Anonymous

Thats certainly a risk people will learn to take into account over time with Ebay.


That isnt always the case IME


Well if the customer perceives that a chat with their friendly trader that they trust is worth an extra 70 quid they will buy a 120 quid part from you not a 50 quid one from ebay i guess, if people dont feel its worth that then your business plan is flawed.


Indeed, so i dont see why you are saying ebay should be "brought down or taxed" to remove that choice from people?

Stu @ M Developments

iTrader: (12)

The argument is that they dont pay the overheads a bona fide trader does and THAT is why he can trade so cheaply from E-Bay. If he had normal overhaeads his prices would be higher, its as simple as that IMO.

How may people out there actually realise how much it costs to exist in business these days? Im sure the majority havent a clue and think we are all greedy bastards, in fact, i am certain of it.

SapphyMike

if you buy something to sell, then you should pay tax on it..

simple as.

if you buy a part of ebay, often its unwarranted and can be untested.

buy a part from some extremely reputable like Paul, then you know it will be tested and warranted.

Paul once told me that he doesnt like selling ABS sensors unless he personally can test that they'll all ok. most people would just sell you one..

Anonymous

What is?
Which bit of what i said dont you think was accurate?


Well i have done, although i dont currently as the market i was in changed, so i realised it was a good time to get out of it

Well then you (or whatever trader is in question) need to offer people enough extra "percieved value" above ebay etc to make sure they still buy from you despite the higher prices

Indeed, despite the lower overheads, so i dont think it was a fair comment you saying that he must be selling dear because thats the only way he can make a profit, neither of us know if he was a bedroom trader chancing his luck or not or what he paid for it!


Indeed, you would upset the market if you did, but on the other hand, thtas what happens when peopel sell cheap on ebay, tehy bring down the cost to the customer, any business trying to survive in that market needs to be prepared to deal with that surely?



If you cant win with that old fashioned business plan, then maybe my idea to change to a different one isnt such a bad idea as you are saying?



Personally i think that YOU PERSONALLY get it right, in terms of your prices are higher than ebay by enough to keep you in business, but your reputation is good enough that people will still buy thigns from you at those slightly higher prices.

Ive bought from you several times, so your business plan is working on me, but it sounds like Mike's buying of a new item with a manufacturers gaurentee for the punter that they can get the same item far cheaper with the same guarentee direct from the manufacturer on ebay is a flawed business plan.

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

The people saying bedroom traders is ok on e/bay is exactly the reason for JC "s post ,

We are a country of people who would rather save Ł10 and take a risk than pay a fair price and hopfully buy from a trader who will give you a service you are pleased with and you get the product you wanted and with a return sevice if the parts are wrong or not what you expected .

People not paying taxes etc on e/bay is costing the tax payer in the long run ,,can you not see this if the tax man loses money from bedroom traders he has to get the money he needs from some source ,, why is you council tax etc going up and up every year ????

Anonymous

I dont see how that validates their arguemnt though.

If they have a set of costs that cant compete with people on ebay, then they arent structiring their business in an appropriate way for competing in the modern (post ebay revolution) environment surely unless you can havea reputation (like yourself i would imagine?) which is so good that people are prepared to pay the extra in order to deal with you?

ballin

iTrader: (1)

I understand that Stu and can totally see your point. What I was getting at was traders try to put down ebay and make out its full of rip-offs etc.
until they realise its not then they wont ever be able to fight against it.
as chip said, traders need to make the buyer believe the extra money outside of ebay is worth it. how they do that i dont know. what i do know is anyone would try and get something cheaper if they could, everyone is out to make money in life, and obviously you make money by saving money.

I do feel for the traders and hope that if ebay needs taxing then it is, im just saying dont blame the buyers - your overheads are not our problem (dont mean that to sound harsh!)

Anonymous

Indeed it is, and sadly i think the unpleasant realisation he will come to is that they HAVE killed that part of his business unless show organisers realise that these days their pitches arent worth what they are currently charging and drop the prices.



