kl-mortiss

i dont know what to do ive had my escort cos 3 months now wich i bought from automotiveunlimited and it is 100% standard right down the exuhust with only 37000 on clock and is show condision . but the car does feel very slow up to my last cars which where sub p1, focus rs , 224 bhp ,rs turbo . if i start to mod my cos im i messing up a rare car as its still standard. its t25 if i do start doing mods will it become unreliable its used as a second car ive never been in one thats not been standerd our they a lot diffent ceers steve

PT

same situation with mine mate, not sure to stage 3 it or not

Stoo

It'll be fine mate, just up the power. Get it to 305 on greens and have a bit of fun with it. You can always return it back to standard easily enough

The Youth.

iTrader: (1)

you can't use greens in a small turbo.
mine is a stg1 small t and goes ok does run out off puff at the top end tho I do have a graham goode 305 chip to fit some time next year wich might help a bit more.

steve

Stoo

Shit i thought you could. I knew 305 was about the limit though. Either way mate, i'd suggest upping the power a bit

redrsmk5

Why can you use greens on a small turbo?? these were on my new year shopping list as well

The Youth.

iTrader: (1)

small t don't use bosch injectors the electronics side of them a different (pulse etc) so they won't don't work.
remember the small t uses fords eec4 management unlike all other factory cosworths which used weber marrelli

steve

Escos Jam

Didnt know that either mate ... nice one

M.A.D.RST

After ditching my old stage'd 3 big turbo for my current standard small turbo.................it sucks

Best off getting an exhaust and a chip from Stu, or take it upto him No point leaving these 'rare' cars standard as they are soooo slow

Or get it converted to big turbo, thats what im going to do if i keep it
Autronic baby

kl-mortiss

first off who is stu. will i notice a big diffrence i all ready have a full mongosse pipe waiting to go on but if i up the power will i need to change the turbo as it will be limit as one of my main worrys reliability

Gary F

iTrader: (1)

Imo there shit as standard, and as said just keep the parts you take off so you can always return it to standard.
They were ment to be modified mate

kl-mortiss

what sort of bhp would i need and what mods as i will have to start saveing

Gary F

iTrader: (1)

Think all you need is zorst, air filter, chip and 3bar map sensor could be wrong though that should see 275bhp

The Youth.

iTrader: (1)

3 bar not needed
big turbo's had a 2.5 bar map sensor from the factory presume the small t is the same although it is of a different design.

steve

kl-mortiss

thanx for your help guys

lowman

the t25 version werent meant to be modified .,dude.
the escort itself ,in t35 form,was probably meant to be modified..but not the t25.at least thats the way i see it.
they didnt make it that hard to modify ..if they MADE IT TO BE MODIFIED,so..

kl-mortiss

but people do still do mod t25 and get good power up to around 300 bhp dont they

dave green

Up the power. then you will have one of the best looking cars ever to hit the roads and the power to blow M3s Scoobies and evos away.

Great fun. Had mine over six years buggerd one engine which turned out to be my own fault .


Dave

S1rst

If you want a fast car for £15-£20k, go for a supra tt. You can get a 600hp+ one for that easily. I didnt buy my small turbo for the power, but ive been in a standard ST and theres so much difference even though its only about 70hp more.

S1rst

You dont buy a low mileage, mint escos to go thrashing it about anyway imo.

lowman

of course they mod it...but to say that the t25 is a good choise to mod..is an overstatement...and since he has a mint untouched car like i obviously have...then i would advice him to maybe keep it the way it is..of course you can throw a chip in it..and so on..but it will never be a rocket with the standard ECU.so in a way you can keep it the way it is..and have something that not everyone else has.
i would rather have big brakes..beefier suspension..and do stuff like that..than try to get much power out of an t25.
i have a friend that has an t25..and he chipped it with the "300bhp"kit,,and he just had problems after he did the mod..he never got to sort it out..and he went on getting the programmable ecu,,to get waay more power..but of course..its a matter of taste..and you should alwasy concider what is best for you.and the possibilities you have..and ..yeah...but its late..im on my way to get into a serious discussion here..so ill leave it hehe

merry fookin christmas to you all by the way

kl-mortiss

good point mate i see what your saying my wife says i will be mad to mod it i think i will put the mongoose on and may be leave it at that last thing i want is loads of probs as when we go out in it my wife and two kids come to i dont think they would be happy waiting for the RAC to pick us up every five minites

S1rst

If its done properly, theres no reason at all why it would be any more unreliable than standard.

lowman

its not just the point about it beeing unreliable(cause it may not be unreliable).but i have heard of more than one t25 thats been chipped..and not working as it should afterwards.of course you can make it work..but having a chip in it..will not make it a flying rocket anyways..so my personal opinion is to maybe leave it as it is..and do other stuff to it..to get better handling and better brakes..then you can drive faster into corners..and drive it more safely.
the t25 is not the ideal one if you want a lot of power.all the electronics must ideally be changed to something programmable or to big turbo spec..and then you can might as well get a nice big turbo one to modify.

and the thing is ..like he said..if this is a standard car...not everyone has a standard car .and in a way it should be treasured as it is.but like i said do mods to improve handling,brakes..and maybe some treat for the looks of it.

cheers dudes

maxest

iTrader: (1)

PM Cossymad,,, he's got a modded small turbo, that without a management change was faster than an ahmed bayjoo stage 3 big turbo.... as proved in a performance ford grudge match

lowman

of course.but thats not the whole point.hehe
it can be good..but you might risk problems.and especially if this car is so clean that he says..then if it would be my car..i would fuck it up with some chip that everyone else has.but thats my opinion.cause some cars will always be faster..so what the point really.hehe.you can make the car feel a lot faster by doing things to the suspension..and bigger brakes.to make it more solid.tight and fast through corners.at least i think so.

