Luca

iTrader: (2)

It sure does I have no heat protection under the car on mine currently.

Will be fitting though ASAP as when I came off track at Combe everything in the car was redhot from the floor to the indicator stalks

I think the chassis will melt if I was to fit an undertray too without venting it.

Looking at using either standard heat tunnel or making one from the corregated ceramic filled heat sheilding.

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Aerodynamics is a hard thing to get right and an easy thing to dissapear up your own arse looking into. Flat floor is a good idea in general, although like Jay says, not as easy to implement as it sounds.

If you look at the success of the Nick Williamson escort in the AAA racing series with no aero package at all versus cars like simon norris's with lots of aero modifications, it would be hard to consider them as effective.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BwZGJVCErMc

The green Norris evo HAS cannards on front bumper, has totally panelled smooth under-floor, custom rear diffuser, huge adjustable wing....

The white Es Cos (Nick Williamson) has none of the above and 270 - 300 BHP less

Not saying aero cant help, it can, but i would be careful how much of your available time and money you invest in it ahead of other areas of development.

M K

iTrader: (9)

after a lot of tit for tat some good info and opinions are starting to emerge in this thread

Touring Car Spares

iTrader: (6)

Spot on chip !
I supply Tyres to both these guys , 265 and 285 to simon and skinny little 235's to nick !
Theres way more speed in Ronnies car and driver before you start pissing about with aero , you'll get it wrong more as like and slow the bloody thing down ,chop bits off the car if you have to but dont bolt bits on ,lol .

As an example for you , Steve weatherley a disabled driver in a 350bhp virtually std sapphire now qualifies at Lydden in the late 44's early 45's !!
At Brands he races in the 52's ,very respectable ,especially as he has no use of his legs ! The cosworth is a great car even as std ,for gods sake explore the limits of that before you try and change it so dramatically from original .
Weve got Nick into the 50 seconds dead now at Brands,on std front and rear axles , only now are we making the change to an adjustable front and rear set up so you can see whats possible before you go mad

Jay,

iTrader: (4)

We build Nick's panels and do the geo setup on and few bits here and there it all the rest is his work its a very competitive car

Chip

iTrader: (3)

Nick is an amazing competitor and that Stirling Broadcast sponsored car is a testament to what can be done on a budget if you spend your money only where it is needed and dont go off on tangents that sound great on a forum "Im developing an Aero package for my race car" but actually do little or nothing positive or potentially even make things worse.

Anyone looking to race a cosworth needs a proper look over that car!

XRT_si

iTrader: (2)

Interesting points, certainly worth thinking about.

turbotoaster

i did actually do something similar to that, if for example they ran there exhaust system to the rear of the car, one thing i learnt when learning aerodynamics is try and avoid sharp corners where possible, i read a theosis, i think it was from a force india engineer about diffuser design and they said when creating a diffuser make sure where any vertical plane meets its horizontal plane that its not a straight 90* shape, that the transistion from vertical to horizontal is gradual to stop air actually being caught in that tight grove, as shown on there CDF software, if you look at the rx7 diffusers you can see that there arnt sharp unsidedown 'L' s if you will





this is the one me and jon thought up for the rx7, but again requires the exhaust in the middle, if since dannys is a side exit we would use the full length of the bumper to create a diffuser.

The angle that the diffuser becomes stipulates the amount of venturies is has, most likely 3-4 like so



I didnt mention heat at the time as that was something i was going to come onto when i got chance to look at the underneath of both there cars.

My original thoughts were a naca duct for the diff and heat wrap for ronnies exhaust and ceramic coating for dannys to keep things cool, like this



also if required a naca duct can be added after the diff to get the remaining heat out, no point creating a mini parachute underneath the car.

also in the transmission tunnel add a heat deflecter to keep from burning there legs.

Danny @ Enhanced Performance

iTrader: (3)

Looking at all them pics and your thoughts lee i really dont think an under body tray will work or atleast it will be alot of trouble to make work without knowing what difference it would actually make but the rear diffuser is worth a try i reckon.

The only difference between mine and kevs car to look at underneath is the fact that i run an arb thats mounted alot further back and mag rear arms that sit different..
I dont run a wrc rear cradle set up i run a grp a square beam and mag arms..

Youl have to come and see when your down..

As iv said to you before not many cossies have gone down these routes but i cant say wheter thats because it works or not??


cheers danny

turbotoaster

a car is a car, whether its a cossie or a ferrari.

aerodynamics doesnt care what the vehicle is, if you subject it to the same forces it will react the same way.

most people havent looked properly at aero on cossies because as horrible as this sounds, most are still in the dark ages and if its not off a 90s wrc car or a 80s touring car it must be rubbish.


for example rollerbearing turbos, its all the big fashion now, but in other circles they have been used to years.

same with divided manifolds/rear housings, even now it seems like a new tecnology to everyone but mazda had it on there road cars in the 80s and mitsi/subaru in the 90s

few people are saying borgwarners/holsets are the next big thing, we were using them in 2003-2004.


