Redeye Jedi

Well as some of you know ive got a bit of an issue with the Norfolk Police at the moment, the original thread is linked below but i thought id start a new one as its going on a bit!

https://passionford.com/forum/viewto...161&highlight=

After recieving a summons a month or so ago, i had my court appearance on Monday just gone......

It had already been ajourned once on instruction from the solicitor i visited, i was then under the impression that the hearing on Monday would be the final one and would produce some sort of result! How wrong i was!!

Booked a day off as the hearing was at 2pm and i knew it was going to take a while, got there early (1.35pm) then had to sit around until 14:55pm before i got into court! Once in there was told that this was certainly not the final visit id have to make and this hearing was just to set a date for the trial!! I confirmed my plea of "Not Guilty" and a date was set (26th October) for the trial!!

During this hearing several points were discussed, including what witnesses would be present. Of course both the officers in question will appear as witnesses, however only 1 of them has made a statement, bearing in mind it happened in May i think this is ridiculous! The discussion continued and resulted in the Magistrate giving a 14 day deadline to produce the 2nd statement.

So now i have to wait until the end of October for the "Final Trial" where i shall appear with the 2 officers and attempt to obtain some sort of justice for myself! What a fucking ball ache!

R5FORD

iTrader: (1)

timewasting as usual

Christian and Beccy

iTrader: (14)

It's this kind of thing that makes me tar ALL coppers with the same brush, I'm afraid.

The hard bit, and the bit that worries me the most is that no matter how innocent you are, coppers DO lie, my case proved that.

As I said to you before, just stay up their arses about this statement and if it doesn't appear in time, ask the CPS to get the case thrown out.

DanCossie

iTrader: (1)

good luck either way mate...but fingers crossed it gets thrown out

simon170

Bunch of gits

StephenC

when its over can you not claim for costs i.e. time WASTED on it?

Christian and Beccy

iTrader: (14)

Neil, also, with the Court Clerk pointing out how busy Coppers are, as to why he hasn't done his statement yet, make sure you raise a concern about the accuracy of the statement and the information contained within it, if the said copper was so busy he couldn't do the statement and now more than 4 months have passed since the event.

MAD EVO 4

fingers crossed for you mate

Redeye Jedi

Too true! Im gonna use everything possible!

Charlie Chalk

iTrader: (1)

I still love you, Jail bird

Redeye Jedi

PMSL! I hope your gonna visit me inside!

Charlie Chalk

iTrader: (1)

Litterally!

JohnnyB

the copers needed a couple of detections before the end of the month, so they thought they would hit on you as most people would just pay.

bobfish

I wouldnt have given them my phone. I would have told them to arrest me and take me down to the station if they really thought i was using my mobile and i wasnt.

I'd then proceed to prove to them i wasnt on the phone by showing them call records and my phone bills and sue the fuck out of the bastards.

Christian and Beccy

iTrader: (14)

But they have inspected the phone and found nothing. So, even if they shouldn't have done it, it should have proven conclusively his innocence.

Along with O2 being able to prove that it wasn't used at that time.

tabetha

CPS don't work as they should though, they will try to use you as an example, that is why they are digging in, if the police have any evidence of your innocence, then they have not given it to cps which is standard practice, as cps would not run it otherwise.
Your solicitor should have all the evidence to be submitted under the "ADVANCE DISCLOSURE RULES", kick his arse and make him do his job correctly.
Under certain circumstances the cps/police can legally withold information/evidence that is in your favour to ensure a miscarriage of justice, in thier favour but that comes under the terrorism laws, they are increasingly using this as a excuse when stopping people so they have wider ranging powers, it's called abuse but the police will get away with it in norfolk, as the courts are mostly in thier pocket.
You certainly have grounds to ask for the 2nd coppers evidence to be declared NON PRIMA FACEA, due to the history of it.
tabetha

Redeye Jedi

Did u read any of the previous thread? Why should i be arrested after already being humiliated at the side of the road by these 2 officers? Why should i spend all evening in some shitty cell? Obviously i tried to prove i wasnt, but they had taken my phone before i had the chance!

Christian and Beccy

iTrader: (14)

Surely Non Prima Facie requires a longer period of time though to have passed, more than the 4 months in question here?

Redeye Jedi

I have already contacted the CPS and requested the information under the "Advance Disclosure act.." all recieved with the exception of the 2nd statement! I requested "Prosecution Witness Statements" and "Schedule of Unused material" which i think covers what you have said above!!

I will definately be looking at asking them to write off the 2nd statement due to the length of time its taken to produce! I need to know what this "Non Prima Facea" means really!! Now on google!

Christian and Beccy

iTrader: (14)

Neil, it just worries me that even though both you and I know you are innocent of this, that doesn't guarantee you won't get found guilty of it. If you do, they may hit you harder than if you had just taken the wrap in the first place. I'm not suggesting that you do this, but you need to know the possible outcomes.

Either way, being clear and concise in court and focussed without being balshy is the way forward. Be prepared (as I know you already are) and have all the information bullet-pointed on a note-pad.

Christian and Beccy

iTrader: (14)

BTW, Neil, if you are Googling, you will need the correct spelling, which I think you will find is how I spelt it!!

Redeye Jedi

I really dont know what to do, i understand what your saying but i really dont want to back down! I cant afford to have points on my licence, especially as i havent done anything wrong!

