M K

iTrader: (9)

same as this




im using this 1 to adjust my ignition using the red dial?

what does the blue dial do?

fancy getting 1 of my own obviously not with these trim dials

this 1 borrowed from my tuner

M K

iTrader: (9)

what should i expect to pay for a pectel unit?

PROMETHEUS

iTrader: (1)

Ł300 to Ł500

jon@work

iTrader: (5)

Ł300 would be a bargain

RS500/364

Ebay Ł550 the last one sold for !!

M K

iTrader: (9)

will have a word with tommy then as his wiring guru - jon of MWS, has about 10 monitors in bits & said he can make me 1 up to suit

Dave Henshall

can i wake this thread up

is there any detailed info about the collins monitor about - i cant find any

do we have a definitive answer to what data stream it uses? and if any ecu mods are necessary. ie - will it work with my MSD chip and MSD/SECS coilpackl driver in my P8 without mods?

foreigneRS

Dave Henshall

99% sure

it uses the same datastream as pectel so that it is 'backwards compatible' with people's old chips.

no monitor will work with a p8 that has not had the comms chip enabled by modding the board as shown earlier on the thread

Dave Henshall

so on a P8, there is a seperate comms chip that need enabling - or just the main 'chip' needs the data stream enabling (if it isnt already)? is that right?

Dave Henshall

from the RP labs site:

Enabling Pectel Datastream P8 ECU, no babyboard 4002-3 $ask

Łask



is it a simple procudure - like soldering a link in or similar - or its a a software thing..?

Rippers

Dave I have the diagram for the P8 mod will send you it later

Dave Henshall

cheers paul -

so can i get this straight - on a p8 to connect a pectel/colins type monitor - you have to have the ecu modded (as per pauls instructions) AND the main chip has to have pectel compatible data stream enabled in it?

the original

Exactly.
(by main chip you mean the removable eprom with the map and program in, rather than the soldered in main processor)

Dave Henshall

yep


so why is the p8 this way? what comms capabilities does it have without the mod? none? what's the reason for disabling it in the first place? or is it just ford p8s that are..?

Dave Henshall

so,,,,,

is the mod to the p8 to enable it for pectel compatible coms? as in it has its own webber comms already enabled that could be used if there were a compatible monitor?.....

am i getting warm..?

Franco

iTrader: (2)

Dunno about warm Dave...........

But you've lost me!


Here you go mate!

polly_x

iTrader: (2)

Dave, in terms of giving you an answer with real life examples.

I am using a P8 with Pectal ALS board. Had the small mod done to the P8 that it needs for any monitor to work. (Cut one track I think is all). Comms enabled in the MAP and a Collins monitor. Works Fine.

Hope that helps.

GARETH T

i paid ahmed 60 quid to do that,, dont tell me thats all

PROMETHEUS

iTrader: (1)

yep thats all, if you sent it to pectel it would have been a ton

Billabong

To be fair, whilst it's a simple mod' if you know exactly what to do (which most people didn't before this thread ), if anything goes wrong they've got to fix or replace the ECU at their cost.....

Dave Henshall

thanks polly x

so to sum up: (i think i've got it now)

the p8 has its own serial coms protocol - that if a monitor was available from webber-marelli woud work with no mods.

BUT as there is no monitor available, the options are a pectel monitor (or collins which uses the same protocols) and to get it to work requires a small mod to the ecu to allow it to work with the pecel/collins monitors and the chip that is installed has to have pectel coms enabled - if you have a pectel board - this is a feature you already have, if you are running anothr type of chip (like MSD, etc) the chip has to contain pectel compatible comms/datastream for it to work aswell.

the other option is the RPlabs software, which works in the same way, (stu or foreignrs , correct me on if i'm wrong) but they have reverse engineered the system themsevles and use their own protocolm and although looks like a pectel one, is different and the chip needs to contain the correct encoding software to output the correct datastream to the coms chip on the ecu for connection to the rplabs software..?

so looking at the p8 ecu mod, does it chnage the mode from rs232 to rs422 or vice versa.

on a different note though, if the p8 has some comms capability as std, why did webber-marelli never make their own monitor (be it a standalone unit or a pc based program) or is it not a comms protocol al all, and it can only output sensor fault codes that can be read via a fault code reader which although is usefull, is no use for streaming live data out.

where's stu and foreignrs when you need them

jon@work

iTrader: (5)

marelli do do their own monitors

for their current stuff


http://www.mmcompsys.com/motorsportsdigitekdrivers.html

for their older stuff, ebay

Dave Henshall

ah, thats for a CAN based system, all newer ecus are either CAN and/or OBDCII compliant so streaming data off is easy anyway,

i've never seen a webber/marelli monitor - they do a hand held tester that checks individual sensors - but not a multui sensor display that does readings and logs faults

Stu @ M Developments

iTrader: (12)

I will try and reply later as its not as cut and dried as you think sadly.