I think its time that ford guys embraced the alot of things that everyone else has been doing for years and watch the laptimes fall.


Ronnie a perfect example of what old school is like, hes starting to embrace it with use of carbon but from a outside persective its like bringing a game boy to an ipod convention.

I think your a good protaganist of trying to look at new technology by wanting to try new things, for example in the jap seen the to4z is a few years old now, but its not like an old t4 and using divided housing is also a step forward as you have seen.


if i was gonna create a sierra with todays technology this is what i would do.

full aero setup, (diffuser, flat floor, lip) remove rear wing and use APR GT300 wing(wind tunnel tested) make some canards and also tyre deflectors to cut down drag.

fit 18x9 wheels on the front with 260 slicks and 18x10 with 280 slicks, tub the front arches, pull the outer arches and select correct offset to accomidate.

engine wise id run pretty much your engine danny but with your changes we spoke about.

autronic engine management with id1000cc injectors and seperate coil packs.

carbon/grp panels with lexan windows all around.

full fia/msa cage to make sure theres no flex in the chassis.

very large front and rear arbs so that i dont have to go mental with the spring rates so its compliant over the bumps(say combe for example)

run the car at 60mm ride height to make most use of the aero.

once all bolted on and ready to go id use a pyrometer to calculate camber and tyre pressure for each corner on the circuit im at.


cant really think of much else off the top of my head.

sounds all a bit extreme but i bet alot of the time attack boys are doing similar

stu21t

Y not tap up phil/ima/boschman..... For some injectors and a fuel pump.
And ask stu/msd to supply a chip/map/wasted spark/AL.....

And if tcs supplies others with tyres .....

Touring Car Spares

iTrader: (6)

Ronnie has to use TA's control tyre or i would .

A lot of good sense being talked about ways to improve a package ,theyre mainly all "perfect world "scenarios tho ,i stick to my point that before virtually any of the above are applied that theres LOADS OF TIME STILL LEFT IN THE CAR , and i think thats where small monies should be applied to make big improvements .
I would personally reduce the wheel size down to a 9x17" ,weve seen a number of cars try 18" rims and come back to smaller ones, this will put the car back towards the tarmac and aid geometry ,i tell you what I;ll put a NEW set of rims on the car for next season as long as you run my stickers ,i'll even help you out with front brakes which i think you'll want to say wont fit under a 17" rim

Luca

iTrader: (2)

turbotoaster

first thing i thought of was running 17s on it, but then assumed he was on 18s because he had a big brake setup.

running 255/40/17s on 9x17 would be perfect, i said the same thing to ronnie on pm but 255/35/18s as i wasnt sure of his brake setup.


seems like theres many people on here who will help you, with all of passionford coming together i really think you could make your car into a bit of a monster, all it requires is adding stickers to your car and a some name dropping at events........if it was me id be doing it and im potentially your direct competition next year!

XRT_si

iTrader: (2)

Very kind offer

Jay,

iTrader: (4)

what a man well done Tony

M K

iTrader: (9)

very generous of you tony

OldDan

Great to see!

Miller 3

iTrader: (4)

I tell you what! there has been some wonderful offers on this thread, and there is going to have to be a few nice cakes sent out

RONNIE AMIS

iTrader: (17)

thank you every body for the advice.

tony i will call you tommorow, i dont know what happened earlier.

joe is sorting the engine out for next year which will see a nice power increase

doug and jay have both been very helpful and i'll have to get baking the cakes now lol

Miller 3

iTrader: (4)

Right Ronald, whats the plan for over crimbo

Steve the Plumber

iTrader: (11)

Start baking cakes?

turbotoaster

well its cheaper than making babies!!

though i suppose you could eat them to.......mmmmm the other white meat!

cabrio zo

I think the deal for next season has been completed Motul wise, not sure what else monetry wise can be done, J and I will have a chat see if his boss can offer anything aside from the Motul side of the business, we're sad and always talk shop lol

All this off topic stuff FFS, it's between the two people involved, they are professionals and as such should sort it out privately between them.

So far I haven't come up with any decent fun raising ideas!

I think EVERYONE involved in last season and Ronnies placement was a fantastic achievement, I look forward to 2011 TA

stu21t

i might buy a tatty old cos and say im entering time attack with it lol
all this free shit will turn it into a good car lol

cabrio zo

If you actually enter it into TA and get good results and good exposure for the sponsors then why not

COCHYN

Loads of mixed views on this thread, shame a lot of it is pretty malicious considering its suppose to be for a good cause

Will Pedley is a cracking lad with a lot of experience, he has and will continue to help anyone that needs it. If he can get a bit of advertisement out of it, then great! No sense trying to start a business if its kept quiet.

Any help people can provide will be keeping a FORD and a top bloke at the top of the competition, which is surely enough of a reason