FAO: any potential RP Labs Users
14-08-2006, 08:24 AM
#48
I have indeed got the costs, but just to explain these before hand (as I know you're all going to whinge 
). Because they have to be shipped backwards and forwards to Europe and the money has to be transferred to an account in Eastern Europe, all of which adds a large mount of money to the cost. Also, it needs to have a suitable amount on to enable trade discount to be given to the tuners (so they can actually earn something from it, otherwise why would they chose to use it if they have to pay the same as Joe Public?) and also it needs enough money on to cover any technical queries that will all be directed through Harvey (where a response will be given immediately or at the worse case scenario if it has to be referred to RP Labs, within 24 hours). It only needs Harvey to be on the phone for a few hours over a period of time - answering one person's queries - to wipe all the profit, as his time is money.
ECU mod for mapper, PC Software, communication lead (pro package) is £640 + VAT + delivery of ECU to Germany. This price would be subject to customer providing a working std L8 ECU with a standard board fitted.
The software package is configured to a lap top, but subsequent ECUs are then £480 + VAT + delivery to Germany (which can be mapped from your lap top).
Dizzyless is an extra £70 + VAT option and needs to be specified at time of ordering.
Trade is £540 + VAT for the full kit and £480 + VAT for the ECUs thereafter.
Obviously, it appears initially VERY expensive, until you compare it with equivalent ECUs - for example, Pectel T2, which is £700 + VAT. You then need a new loom to suit - £350 minimum from Ryan, then you find it only supports high impedence injectors - another additional cost.
At the moment we are tied by the scale of supply and demand for the ECU. I have suggested that RP Labs reduce the cost of the ECU in order to give a greater turn-over and reach his break-even point later, but they have sunk so much money into the development of this product, that they need to see a return ASAP (which is understandable).
I hope this clarifies. Sorry for the delay in responding, but I very rarely come on the net at weekends and only usually to check PMs that I am expecting.
This is not a cheap product with no back up, this is a professional system, with professional people dealing with it, with the back-up I know you have come to expect from anything I deal with. It is still cheaper than all the other ECUs on the market (especially for the Pro-market), when you add all the other things that you need to sort with the other ECUs. Also, the user friendliness of this product is better (IMO), than all other similar priced ECUs.
It will also be able to support ALS and 8-injectors at a later date (once RP Labs have got back some of their development costs to enable further investment).
If you have any queries about the above, give me a call or drop me an email
.
). Because they have to be shipped backwards and forwards to Europe and the money has to be transferred to an account in Eastern Europe, all of which adds a large mount of money to the cost. Also, it needs to have a suitable amount on to enable trade discount to be given to the tuners (so they can actually earn something from it, otherwise why would they chose to use it if they have to pay the same as Joe Public?) and also it needs enough money on to cover any technical queries that will all be directed through Harvey (where a response will be given immediately or at the worse case scenario if it has to be referred to RP Labs, within 24 hours). It only needs Harvey to be on the phone for a few hours over a period of time - answering one person's queries - to wipe all the profit, as his time is money. ECU mod for mapper, PC Software, communication lead (pro package) is £640 + VAT + delivery of ECU to Germany. This price would be subject to customer providing a working std L8 ECU with a standard board fitted.
The software package is configured to a lap top, but subsequent ECUs are then £480 + VAT + delivery to Germany (which can be mapped from your lap top).
Dizzyless is an extra £70 + VAT option and needs to be specified at time of ordering.
Trade is £540 + VAT for the full kit and £480 + VAT for the ECUs thereafter.
Obviously, it appears initially VERY expensive, until you compare it with equivalent ECUs - for example, Pectel T2, which is £700 + VAT. You then need a new loom to suit - £350 minimum from Ryan, then you find it only supports high impedence injectors - another additional cost.
At the moment we are tied by the scale of supply and demand for the ECU. I have suggested that RP Labs reduce the cost of the ECU in order to give a greater turn-over and reach his break-even point later, but they have sunk so much money into the development of this product, that they need to see a return ASAP (which is understandable).
I hope this clarifies. Sorry for the delay in responding, but I very rarely come on the net at weekends and only usually to check PMs that I am expecting.
This is not a cheap product with no back up, this is a professional system, with professional people dealing with it, with the back-up I know you have come to expect from anything I deal with. It is still cheaper than all the other ECUs on the market (especially for the Pro-market), when you add all the other things that you need to sort with the other ECUs. Also, the user friendliness of this product is better (IMO), than all other similar priced ECUs.
It will also be able to support ALS and 8-injectors at a later date (once RP Labs have got back some of their development costs to enable further investment).
If you have any queries about the above, give me a call or drop me an email
.
14-08-2006, 09:34 AM
#50
Testing the future
Good reply Mike, and I agree that it is an excellent product for the price. 
When you factor in the features that are available, and will become available, like closed loop fuelling, distributorless iginition, ALS etc, it looks good value when you compare the cost of those features (where possible) to be added to a std L8 in the form of add on boards etc
I also believe that the software is very user friendly, although I do not have that much experience of other manufacturers software. Perhaps Chip could comment?
