Cossie rear beam setups - options.
#41
Advanced PassionFord User
iTrader: (1)
It's not only the camber changes from the rear beam that makes it handle badly. I think the toe changes are even worse than the camber changes. The toe changes on the rear during cornering make the car understeer.
But another bad thing from the toe changes is when the rear wheels are drifting and the steering is on opposite lock. If the drift suddenly stops it will try to throw the car in the opposite direction, making it spin quite easily.
A few years ago I also investigated the 6 degree beams that were available at the time. Some seemed very good but expensive, one other quite a bit cheaper but to my opinion it wasn't 6 degrees but more like 14. The fact that it would need to be shipped to Holland made me decide to have one made according to my own design. Was quite a bit cheaper in the end.
But another bad thing from the toe changes is when the rear wheels are drifting and the steering is on opposite lock. If the drift suddenly stops it will try to throw the car in the opposite direction, making it spin quite easily.
A few years ago I also investigated the 6 degree beams that were available at the time. Some seemed very good but expensive, one other quite a bit cheaper but to my opinion it wasn't 6 degrees but more like 14. The fact that it would need to be shipped to Holland made me decide to have one made according to my own design. Was quite a bit cheaper in the end.
#42
MK, if you were designing a double wishbone system, would you go the traditional, make a jig and weld up the a arm route (simplest but quality dependant on expert jig and welding) or would billet alloy cut from CAD images be the only way to do it well??
#45
I've found that life I needed.. It's HERE!!
iTrader: (1)
Other than unsprung weight and physical limits on damper dimensions, what is the advantage of an inboard set up in geometry terms over a "typical" road car/kit car double wishbone set up with the damper going from lower arm to chassis??
you can alter the ratio of wheel to shock movement with the ratio of the rocker ie 2.1 2.2 to etc
MK, if you were designing a double wishbone system, would you go the traditional, make a jig and weld up the a arm route (simplest but quality dependant on expert jig and welding) or would billet alloy cut from CAD images be the only way to do it well??
you can alter the ratio of wheel to shock movement with the ratio of the rocker ie 2.1 2.2 to etc
MK, if you were designing a double wishbone system, would you go the traditional, make a jig and weld up the a arm route (simplest but quality dependant on expert jig and welding) or would billet alloy cut from CAD images be the only way to do it well??
#46
Regular Contributor
With a cantilever setup the motion ratio of the shock can be increased, so more shock movement for a given wheel movement. Makes shock tuning/control a lot better as more oil is displaced.
#47
Regular Contributor
hi
what geometry are you looking for .what is it you want the beam too do ,a 6 degree beam is just that 6 degree ,there are no other changes to it other than adjustment for camber and toe, and if its double adjustable the ability
too move the wheel in the arch ,the 6 degree alteration slows down the camber change for a given travel of the rear suspension , the rear cradle is a different ball game ,that can be adjusted in more ways
mark
what geometry are you looking for .what is it you want the beam too do ,a 6 degree beam is just that 6 degree ,there are no other changes to it other than adjustment for camber and toe, and if its double adjustable the ability
too move the wheel in the arch ,the 6 degree alteration slows down the camber change for a given travel of the rear suspension , the rear cradle is a different ball game ,that can be adjusted in more ways
mark
The rear camber and toe need fixing, as the cost of tyres (ruined edges) will exceed a beam cost pretty smartly.
It feels like it has negligible or no anti squat. Maybe as a result of said springs lowering too much. Thanks to markk for the detail on the ahmeds, I have some homework to do there. Lowered with anti squat would be preferred.
Over and above the beam changes to reduce camber change, a set of camber wedges half way between road and track settings would make for really simple adjustment between both settings without the need for full wheel alignment. Flip the wedges over to give the other setting.
On the roll centre front I'm interested to know what, if any, changes are made to get the back working better with the front.
Once a double adjustable 6ş beam is chosen, there is not much more involved to make it roll centre adjustable. The benefit of going to the trouble is up for answering and knowing where the roll centre ended up on the various versions, from factory to WRC, would help.
Rear cradle is out, for me, I don't want to hack up the shell or start on fuel tanks.
#48
Regular Contributor
I'm trying to avoid getting bogged down with a whole bespoke EsCos backend, I bought the EsCos because my bespoke project is not getting finished due to it's time demands.
I think Warren's project is already bespoke enough to go all out if time and money resources permit.
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