Motorsport LEGENDS!!!!! Whos yours???
26-07-2005, 05:02 PM
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Motorsport LEGENDS!!!!! Whos yours???
Ok,ive been talking about this at work today,and im SOOOOOOO Undiced its unreal?!?!?
Ive got to say,im down to Aryton Senna,and Valentino Rossi
I KNOW Rossi is still young,but the talent that guy has is just unbeliveable!!!!
I just cant split the 2 of them....
Views???????
Pete...
Ive got to say,im down to Aryton Senna,and Valentino Rossi
I KNOW Rossi is still young,but the talent that guy has is just unbeliveable!!!!
I just cant split the 2 of them....
Views???????
Pete...
26-07-2005, 05:04 PM
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But then again, you have the Hills x2,McRae,Tommi M,Sterling Moss,Alan Prost.
But how do you split sooo many talented people in to a over all winner??
Pete...
But how do you split sooo many talented people in to a over all winner??
Pete...
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26-07-2005, 05:06 PM
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Ok a few of you have said names,but WHY are they the best in your eyes? What makes them better than anyone else???
Carl Foggerty???
Mat Neal (ok he`s a twat,but he`s been up there for YEARS in tourning cars)???
Pete..
Carl Foggerty???
Mat Neal (ok he`s a twat,but he`s been up there for YEARS in tourning cars)???
Pete..
26-07-2005, 05:08 PM
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Nigel Mansell
Jackie Stewart
Andy Rouse
Steffan Bellof (RIP)
Mark Lovell (RIP)
Jimmy McRae
Carl Foggerty
David Purley (RIP)
Gyndaff Evans
Aryton Senna (RIP)
Some of the greatest drivers of our time there
Jackie Stewart
Andy Rouse
Steffan Bellof (RIP)
Mark Lovell (RIP)
Jimmy McRae
Carl Foggerty
David Purley (RIP)
Gyndaff Evans
Aryton Senna (RIP)
Some of the greatest drivers of our time there
26-07-2005, 05:11 PM
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Too many categories to choose 1
Bikes :Ago
F1 : Michael S*
Rally : Tommi M
Touring Cars : Soper
GT : Jackie or possibly Kristensen
*Everyone chooses Senna. But he was just the most ruthless of the day. Schumacher is better than Senna because he took the inspiration and went further. Plus he has moulded an entire team around him like no driver before
Bikes :Ago
F1 : Michael S*
Rally : Tommi M
Touring Cars : Soper
GT : Jackie or possibly Kristensen
*Everyone chooses Senna. But he was just the most ruthless of the day. Schumacher is better than Senna because he took the inspiration and went further. Plus he has moulded an entire team around him like no driver before
26-07-2005, 05:11 PM
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Originally Posted by GARETH T
colin mc crash
26-07-2005, 05:18 PM
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Rich.....
Got to disagree mate.
Schuwey has 1 MAJOR factor on his side,TECHNOLOGY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If he`s such a for with in Ferrari,and suce a amazing driver,and BETTER than Sena,explain to me this years form?? Now that the chasing pack,has a better chance of compertition with the top flighters (IE Ferrari) Where are they now?!?!?
Seen was a FORCE in Motorsport,and his Death was a HUGE loss..Look at when when Schewy stacked ina few years ago at silverstone,and broke his leg,we all laughed,and had a giggle about it,but if Senna was to of done the same,we would all be worried about him,hoping that he makes a quick return to our tracks/screens...
Im not knocking him,yeh he`s a FANTASTIC driver,and yeh in a way a legend,but to Mr Senna,he dont even come CLOSE!!!!!!
IMHO...
Pete...
Got to disagree mate.
Schuwey has 1 MAJOR factor on his side,TECHNOLOGY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If he`s such a for with in Ferrari,and suce a amazing driver,and BETTER than Sena,explain to me this years form?? Now that the chasing pack,has a better chance of compertition with the top flighters (IE Ferrari) Where are they now?!?!?
Seen was a FORCE in Motorsport,and his Death was a HUGE loss..Look at when when Schewy stacked ina few years ago at silverstone,and broke his leg,we all laughed,and had a giggle about it,but if Senna was to of done the same,we would all be worried about him,hoping that he makes a quick return to our tracks/screens...
Im not knocking him,yeh he`s a FANTASTIC driver,and yeh in a way a legend,but to Mr Senna,he dont even come CLOSE!!!!!!
IMHO...
Pete...
26-07-2005, 05:21 PM
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Originally Posted by warleydaddy
Rich.....
Got to disagree mate.
