use the same design front wishbone setup which we all know is shite. The parts wear in no time and so called fixes that comapny offer like deflex and powerflex are just lengthening the time the parts last. However if you lower the car by X amount the front geo goes well out and means that the wheels and tyres are not sitting in the correct position to be able to make it a decent handling motor also making it hard to get power down. The rear end is also a solid bar which has no individule control over the rear wheels meaning that the handling of the car suffers bad with fast road or track use.

You must rember that these cars even if they have an RS badge were not designed to be used as real race cars in the std form.

However when compared to an RS16i or a S1 these were true race, rally, sprint, track cars and had the design for a decent rollbar and rear end setup from factory. These cars were fitted with a full adjustable front end, but decided not to supply the road version with adjustable TCA's which can be fitted for as little as £100.

Now if i have an Escort mk3/4 and fit this roll bar made by fords i have a real race component. If i have an RS16i or a S1 i have the closest thing to a real race car that ford built for the common market.. Forget the 200, 17t, gt40 etc. as these are not compareable lol.

Even the Escort cosworth is like this. It has very little from the real race cars that were used, the consumer Esc cos has nothing adjustable on it like the race motors do.
Same as the 3drs and Saffs. Just look like a race car but really they have nothing in common other than the looks.

So back to the reason why, when you have a mk5,6 escort or fiesta or any car with the same ford design the geometry becomes an issue due to the none adjustable parts on offer and the fact that if you lower it or try and fix it you cannot buy a factory part to do this and have to end up with a home made part that could snap bend not work and waste of money.

However, if you do have a Mk5.6 escort Fords did make an RS2000 Maxi race car that does have adjustable parts on it you could use. But try finding them and at what cost.

Unlike buying a £150 rollbar off an RS16i or a S1.

Hope that explains a little any questions please ask.
Danny.

 

basically your saying its better because fords made it
with aftermarket parts mk3/mk4 vs. fiesta can both have good geometry/handling
just because it doesnt say ford doesnt mean it wont work
rosejoints work well on both and they wear out quick

 

Eruptionfm@hotmail.co.uk- thanks for the lengthy reply. Thing is, pretty much all of what you wrote is just personal opinion - there were no technical details in there. Suggesting that a twist beam doesn't work is plain lunacy. Is it as-good as independant? That's debatable. It's better than some, worse than others. Assuming that the maxi setup is actually better is a dangerous road to go down unless you have testing experience of both with data to prove/disprove statements.

Yes, the escort/fiesta/puma front arms are a crap DESIGN. They're not necessarily crap geometry, which is what is important when talking about handling. You don't let a few rubber bushes write off a car as a bad handling chassis. Of course, lowering most cars will adversely affect the geometry, including the mk3/4 Escort!

Putting a multi-link setup on a mk3/4 Escort does make it handle very well, but standard geometry i'd go with the later 'inferior' setup, as you put it.

I think you're confusing adjustability with good handling. Just because you make every link adjustable won't necessarily make a car handle. If the actual pick-up points are in the wrong place in the first instance, no adjusting TCA's or whatever will fix the handling problem (there is of course only one ideal static camber/toe/caster angle for a particular application with any given suspension design).

 

After having many of my own cars setup and tested and driven yes i do know from testing and research i have done. All of my cars have been setup at elite in rainham where i have many many sheets of data and why my RS2k with a Turbo engine and also my fiesta RST didnt handle once i lowered the ride height. The reason was due to the wrong length of front TCA/Wishbone setup! If you could have some made to do the correct job this would fix the problem but like i said about custom parts. Also once lowered the angle that the wishones are mounted at are at the wrong height to start with. As for the rear end compared to the maxi type then it is a whole different setup. The rear beam takes into account the right caster camber etc. as it uses cosworth rear hubs (similar) you can use all cosworth stuff. However the rear beam will cost around £750 without any of the parts to make it work which is an extra cost.

Now i have a cosworth with full 909 adjustable front and rear end which costs over 4k to sort the problem out that the std cosworth has, hence the reason that there are companys even on this site that offers the modded rear beam to sort the problem out.

Thats why you cant lower the cosworth and put massive wheels on without losing the handling.

Anywhos hope this helps you understand the problem with the beam and wishbones that some fords have.

Danny.

 

what did they do to the mk5 RS, as this was praised for it's handling unlike the std version.

 

Nothing on the front. Rear beam had an a/r bar fitted. Dampers and springs were different.

 

best thing to do is fit a triangulated compression strut setup with rose joints instead of bushes.
then they'll be fully adjustable, bust a trade off is comfort as it'll rattle the car more.

 

Our Mk5 adjuatable arms are selling well

 

does that mean you do the mk3 fiesta arms?

 

Yes although not stocked as they are done to order at the moment.

Also the Fiesta 4 -> PAS and non PAS

KA

Puma

Focus etc

 

pm me a price for a mk3 fez

 

im excited to get mine done to see how the S1 set up differs from the S2,i know, i dont get out much

 

what about fitting the new focus rs revo knuckle type thing

 

because there's plenty of those at the breakers...

 

why would you go to a breakers for a brand new car part thats a bit dumb

you would buy it from ford

 

because you wouldn't want to pay new prices for an experimental project and cost difference plain and simple

 

Difference between Mk5 escort and RS2k

The rear of a Fiesta and also the escort can be made better if you fit a twin roll bar setup that can be made by adding an extra rollbar to the one already on the car, some Fiesta's did not come with a rollbar to start with so in this case you need to swap beams and add and extra rollbar the same with the Mk5 escort.

Makes a nice little mod and adds handling without costing much at all.

Both my RS2k and my FRST had twin roll bars same as what Neil from Fast Ford mag has on his fiesta.