Counting cards....
08-08-2008, 06:52 PM
#1
Counting cards....
Is it actually legal then? I know you can get into big trouble if you are caught counting cards in a casino, but it's not against the law right? So I guess then it's just the casino's that don't want you to do it cos they get fleeced?
Surely if it's not illegal then they can't STOP you doing it? Can they "bar" you from a casino if you are suspected/found to be counting cards?
Only ask as I watched "21" last night (good film, but long!) and it made me wonder.....
Surely if it's not illegal then they can't STOP you doing it? Can they "bar" you from a casino if you are suspected/found to be counting cards?
Only ask as I watched "21" last night (good film, but long!) and it made me wonder.....
08-08-2008, 08:10 PM
#4
Professional Waffler
but the mad thing is,,counting cards doesnt mean your going to win, its just increases your odds, which is something which is normally in the casinos favor LOL
08-08-2008, 09:01 PM
#6
PassionFord Post Troll
its basically illegal. not worth attempting at all. apart from having to be extremely clever to do the counting, you'd have to be a gifted actor to pull it off too.
its common knowledge that you can't walk from one casino to another without seeing somebody reading a book on card counting.
its common knowledge that you can't walk from one casino to another without seeing somebody reading a book on card counting.
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08-08-2008, 09:15 PM
#8
if you liked the film, read 2 books called "bringing down the house" & "busting vegas" excellent books by Ben Mezrich
counting card isnt illegal, however the casinos dont like it for obvious reasons. if you dont count cards the house have a very slight advantage over you...if you can count a 6 deck of cards you swing the odds slightly in your favour.
counting card isnt illegal, however the casinos dont like it for obvious reasons. if you dont count cards the house have a very slight advantage over you...if you can count a 6 deck of cards you swing the odds slightly in your favour.
Last edited by LHD220Turbo; 08-08-2008 at 09:16 PM.
08-08-2008, 11:01 PM
#10
its basically illegal. not worth attempting at all. apart from having to be extremely clever to do the counting, you'd have to be a gifted actor to pull it off too.
its common knowledge that you can't walk from one casino to another without seeing somebody reading a book on card counting.
its common knowledge that you can't walk from one casino to another without seeing somebody reading a book on card counting.
08-08-2008, 11:06 PM
#11
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counting cards is a real problem for casinos and big poker tournaments- my mate can flick through a pack and then recite the entire deck before he turns them over- very impressive to watch him do it 
we had to start using two decks when playing poker with him as he was honest and admitted he was winning alot cus he was card counting!
we had to start using two decks when playing poker with him as he was honest and admitted he was winning alot cus he was card counting!
08-08-2008, 11:13 PM
#14
Maria, basically its tracking the ratio of high and low cards in a deck. its alot more complicated than that but commonly used in the game of blackjack
edited to say: if your really bored, google is your friend.......
edited to say: if your really bored, google is your friend.......
Last edited by LHD220Turbo; 08-08-2008 at 11:15 PM.
08-08-2008, 11:19 PM
#16
if you lay low bets for 10 consecutive rounds and then lay a massive bet down because you know the high cards are coming round (cos you've been counting them in your head) its looks a little suss
Last edited by LHD220Turbo; 08-08-2008 at 11:21 PM.
08-08-2008, 11:24 PM
#18
if you've got nothing better to do then have a ganders at this http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Card_counting
but i'm off to bed!
but i'm off to bed!
08-08-2008, 11:26 PM
#19
Ria - if someone is constantly winning high stakes on black jack, which unless you are counting is purely a game of chance, then you become "watched". They then watch the people around you to see if signs are being used to indicate it's an organised "counting session".
If you're doing it on your own (even harder) then you'll be watched from table to table, since as it's more or less a game of chance, the odd's someone winning big on every game is so remote, you must be counting to do it.