When you factor in the features that are available, and will become available, like closed loop fuelling, distributorless iginition, ALS etc, it looks good value when you compare the cost of those features (where possible) to be added to a std L8 in the form of add on boards etc
I also believe that the software is very user friendly, although I do not have that much experience of other manufacturers software. Perhaps Chip could comment?
14-08-2006, 09:44 AM
#51
Originally Posted by foreigneRS
Good reply Mike, and I agree that it is an excellent product for the price.
When you factor in the features that are available, and will become available, like closed loop fuelling, distributorless iginition, ALS etc, it looks good value when you compare the cost of those features (where possible) to be added to a std L8 in the form of add on boards etc
When you factor in the features that are available, and will become available, like closed loop fuelling, distributorless iginition, ALS etc, it looks good value when you compare the cost of those features (where possible) to be added to a std L8 in the form of add on boards etc
Originally Posted by foreigneRS
I also believe that the software is very user friendly, although I do not have that much experience of other manufacturers software. Perhaps Chip could comment?
Most logical thing to compare it to is probably the SECS as thats the only other "direct replacement" ecu for a cossie that im aware of.
I hope Simon doesnt mind the critism of his product but the RP Labs just seems more "polished" the software is very slick and it just has a very professional feel to it.
The daft thing is that i suspect the SECS is actually far better spec hardware wise in reality than a modified L8, it certainly has more mapping points and i bet there is more spare processor power left over for future upgrades too, but the RP Labs one doesnt have the niggles with transient fuelling or software that feels out of date etc, it just feels "finished" where as the SECS has the feel of a really powerful product but thats only 75% finished so far
Just my opinon based on owning both, no offence meant to either party.
14-08-2006, 09:54 AM
#52
PassionFord Post Troll
If you add in the coil pack add on (everyone should go for that - and all other aftermarkets have the facility) you are looking at a whopping £1140.
Probably is a good product, but that price tag bangs you up in direct competition with some good ECUs from the likes of DTA, Pectel and Autronic, and much more that other good ECUS such as KMS and MBE, all of which are likely to have more features.
I was thinking it was going to be around the £600 mark which would have made it one of the best mods for a cossie available in my book. For that money you would have sold 1000s of units.
Probably is a good product, but that price tag bangs you up in direct competition with some good ECUs from the likes of DTA, Pectel and Autronic, and much more that other good ECUS such as KMS and MBE, all of which are likely to have more features.
I was thinking it was going to be around the £600 mark which would have made it one of the best mods for a cossie available in my book. For that money you would have sold 1000s of units.
14-08-2006, 10:10 AM
#53
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so hvae i missed something....
why is this so much more expensive than the one stu is selling- or is stus the JUST the monitor that can only make tempory ajustments to the map (pro version),?
why is this so much more expensive than the one stu is selling- or is stus the JUST the monitor that can only make tempory ajustments to the map (pro version),?
14-08-2006, 10:13 AM
#54
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chip-3door,
Dont mind the valid comments at all mate.
If I had half the investment and the promises were kept to me then things
would have been very different 2 years ago !
Watch this space though... I have sold the product to a major company
who intend to develop it to its full potential.
Will be on display at National day....
Dont mind the valid comments at all mate.
If I had half the investment and the promises were kept to me then things
would have been very different 2 years ago !
Watch this space though... I have sold the product to a major company
who intend to develop it to its full potential.
Will be on display at National day....
14-08-2006, 10:19 AM
#55
Originally Posted by Dave Henshall
so hvae i missed something....
why is this so much more expensive than the one Stu is selling- or is stus the JUST the monitor that can only make tempory ajustments to the map (pro version),?
why is this so much more expensive than the one Stu is selling- or is stus the JUST the monitor that can only make tempory ajustments to the map (pro version),?
This is a fully live mappable ECU with complete and total control over the ECU like a tuner would normally change for you.
14-08-2006, 10:21 AM
#56
Testing the future
Originally Posted by Garage19
I was thinking it was going to be around the £600 mark which would have made it one of the best mods for a cossie available in my book. For that money you would have sold 1000s of units.
14-08-2006, 10:24 AM
#57
Originally Posted by SECS
chip-3door,
Dont mind the valid comments at all mate.
If I had half the investment and the promises were kept to me then things
would have been very different 2 years ago !
Watch this space though... I have sold the product to a major company
who intend to develop it to its full potential.
Will be on display at National day....
Dont mind the valid comments at all mate.
If I had half the investment and the promises were kept to me then things
would have been very different 2 years ago !
Watch this space though... I have sold the product to a major company
who intend to develop it to its full potential.
Will be on display at National day....
transient fuelling issues doug experienced
this one has nice monitor software
this one has a better mapping interface
Those are all things im sure you could sort fairly easily, so if you can do that, and (probably more difficult to do) convince people that you have a decent customer service package (i had no problems myself of course, but others seem to have) then maybe you can finally realise the potential of your ECU too at last.