The problem with that argument though is that most people quite rightly view that as ok, i personally have bought about 40 items off ebay, and only had a problem once, on an item worth 30 quid that i never got and the bloke left the site without me ever seeing a refund, but on the other hand ive saved probably an average of a tenner a go (like you mention) on the other items, meaning ive saved 390 quid that easily offsets the 30quid i lost, so i am therefore happy to keep taking the risk.


On the other hand selling on ebay makes you VERY visible to the taxman in some ways, so the taxman simply needs to find a cost effective way to prosecute people for evasion, just like they attempt to do if traders sell stuff cash and dont pay tax on it (if you have NEVER done this then you must be the only breaker in the country who hasnt!)

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

Chip
Another problem ,,

I have a unit to pay for etc etc rates etc etc that go up and up every year ,,,WHY ,,, because the council need to get more money from me to pay the dole wankers in the lifestyle they are usd to , and these are the wankers buying cars and breaking them with tax payers money and selling the parts on e/bay cheaper than me How do i win ,,how do i change my business plan tp beat them ??? if anyone can answer that they will become richer than the queen

also if i am 100% honest , i wish i got bloody cash everyone pays by CC i get very very little cash these days

Anonymous

Sell up, buy some houses, rent them out.

That seems a fairly safe business plan



As ive bought things from you several times without hitch and am greatful for your professionalism in dealing with me so far, you can have that plan without even having to give me a cut of the rent, its the least i can do.



Seriously though, ive a feeling you personally are managing ok on the back of the excellent reputation you have, so you probably dont need to change your business plan, but you arent selling brand new items that can be bought identically off of ebay, so its easy to see the percieved extra value in buying from you.

If i wanted (for example) a speedo cable for my car, you would be the first person i would phone as i know if you tell me its a good one it will be, and i dont want the hassle of buying one off ebay when it might not be, i pick and choose what items i buy from ebay according to the risk that i feel is present with each one.

Anonymous

PMSL

Kind of shoots the "i want everyone to pay tax fairly" argument when the truth is that we would ALL sooner avoid it if we could!

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

Thanks for the kind words Chip

The problem is tho , i do ok now but i fear for the future of my business , i have thought long and hard about a change in direction and probs will change within a year , my point is tho ,, i dont realy want to but will be forced to do so by the bedroom traders on e/bay etc , isnt this a real shame that anyone with a good business who trys hard to please his customers feels the need to give up for these reasons

I would rather change direction because im board or not able to compete because i didnt want to change with the times etc , not because of reasons i cant control

Anonymous

I think its a real shame, but then i also thinks its shame that about 70% of the local rural petrol stations near me are now closed and people all go to the supermarket as well.

Times have changed, and sadly its not always for the better IMHO.

If you pack up shop then thats something thats a loss to the ford enthusists out there who need a reliable source of parts


It is a shame, but there isnt anything that can be done about it IMHO


The sad thing is, that the bedroom traders are often hoping to turn into a proper business like yours i think, and wish they had premises etc, and dont realise that they never will because of people just like themselves that they would have to compete with!

SapphyMike

perhaps chip, but then if ebay wasnt around, traders like myself would still be able to charge the customer a sensible amount.

the manufacturers / suppliers all come down on us like a tonne of bricks if we sell under RRP, yet they then undercut us, its not very fair.

there are people who also setup a fake company to get discounts from suppliers / manufacturers.

they then sell their wares on ebay, making next to nothing. hows that helping me? like i said, im not into ripping people off, i just want to make a fair, honest living, but i cant if every tom dick or harry is undercutting me so that i can only make 10p an item.

Anonymous

Indeed mate, hence your business plan is outdated, as it relies on ebay not existing in order for it to succeed.

That was my point :S

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

You hit the nail Chip

they have no idea until they and then reality hits you and then you wonder why you bothered ,,as you say mate its not just this trade thats losing , its everything , where will it end ??