(from Wikipedia) The principle behind counting cards in blackjack is that a deck of cards with a high proportion of high cards (ten-valued cards and aces) to low cards is good for the player, while the reverse (a deck with a high proportion of low cards to high cards) is good for the dealer. A deck rich in tens and aces improves the player's odds because blackjacks (which offer a higher payout than other winning hands) become more common, the dealer is more likely to bust a stiff hand, and double-downs are more successful.
Contrary to the popular myth, card counters do not need savant qualities in order to count cards, because they are not tracking and memorizing specific cards. Instead, card counters assign a heuristic point score to each card they see and then track only the total score. (This score is called the count.) This myth was portrayed in the movie Rain Man, where the savant character Raymond Babbit counts through six decks with ease and a casino employee comments that it is impossible to count six decks. In the movie 21, however, card counting is portrayed as a very intelligent task which can only be undertaken by high-IQ top level students.
Basic card counting assigns a positive, negative, or null value to each card. As each card is dealt, the running count is adjusted by each card's assigned value. There are multiple card-counting systems in use, but a plus-minus count — such as the Hi-Lo system proposed by Harvey Dubner in 1963 and later refined by Julian Braun and Stanford Wong — is one of the more basic and illustrative systems.
In the Hi-Lo system, the cards 2 through 6 are assigned a value of +1. Tens (and face cards) through aces are assigned a value of -1. Cards 7, 8, and 9 have a value of zero, or are called neutral (so they can be ignored).
The Hi-Lo system is an example of a balanced card-counting system, in it there are an equal number of +1 and -1 cards in the deck, so a count of all 52 cards would result in an end count of 0.
If you're doing it on your own (even harder) then you'll be watched from table to table, since as it's more or less a game of chance, the odd's someone winning big on every game is so remote, you must be counting to do it.
(from Wikipedia) The principle behind counting cards in blackjack is that a deck of cards with a high proportion of high cards (ten-valued cards and aces) to low cards is good for the player, while the reverse (a deck with a high proportion of low cards to high cards) is good for the dealer. A deck rich in tens and aces improves the player's odds because blackjacks (which offer a higher payout than other winning hands) become more common, the dealer is more likely to bust a stiff hand, and double-downs are more successful.
Contrary to the popular myth, card counters do not need savant qualities in order to count cards, because they are not tracking and memorizing specific cards. Instead, card counters assign a heuristic point score to each card they see and then track only the total score. (This score is called the count.) This myth was portrayed in the movie Rain Man, where the savant character Raymond Babbit counts through six decks with ease and a casino employee comments that it is impossible to count six decks. In the movie 21, however, card counting is portrayed as a very intelligent task which can only be undertaken by high-IQ top level students.
Basic card counting assigns a positive, negative, or null value to each card. As each card is dealt, the running count is adjusted by each card's assigned value. There are multiple card-counting systems in use, but a plus-minus count — such as the Hi-Lo system proposed by Harvey Dubner in 1963 and later refined by Julian Braun and Stanford Wong — is one of the more basic and illustrative systems.
In the Hi-Lo system, the cards 2 through 6 are assigned a value of +1. Tens (and face cards) through aces are assigned a value of -1. Cards 7, 8, and 9 have a value of zero, or are called neutral (so they can be ignored).
The Hi-Lo system is an example of a balanced card-counting system, in it there are an equal number of +1 and -1 cards in the deck, so a count of all 52 cards would result in an end count of 0.
08-08-2008, 11:41 PM
#20
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Anyone capable of reliably counting cards (normaly 4 decks) and is not illegal, though obviously gaming establishments only like practices which favour the house. Hence the stories of card counters being thrown out and often given a clump.
But card counting only gives the player better odds and help predict the likelyhood of being dealt strong cards, and so bet accordingly.
If you can resist the greed 'Demon' then you can get away with it, like i'm certain 1000's do regularly.
But card counting only gives the player better odds and help predict the likelyhood of being dealt strong cards, and so bet accordingly.
If you can resist the greed 'Demon' then you can get away with it, like i'm certain 1000's do regularly.
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