Sadly though having Mike as a competitor rather than a partner has probably done you no favours in the cossie scene, so its a shame all these things couldnt have been sorted out years ago (for whatever reason, ive no idea of the details of how you have been messed around etc)
14-08-2006, 10:29 AM
#58
Originally Posted by Garage19
If you add in the coil pack add on (everyone should go for that - and all other aftermarkets have the facility) you are looking at a whopping £1140.
Probably is a good product, but that price tag bangs you up in direct competition with some good ECUs from the likes of DTA, Pectel and Autronic, and much more that other good ECUS such as KMS and MBE, all of which are likely to have more features.
I was thinking it was going to be around the £600 mark which would have made it one of the best mods for a cossie available in my book. For that money you would have sold 1000s of units.
Probably is a good product, but that price tag bangs you up in direct competition with some good ECUs from the likes of DTA, Pectel and Autronic, and much more that other good ECUS such as KMS and MBE, all of which are likely to have more features.
I was thinking it was going to be around the £600 mark which would have made it one of the best mods for a cossie available in my book. For that money you would have sold 1000s of units.
However, I am in discussions with RP Labs on how to make the product more accessible, and the prices may change if we can come to an agreement on the break-even point
.Obviously the sticking point is the necessity to keep the trade and retail prices different enough to attract the tuners into using the product. I only know one way to keep the disparity AND reduce the cost, as there NEEDS to be a difference. I am waiting to see if Nikola agrees
.This is another reason I was trying to delay publishing costs, as we wanted every avenue explored first, but you impatient buggers forced my hand
.
14-08-2006, 01:06 PM
#64
Originally Posted by chip-3door
Just to simplify then............
So its basically 710+VAT+postage to germany then for what most people would want?
Ie £850 or so?
So its basically 710+VAT+postage to germany then for what most people would want?
Ie £850 or so?
Is in the CURRENT issue of PF with blue Norwegian 3-door on front.
14-08-2006, 01:13 PM
#65
Originally Posted by Mike Rainbird
Originally Posted by chip-3door
Just to simplify then............
So its basically 710+VAT+postage to germany then for what most people would want?
Ie £850 or so?
So its basically 710+VAT+postage to germany then for what most people would want?
Ie £850 or so?
Is in the CURRENT issue of PF with blue Norwegian 3-door on front.
14-08-2006, 02:21 PM
#66
Originally Posted by chip-3door
Just to simplify then............
So its basically 710+VAT+postage to germany then for what most people would want?
Ie £850 or so?
So its basically 710+VAT+postage to germany then for what most people would want?
Ie £850 or so?
14-08-2006, 02:25 PM
#68
Originally Posted by CossieRich
Originally Posted by chip-3door
Just to simplify then............
So its basically 710+VAT+postage to germany then for what most people would want?
Ie £850 or so?
So its basically 710+VAT+postage to germany then for what most people would want?
Ie £850 or so?
.
14-08-2006, 02:30 PM
#70
this is a briiliant product as the l8 still has a lot to offer and the point that chip, mike , ect have mae its plug and play , people over look the cost of looms different parts that have to manufactur ,relocating sensors the general agro that goes into a standalone for a cossie
14-08-2006, 02:41 PM
#72
Rich, see below .
.
Originally Posted by jaycos
this is a briiliant product as the l8 still has a lot to offer and the point that chip, mike , ect have mae its plug and play , people over look the cost of looms different parts that have to manufactur ,relocating sensors the general agro that goes into a standalone for a cossie
14-08-2006, 03:37 PM
#74
Originally Posted by CossieRich
Ture Mike,
But how many wiring looms that are near on 20 years old anyway are any good? I have already changed mine
But how many wiring looms that are near on 20 years old anyway are any good? I have already changed mine
Sadly very true, in fact so much so one could almost start a post warning about using the original connectors
I have been sat here quietly enjoying the irony of Mike not mentioning that ideally you want a new loom anyway given that was the whole reason i started the post to warn about a particular connector on the loom being so old now that it didnt work at all on my car anymore!
14-08-2006, 03:59 PM
#76
Originally Posted by foreigneRS
alternatively - if it ain't broke, don't try to fix it
14-08-2006, 04:39 PM
#78
Originally Posted by foreigneRS
i meant with regards to the loom, if it's not giving you problems, then why change it to a new one that may?
Personally though, i must confess that ive stuck with my original loom as other than the problem with the connection that i mention here it *seems* ok so far, and i nearly always have my wideband on anyway to catch such things.
22-08-2006, 08:39 AM
#79
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Originally Posted by SECS
Watch this space though... I have sold the product to a major company
who intend to develop it to its full potential.
Will be on display at National day....
who intend to develop it to its full potential.
Will be on display at National day....
one of the reasons i went to NDwhere was it Simon?
Can't you just tell us? after all, you did say on another thread that the new owners would be announced at the end of July...