One massive retail shop owned by one very rich man selling everything from a tampon to a strap on , and paying billions in tax while everyone else in the country is on the dole

Anonymous

Indeed mate, and all the factories will be automated etc, so hardly any employees.

At which point he has FAR more power than the goverment realistically, and will probably persuade them to lower taxes anyway.

Its not a pretty vision for the future

Cawood

i only bought some oil yesterday from matt lewis

i would have loved to have bought loads of things for my cossie and RST

but i never have any cash, i am up to my eye balls in debt

i've got Ł30 left out of my overdraft to last me to the end of the month!

anyone wanna buy my RST?

SapphyMike

thats the problem chip, my business plan does take into account of ebay, hence why not only will i be selling parts, but offering various other services to help persuade the customer to purchase from me, rather than a bedroom nobody.

i trade from home at the moment, but i pay my taxes every year like im supposed to, so im all legal.

i am setting up properly in April next year, and do have lots of worries, simply because ebay is there for people to buy stuff at next to nothing on. how i get around this is by having to offer services that ebay cannot provide.

doesnt guarantee me an income though.

Rippers

Personally I don't think its because your getting done by Bedroom 'Traders' you getting done by the public in general as everyone knows they can get more money for there RS's in pieces so everyone does this. I've been in the scene a long time and I've never used a spares trader as with a bit of patience I can get the parts off the forums or Ebay. No offence intended just my honest opinion and experience

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

Paul

thats fine mate , we understand that everone wants things as cheap as poss, what hurts is when people think we are greedy and make millions just because we are charging more than the bedroom boys , we would love to match there prices , but not possible with overheads and when offering a propper service like we do

Paul

EssexMikeSi

iTrader: (3)

i bought a 3bar map sensor from woodford garage at the show. i realised after that ya not given a reciept, but the box was sealed, its a new unit plus i trust them as bought bits off them via mail order lately and havent let me down at all

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

Essexmike

perfect point mate ,,,,,YOU TRUST THEM ,,,,,,,,

Well said mate , thats the point we try to make ,, there is more than just the price that matters

BlueSmoke

SapphyMike, what will you be selling?

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

His arse


















Sorry mate , i just cant help myself

SapphyMike

how astute of you Paul

yes thats right, i'll be selling my arse cos the after market parts i'll not be selling thanks to ebay users undercutting me, i will have to sell my arse just to keep afloat

Seriously, it will be performance parts, servicing, air con regassing, sensor diagnostics etc etc.

SteveB

iTrader: (3)

Just a very very small example from over the past 6-7 years......


Take a look at 803 green injectors for Cossies from back in 2000 and now look at the price today..... the cost price hasn't realkly changed but look at the difference in selling prices, 7 years ago Ł65 ish was the cheapest you'd pay, nowadays Ł40-Ł42 each is what they sell for....


People are basically cutting each others throats.... 1 trader drops the price a Ł1 the next then drops a Ł1 below that then it carrys on to the point that you sell a stg 3 "kit" and the only money you actually make is from the chip as the actual chip costs Ł3 but sells at Ł50, so out of a chip, 4 injectors, 3 bar map se3nsor and a -31 you make if you are lucky Ł50 profit......


This whole reason I got out of "tuning" and have gone into std car parts as people don't expect everything for nothing (well not quite as much)



People may or may not remeber when I was Steve@RSX...... RSX Performance cost around Ł60,000 in the first year of trading for rent, wages, council tax etc etc thats why we gave it up as the thought of that again in the next year made the 3 of us go weak at the knees...




1 of the problems is the "net" as people can see lots of prices very very quickly any time of the day or night without makling any phone calls.




Steve

dave cos4x4

iTrader: (5)

i had to buy a better intercooler for my car as the one i have is not up to the job.

cost me over Ł300 but still it was cheaper than buying it through normal channels.

i expect to go to shows and buy parts cheaper than the advertised price in the shops etc....