M.A.D.RST

Never heard of these problems mate with regards to chipping

As you know the mileage and condition of mine It has a Blueflame exhaust which makes it sound really nice but you do need a little bit of power............its a Cosworth after all But i havent and never will rag mine, i dont go over 4k as i dont want to get stone chips or get it dirty But it is nice to have a little bit of accelaration. I agree with lowman with regards to putting bigger brakes on, although not for safety on my behalf, just for buftyness

Plus, like me yours is just a weekend toy.........................well i say weekend toy, its been locked away since September and wont be out until May But its not going to be unreliable, as like me you have a mint, low mileage, unmolested dream car

Stu, is a mod on here and runs Motorsport Developments, mapping supremos

No point worrying about the car, just enjoy it Although i dont

PT

please be joking

I think your right to sell it if your that scared of it mate

kl-mortiss

thanx for your advice guy after all i am a cossy virgin

maxest

iTrader: (1)

I've took it over 4k and it wasnt even mine!!

dave green

A big power cossie is as reliable as the owner wants it to be. if looked after it will be as reliable as any other car.


Dave

M.A.D.RST

I just dont see the point.................as its not fast

RWD_cossie_wil

iTrader: (9)

My T25 is chipped by MSD to 300BHP ish, holds 21psi, and the difference between a std car and chipped is immense. Mines got a 360 bearing turbo, -31 actuator and a full de-catted mongoose, std panel filter and an uprated fuel pump. It goes really really well I had a problem with the chip expansion being loose on the main ecu, due to it being chipped for 4 years and it has worn away the printed circuit board Just needs a re-solder on the main board connectors when I get a chance to fix that, but for now i'm running it around standard and it feels flat as a fart . It is just sooo much more torquey when it's chipped, and it has to be said after years of slating the small turbos , I have actually grown to love the drivability and ease of hammering down lanes, being on full bost by 2500RPM and not having to rev fuck out of the car to make it go anywhere.

As I have said in another thread, I am giving my car to someone very clever in the mapping game in Janurary, and hopefully with just a turbo (prob going to be a T34.48 to try and keep nearly the same response but with much more midrange and top end)and exhaust manifold swap the car will be around 350BHP ish (might be more might be less!) without changing the EEC IV management to webber - Definatly an interesting proposition for small turbo owners wouldn't you say?

Oh and I drive my car everyday as my daily runner, apart from consumables and a few snags like driveshafts snapping due to abuse it's been as good as gold
get it chipped and drive it like you stole it

cossymad

300bhp small turbo escort will piss on most 330bhp big turbo ones right through to 140mph+
Mine still done 161mph, at a struggle, but as Max said, they can be as fast as others.
Reliabilty?
4 years=2 major problems.
1. faulty wiring fried ECU
2. faulty wiring fried CPS

Car has done 40,000 miles since being chipped.
Car has done 39,000 on new turbo.
Car is used as daily runner / track car / towing vehicle / shopping trolley / school taxi.

RWD_cossie_wil

iTrader: (9)

thats the thing, the small turbo is so easy to launch fast and it flies through the gears A very very underrated car

S1rst

Whats this then mate out of interest? is there a way of getting round the management restrictions now then?

cossymad

Dreamscience won't work on EEC4, only EEC5.

S1rst

My mate had a 330 bhp 4x4 saff and after driving my small turbo, he said mine was quicker than his, just to back-up the above.

Mines an almost identical spec to RWD_cossie_wil's, 300 bhp with WI and holding about 20psi.

It makes me laugh when people assume that because it has a smaller turbo, it makes it slower!!! , where in reality it actually makes it quite a bit quicker with similar power figures.

RWD_cossie_wil

iTrader: (9)

far easier to drive as well, which means its easier to drive fast, I challenge ANYONE to chase me down my local B roads , power is right where you want it between 2000-6000RPM

As I said, I can't really say too much about the power upgrade as I am giving my car to someone very clever for a few weeks in Jan as a test mule, it might not work but there is every chance that it will be able to produce 350ish on a T34.48 ( might be a different turbo, just depends on what comes up, but its a good development turbo as they are cheap and reliable) while keeping 95% of the T25's response . Also the new generation of injectors (high impedance I think) means that the injectors might be able to be changed to higher flow ones, as they can be driven off EEC IV if the rest of the package is suitable

The idea is to get as much RELIABLE power and torque as possible and keep very very good drivability at a sensible cost, hopefully the ONLY items that will need to be changed are the turbo and exhaust manifold as they are the big restrictions. A T3 is no good really as its compressor map is only very slighty better at the top end than the T25, so not worth the effort so T34.48 it is, and the T25 exhaust manifold is smaller bore in the neck, so a normal 4x4 item is the ideal replacement, but a T25 one can be ported out if you like, but again its not reall worth the effort when a 4x4 one is less than £40 . Hopefully the MAF and MAP sensor that normally restrict power won't need to be changed either

As said, watch this space at the end of Jan/ early Feb, i'm as excited as anything . I would tell you a bit more but its not really my place as I don't want to put the guys doing it under any pressure or build you up too much if it dosn't work

S1rst

Sounds good mate. Keep us informed.

GGR seem to have something in the pipeline too. How far on it is i dont know but sounds like its more than likely going to happen due to them advertising it.

http://www.grahamgoode.com/cosworth/new.htm