Damo V

SECS Monitors are the nuts.... I only bought a Pectel aswell because Ive always wanted one ROFL... was more than happ with my SECS

Dave Henshall

doh,

not to worry though, i like a challenge sometimes the best way of understanding how things work is doing it the hard way

foreigneRS

Dave Henshall the rplabs monitor software works with the pectel datastream, the same as any pectel or collins monitor

they have a different datastream only for their ecu conversions that is faster and contains more information to be able to send and receive data during a live connection that can also write to portions of the map

hope that helps a little in your quest for learning

on the other thread, it's not my place to answer as i am not involved in any way in the sale or marketing of the rplabs products

all i would say is that if you want a monitor to be placed permantly in the car for the purposes of looking bling, either have a pectel or collins, or run the rplabs software on a built in carputer. if you want to give it an occassional health check, or datalog and scope to find a problem that you have felt when driving, then the rplabs monitor on a laptop is the ideal solution due to lower cost and increased functionality.

GARETH T

i asked everywhere before i got the mod done and no one would tell me everyone knows i love having a go myself

foreigneRS

GARETH T are you surprised when they can make Ł60 for 5 minutes work?

isn't knowledge sharing on the internet a wonderful thing for the consumer

Billabong

I know you do Gareth , but you didn't ask me (I suspect you had yours done a long while ago, and before mine was done)

Nick, yes it is, except when a less competent DIY'er fubar's it and then blames poor info

Dave Henshall

so is there any added or lacking functionality from a collins monitor to the std p8 rplab software(non ajustable version)

both paths need the ecu modding,

is there a pectel datastream version of the p8 rplab software, or is the only p8 route, their modded p8 route?

so many questions - i feel thirsty

GARETH T

Billabong
foreigneRS


it was years ago,,, when i didnt know many people in the trade

60 quid for 5 mins work,,, i gotta work 8 hours for that

Dave Henshall

doh!

another reason why i have no quarms whatsoever about paying Ł20 a year for use of this fantastic site

polly_x

iTrader: (2)

Dave, ive got all the original official Pectel documentation and software release notes here if you wanna PM me any questions and fancy doing it yourself.

Its so old its like a scroll!!!!

foreigneRS

they basically read the same parameters, as that is what is in the datastream. a standalone monitor lacks the ability to scope the data and datalogging is not as convenient. but they essentially do the same thing. i don't know how a collins monitor reports sensor errors, but with the click of a button, the monitor software will show you a sensor fault as a red light next to the sensor in the list



additionally, reading the information from stu on the other thread, the rplabs monitor software also has the ability to operate each actuator in the list (fuel pump etc) to test them - as well as being able to reset the P8 ecu correctly i don't think the collins monitor can do that?

correct

it's one and the same thing. the "rplab monitor" standalone software that stu started this post about only reads the 'pectel' datastream.

the monitor part of the software is also included with the live mapping software that is used with the rplab modded ecu's, maybe that is what is confusing you?

polly_x

iTrader: (2)

The Collins monitor reports sensor errors the same as a Pectel. Simple screen with the name of the sensor(s) that are faulty.

Dave Henshall

thanks guys,

nick: yep , i know what you mean about the modded ' mappable ' ecu now - i was getting them mixed up

polly: ive got a pic of the chip area on teh p8 that need the mods and digital pic of a copy of the instructions from paul ripley - but thanks anyway,


i think the RPlabs route is the way just need to find out a bit more about the security side of it - as in how easy is it to move from one laptop to another (as i use loan laptops from work - i dont have a designated one that is mine to use every time i need to take one home )

and for an extra 50 quid, the rplabs does datalogging, which is a very usefull thing IMO, as you may not see a fault if its intermitant and happens very fast...

Franco

iTrader: (2)

Yes but as you've said Dave the RPlabs needs a laptop in situ where as the monitors can be mounted on the dash permanantly!

Dont get me wrong the RPLabs software looked spot on, but just wasnt what i was looking for personally!

Dave Henshall

i know what your saying - it would be nice to have a flush fitting dash mounted unit or a single DIN unit that fits under the radio in the spare slot and reads in the pectel datastream as opposed to the original secs monitor like the one simon said would be availablesome while back - but no disrespect to simon, i dont think it will be on sale in the near future, so we can only go off what is available now,

if i decide to go down the rplab route - i'll be looking into linking it to my pda - if the data is available as a datastream into windows, im sure something can be done to link it to the pda.... challenge time

foreigneRS

not easy. rplabs are quite serious about trying to protect their software from being copied. when you get the software, a small program needs to be run that takes a digital fingerprint of your computer and emails a small text file of the details to rplabs. from that information, a key code is generated that you input when installing the software. to run it on another computer would mean having to do that process again, which looks like you could have copied it and are just getting the code for the copy.

as you suggest, if there was a way to do it over net so that only one machine at a time is used, that could be a solution. but, equally, it could also be 2 copies or more that are just not used at the same time.