Christian and Beccy

iTrader: (14)

I'm not trying to suggest you give in and pull your pants down, more than you need to always know in the back of your mind that you could get shafted, so that's why you must not be complacent.

Don't assume that just because you are innocent that it will go your way. God I hope it does, but it's not a certainty.

I remember sitting in Crown Court for my case (it ended up there in the end) and before we gave evidence, the fuckhead coppers had given theirs and you could already see the Judge shaking his head, it wouldn't have mattered what we said, he had found us guilty in his mind before we even spoke.

Lambchop

iTrader: (1)

unbelievable!

are you paying your own legal fees too?

i dont see how they can convict you when your service provider can prove you didnt use the phone!

Christian and Beccy

iTrader: (14)

That's right. Neil used the phone around 30 mins before he was caught. The provider can document that, also they took the phone there and then, so it cannot be suggested that he messed with it.

Yet, still the fuckers are trying for it.

The case is clear and should never have come this far.

I think it's the attitude of the coppers that has added fuel to the fire too. They were the same with mine, totally unreasonable.

Redeye Jedi

Generally as above!! But im trying to keep costs to a minimum, only Ł53 for 10 mins of the solicitors time as yet! Hoping not to use him again....

Its fucking ridiculous!

Benni

Good luck with it all mate, I hope you get justice!

dojj

iTrader: (3)

sounds like ti means don't let the shit hit your face

but i know all about miscarriages of the law and getting shafted, all thsoe years ago when my cousin and his mates got put away for beating up a load of staff who'd started on them all because they were black belts and put proper pain into their blows while the waiters were only throwing chairs and tables about the place to try and hit them or the time when the guy clambered through the window of the bus i was driving, over his car bonnet, whackde me in the side of the head and yet i was still charged with either not being in crontol of the vehicle or criminal damage bceause no one saw him hit me even though the side of my face had a big bruise on it, or the time the other year when fuck nugget olf cunty flaps oap hit me up the arse on a slip road and then, just when it was a clear and cut case for my side he goes and pulls out "i was taking these 2 little old ladies back home form the airport and they can verify where we were when teh accident happened" even though in his statement he said that he was going faster than me which is why he hit me up the arse but he was still slowing down for the speed camera at the end of the slip road

legal system is a fucking joke in this country

SapphyMike

sounds like a fine use of our tax payers money! FFS

Hope you win this and get your chance to screw the fuckers!!!!!

percybigun

norfolk traffic police are well crooked mate, they need investigating by the powers that be.

RWD_cossie_wil

iTrader: (9)

have you contacted the press reference this?

And coppers wonder why NO ONE has any respect for them??

89xr2

Hope you get it all sorted. If not i'll bake you a lovely little cake with a file inside for when they stick you in mousehold. On the plus side you'll have a lovely view out over Norwich at night

Redeye Jedi

Ive tried by e-mail but had no response! Im assuming they are not interested, however i am still considering phoning them to see what they say!

Adrian

And what pearl of wisdom is that based upon.

Rob84

Hope it all goes well for ya buddy!! got my fingers crossed.

tabetha

My spelling can be a bit dodgy!!
The point I was making is any judge/jp will not look kindly on the cps if one officer does not comment, and this can be used in your favour.
The majority of Norfolk coppers are ok but a lot are bent and corrupt, in my(extensive) experience traffic cops are normally the better ones(in norfolk at least) but of course there are exceptions.
PRIMA FACIE, at FIRST sight based on FIRST impression.
4 months later is from memory, notes absolutely have to be made at the the time of the incident, this is the reason they are all issued with a notebook, it weill cast serious doubt in the mind of the judge/jp as the accuracy of the plod.
tabetha

Lambchop

iTrader: (1)

just do it from a landline eh!

tabetha

The best of luck in your case anyway, let's just hope you get a decent result.
tabetha

Redeye Jedi

Well for those that have taken an interest in this, it is still going on!

Ive since appeared at the Magistrates Court, however although the summons stated this to be the "Final Hearing", i was soon told it was only being heard to prepare a date for the actual "Final Hearing" to take place......

Anyhow whilst in court, the issue of statements came up. Obviously as there are 2 officers acting as witnesses against me there should be 2 statements, but only 1 of them had made a statement!! The court then instructed the prosecution to have the second statement with me withing 2 weeks!! I have now recieved the statement, but bearing in mind the incident was mid May, the second officers statement is dated 19/09/07!!! What a joke, how can they possibly say that is accurate!

Further to this, i had already requested in a previous letter the following information....

1) Copies of ALL prosecution witness statements
2) Copies of report of "Technical Analysis"

So upon my request i only actually recieved 1 of the statements, and NO report (I was told several times that they could NOT provide me with this report!!). So surely they should have sorted BOTH statements and the report there and then?!

Anyhow further still, i have now recieved a letter from the CPS which is accompanied by the illusive test report (Proving my innocence against the charge applied).

Also they have stated in the letter that they are offering me an "Alternative Charge", this alt. charge being "Driving <MY CAR> along <A ROAD> when you were not in such a position that you could have proper control of the vehicle"

Now this really baffles me, why would they wait until now to offer me this?! Ive already appeared once and its been 5 months since the original penalty was issued!!

Im guessing they are clutching for straws as the lack of evidence does nothing for them in the original offence!

Any further views on this would be appreciated!