Schuwey has 1 MAJOR factor on his side,TECHNOLOGY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If he`s such a for with in Ferrari,and suce a amazing driver,and BETTER than Sena,explain to me this years form?? Now that the chasing pack,has a better chance of compertition with the top flighters (IE Ferrari) Where are they now?!?!?
Seen was a FORCE in Motorsport,and his Death was a HUGE loss..Look at when when Schewy stacked ina few years ago at silverstone,and broke his leg,we all laughed,and had a giggle about it,but if Senna was to of done the same,we would all be worried about him,hoping that he makes a quick return to our tracks/screens...
Im not knocking him,yeh he`s a FANTASTIC driver,and yeh in a way a legend,but to Mr Senna,he dont even come CLOSE!!!!!!
IMHO...
Pete...
Got to disagree mate.
Schuwey has 1 MAJOR factor on his side,TECHNOLOGY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If he`s such a for with in Ferrari,and suce a amazing driver,and BETTER than Sena,explain to me this years form?? Now that the chasing pack,has a better chance of compertition with the top flighters (IE Ferrari) Where are they now?!?!?
Seen was a FORCE in Motorsport,and his Death was a HUGE loss..Look at when when Schewy stacked ina few years ago at silverstone,and broke his leg,we all laughed,and had a giggle about it,but if Senna was to of done the same,we would all be worried about him,hoping that he makes a quick return to our tracks/screens...
Im not knocking him,yeh he`s a FANTASTIC driver,and yeh in a way a legend,but to Mr Senna,he dont even come CLOSE!!!!!!
IMHO...
Pete...
Pete..
26-07-2005, 05:27 PM
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Mike Hailwood, Mick Doohan, Barry Sheen, Joey Dunlop, Dave Jefferies, Kevin Schwantz, Wayne Rainey, Kenny Roberts, Foggy, Ari Vatenen, Carlos Sainz.
All legends imo
Lots more that I can't think of now, Giacomo Agostini for one
Rossi will undoubtedly be considered a legend but don't know if I'd say that yet, if he's still kicking ass in ten years (or dies trying )then he's earned his place
All legends imo
Lots more that I can't think of now, Giacomo Agostini for one
Rossi will undoubtedly be considered a legend but don't know if I'd say that yet, if he's still kicking ass in ten years (or dies trying
)then he's earned his place
26-07-2005, 05:39 PM
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Originally Posted by warleydaddy
Rich.....
Got to disagree mate.
Schuwey has 1 MAJOR factor on his side,TECHNOLOGY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If he`s such a for with in Ferrari,and suce a amazing driver,and BETTER than Sena,explain to me this years form?? Now that the chasing pack,has a better chance of compertition with the top flighters (IE Ferrari) Where are they now?!?!?
Seen was a FORCE in Motorsport,and his Death was a HUGE loss..Look at when when Schewy stacked ina few years ago at silverstone,and broke his leg,we all laughed,and had a giggle about it,but if Senna was to of done the same,we would all be worried about him,hoping that he makes a quick return to our tracks/screens...
Im not knocking him,yeh he`s a FANTASTIC driver,and yeh in a way a legend,but to Mr Senna,he dont even come CLOSE!!!!!!
IMHO...
Pete...
Got to disagree mate.
Schuwey has 1 MAJOR factor on his side,TECHNOLOGY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If he`s such a for with in Ferrari,and suce a amazing driver,and BETTER than Sena,explain to me this years form?? Now that the chasing pack,has a better chance of compertition with the top flighters (IE Ferrari) Where are they now?!?!?
Seen was a FORCE in Motorsport,and his Death was a HUGE loss..Look at when when Schewy stacked ina few years ago at silverstone,and broke his leg,we all laughed,and had a giggle about it,but if Senna was to of done the same,we would all be worried about him,hoping that he makes a quick return to our tracks/screens...
Im not knocking him,yeh he`s a FANTASTIC driver,and yeh in a way a legend,but to Mr Senna,he dont even come CLOSE!!!!!!
IMHO...
Pete...
But I think the Legend tag only came about because he cultivated it. He knew what to say to get people behind him. He had the whole of Latin America united for him. He was the original hard racer. But Michael has taken it an run with it. And also made himself more technically proficient. Senna was running on impulse too often. Which sadly contributed to his death* Michael uses his brain more often.
For me a Motorsport Legend is someone that uses everything he has. Whether thats physical, mental or technical to get the best result every time.
*He was pushing far too hard for the cars condition in a bid to stomp Michael who was running away with the championship at tha point having beaten him in EVERY race so far that year
26-07-2005, 05:43 PM
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No.
The telemetry traces show a torsional force on the column right up to the point where the car hit the wall.
I think the whole story of that is what I was alluding to. That Senna cultivated the God status. And as a result Gods cant possibly make an error. So therefore it MUST have been mechanical failure.
The telemetry traces show a torsional force on the column right up to the point where the car hit the wall.
I think the whole story of that is what I was alluding to. That Senna cultivated the God status. And as a result Gods cant possibly make an error. So therefore it MUST have been mechanical failure.
26-07-2005, 05:49 PM
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Originally Posted by Rich_w
No.
The telemetry traces show a torsional force on the column right up to the point where the car hit the wall.
I think the whole story of that is what I was alluding to. That Senna cultivated the God status. And as a result Gods cant possibly make an error. So therefore it MUST have been mechanical failure.
The telemetry traces show a torsional force on the column right up to the point where the car hit the wall.
I think the whole story of that is what I was alluding to. That Senna cultivated the God status. And as a result Gods cant possibly make an error. So therefore it MUST have been mechanical failure.
IMO the senna accident was a mechanical failure on the car. I think this should be saved for another topic though.
26-07-2005, 05:55 PM
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Originally Posted by Rich_w
Originally Posted by warleydaddy
Rich.....
Got to disagree mate.
Schuwey has 1 MAJOR factor on his side,TECHNOLOGY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If he`s such a for with in Ferrari,and suce a amazing driver,and BETTER than Sena,explain to me this years form?? Now that the chasing pack,has a better chance of compertition with the top flighters (IE Ferrari) Where are they now?!?!?
Seen was a FORCE in Motorsport,and his Death was a HUGE loss..Look at when when Schewy stacked ina few years ago at silverstone,and broke his leg,we all laughed,and had a giggle about it,but if Senna was to of done the same,we would all be worried about him,hoping that he makes a quick return to our tracks/screens...
Im not knocking him,yeh he`s a FANTASTIC driver,and yeh in a way a legend,but to Mr Senna,he dont even come CLOSE!!!!!!
IMHO...
Pete...
Got to disagree mate.
Schuwey has 1 MAJOR factor on his side,TECHNOLOGY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
If he`s such a for with in Ferrari,and suce a amazing driver,and BETTER than Sena,explain to me this years form?? Now that the chasing pack,has a better chance of compertition with the top flighters (IE Ferrari) Where are they now?!?!?
Seen was a FORCE in Motorsport,and his Death was a HUGE loss..Look at when when Schewy stacked ina few years ago at silverstone,and broke his leg,we all laughed,and had a giggle about it,but if Senna was to of done the same,we would all be worried about him,hoping that he makes a quick return to our tracks/screens...
Im not knocking him,yeh he`s a FANTASTIC driver,and yeh in a way a legend,but to Mr Senna,he dont even come CLOSE!!!!!!
IMHO...
Pete...
But I think the Legend tag only came about because he cultivated it. He knew what to say to get people behind him. He had the whole of Latin America united for him. He was the original hard racer. But Michael has taken it an run with it. And also made himself more technically proficient. Senna was running on impulse too often. Which sadly contributed to his death* Michael uses his brain more often.
For me a Motorsport Legend is someone that uses everything he has. Whether thats physical, mental or technical to get the best result every time.
*He was pushing far too hard for the cars condition in a bid to stomp Michael who was running away with the championship at tha point having beaten him in EVERY race so far that year
"now before i say anything,im not saying he`s the besr EVER,hence this post)
Senna was a TRUE MOTORSPORT FAN!!!!He did yes,push him self,but isnt that whats know as a "competitive streek"???
He wasnt there to make up numbers,he was there to WIN!!!!!!!! And that he did,on numerouse occasions!which puts him up there with the greats???!!!
The whole was it his fault,or not will ALWAYS go on!!! But from what ive seen and read,it could go either way,YES there were faults with the sterring coloum,and YES he was pushing it to the MAX,but the guy was driving for Williams for FREE at the time,as thats all he wanted to do!!!
Im 99% sure that he wanted to drive for Williams so much,he said he would for free???!!!???
Thats dedication to the cause!!! If say Jordon came in for Schewy next season,think he`d go?? NO!!!!!!!! He`d go where the money is!!!
Pete....
26-07-2005, 06:06 PM
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McCrae, Senna & Prost.
I dont rate Schumacher for a number of reasons - the biggest of which his old habit of running people off the track to try and ensure victory. Hill and Villeneuve both caught his antics first hand. There's a big difference between agressive driving and dirty driving.
Senna's perfectionism and passion is what made him so good as far as I'm concerned. Even in an inferior car he would hold his own. 1993 season was jsut unreal when he had a far inferior car. Plus he had to do his own gear shifts back then rather than jsut pull a lever and let the machine pull off the flawless gear changes. No power steering, no power brakes etc....
I dont rate Schumacher for a number of reasons - the biggest of which his old habit of running people off the track to try and ensure victory. Hill and Villeneuve both caught his antics first hand. There's a big difference between agressive driving and dirty driving.
Senna's perfectionism and passion is what made him so good as far as I'm concerned. Even in an inferior car he would hold his own. 1993 season was jsut unreal when he had a far inferior car. Plus he had to do his own gear shifts back then rather than jsut pull a lever and let the machine pull off the flawless gear changes. No power steering, no power brakes etc....
26-07-2005, 06:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Keith B
I dont rate Schumacher for a number of reasons - the biggest of which his old habit of running people off the track to try and ensure victory. Hill and Villeneuve both caught his antics first hand. There's a big difference between agressive driving and dirty driving.
Originally Posted by Keith B
Senna's perfectionism and passion is what made him so good as far as I'm concerned. Even in an inferior car he would hold his own. 1993 season was jsut unreal when he had a far inferior car. Plus he had to do his own gear shifts back then rather than jsut pull a lever and let the machine pull off the flawless gear changes. No power steering, no power brakes etc....
And Schumacher did drive the Group C Saubers and do well. The age old "not real drivers as they dont change gear" is a nonsense mate.
Originally Posted by warleydaddy
Parts of that i DO agree with you Rich,but parts i dont...
"now before i say anything,im not saying he`s the besr EVER,hence this post)
Senna was a TRUE MOTORSPORT FAN!!!!He did yes,push him self,but isnt that whats know as a "competitive streek"???
He wasnt there to make up numbers,he was there to WIN!!!!!!!! And that he did,on numerouse occasions!which puts him up there with the greats???!!!
The whole was it his fault,or not will ALWAYS go on!!! But from what ive seen and read,it could go either way,YES there were faults with the sterring coloum,and YES he was pushing it to the MAX,but the guy was driving for Williams for FREE at the time,as thats all he wanted to do!!!
Im 99% sure that he wanted to drive for Williams so much,he said he would for free???!!!???
Thats dedication to the cause!!! If say Jordon came in for Schewy next season,think he`d go?? NO!!!!!!!! He`d go where the money is!!!
Pete....
"now before i say anything,im not saying he`s the besr EVER,hence this post)
Senna was a TRUE MOTORSPORT FAN!!!!He did yes,push him self,but isnt that whats know as a "competitive streek"???
He wasnt there to make up numbers,he was there to WIN!!!!!!!! And that he did,on numerouse occasions!which puts him up there with the greats???!!!
The whole was it his fault,or not will ALWAYS go on!!! But from what ive seen and read,it could go either way,YES there were faults with the sterring coloum,and YES he was pushing it to the MAX,but the guy was driving for Williams for FREE at the time,as thats all he wanted to do!!!
Im 99% sure that he wanted to drive for Williams so much,he said he would for free???!!!???
Thats dedication to the cause!!! If say Jordon came in for Schewy next season,think he`d go?? NO!!!!!!!! He`d go where the money is!!!
Pete....
Of ourse both drivers push(ed) all the time. They both WANT to be there. But the Williams deal was because he wanted to drive for someone else. To proove it wasnt the McLaren that was responsible. And of course hed drive for free to proove the point, he was a proud man. (Im not sure he did though - can you put a link up?)
McLaren had really done themselves in paying his very high wages for the years previously. So he (senna) was set financially. It drained the team of vital resources which took them many years to recover from. (Ron doesnt pay his drivers huge retainers anymore.)
26-07-2005, 06:42 PM
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scheuy drove an under powered betteton to the championship then move tto ferrari,got them to the top but the technology got to good so he didnt have to try anymore to win.now because of the rules he has to try i dont think he can he should move over an let a younger driver come in(rossi)he is said to be already signed for an f1 team.he was only 2 sec a lap behind schmacher in he car.one to watch
26-07-2005, 06:48 PM
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Didier Auriol and Carlos Sainz
forgot about Jean Ragnotti, the most talented FWD rally driver i've ever seen.
Look out for his vid i think its called "Farewell Jean Ragnotti" or maybe "Au revoir Jean Ragnotti" and just watch him backing it into the corners. Its fare to say he loves the hand brake.
forgot about Jean Ragnotti, the most talented FWD rally driver i've ever seen.
Look out for his vid i think its called "Farewell Jean Ragnotti" or maybe "Au revoir Jean Ragnotti" and just watch him backing it into the corners. Its fare to say he loves the hand brake.