The Sludge

well for my views on the show i thought it was really quiet compared to last year (maybe thats me) i dont know, but i went there intending to buy the special offer stuff from either deflex or powerflex and some samco hoses

The offers were just not there. Maybe other traders are getting greedy and thats absolutely no slant on JC at all. Thers no offers at all even for cash deals

As for ebay this week i bought a 400 mile old master cylinder for 7.50.I dont quite know what else i can say

I spoke to PJ Motorsport on Thursday and he said he was soooo busy he just couldnt make it to Ford Fair but more importantly he has said that he is making more sales from the Japanese stuff these days he had no other real reason to go to Ford Fair this year.

Rob M666SCC

I stopped doing the shows a few years back for the very same reasons.....

The market has changed but not for the better !!!!!

5 years ago my Business was 90% Perf cars and 10% std, now its the other way round............ and thats my choice for all the above reasons !!!!!

Mr RS500

iTrader: (6)

People say the expect better cash deals at the shows ,,,,,

this wont happen anymore as they are selling the stuff with such a small profit margin as it is that they cant do any better or they will be selling at a loss

I am going to try Jap as everyone i know in the trade says this is the way to go as the jap owners are like the cossie owners were 10 years ago , they had money to spend and would look after traders they know if the traders looked after them ,, not going elswere for a Ł2 saving

Loyalty works both ways , i try to look after my return customers by giving a little discount.

Ginge !

ive bought off a trader on here and got a bad deal and i payed more than i should of at the time

ive bought off you paul and your prices are more than resonable and so i recomend you to everyone i know a a first point of call as you also seem to have it in stock ( and also if it wasnt for you being soo trusting i wouldnt of made my mates funeral either so ill never forget a person who done that for a guy you never even knew )


but tbh my bad experience from 1 trader has made me think theres no point buying second hand stuff anymore and so i generally buy new or buy off a person i know where i have a real comeback if theres a issue


the internet is whats killing you lot off mate, its not ebay but the net as we can all see the new traders ect and get prices and fish about ect

when i first got in the game a few years ago ( about 10 years belive it or not) ive bought from pete a few times ( hes been around for ages) and found that hes prices where not the best compared to the others,,,,, but he had the stuff in stock and saved the phone calls

also bought off notts rs spares,,,, he was a top bloke who called me when he got stuff in ect,,,,,,,, think pete took over for him but cant be sure as he dissapeared


back when i was first in the game i used the mags to call the traders and see what they got,,,,,,,,, i dont even buy the mags these days as there a fuckign waste of cash tbh

with ebay ive been stung a few times,,,,, its a bitch but its never been for more than 10 quid as im a tight fooker


oh and i remember buying a set of lowering springs for a erst for 55 quid plus 10 quid postage off a trader on here,,,,,, said they was in good nick adn they had more fucking rust on em than the springs i took off,,,,, oh and then cracked after 3 months too,,,,, for 15 quid more i could of got em new but i payed the price as they was described as spot on


these days paul your the only trader i would touch for second hand stuff so dont think we dont use you mate but the market for the cars has left and people no longer wanna spend 4k a eyar on a car that never goes through a mot

hell i bought a 325i e36 bmw the other day, cost me the same price as my shitty cossie engine cost me and thats a full car thats nicer to drive, able to drive to the family do's ect adn its got fucking aircon,,,,, why are we bothering with the RS shite these days,,,,,, honestly why as ford aint bothering about it anymore


PS: paul you also may make a sale as im gonna PM you about some parts i need so if you could look about for em and give me a price ill buy em when ya get em,, no rush just make sure you have a list of wants i guess


hope you enjoyed the read

Dirty Harry

iTrader: (12)

when i first got in the game a few years ago ( about 10 years belive it or not) ive bought from pete a few times ( hes been around for ages) and found that hes prices where not the best compared to the others,,,,, but he had the stuff in stock and saved the phone calls

THATS FUNNY SEEING MY PRICES ARE THE SAME AS PAULS AND WE ARE SOMETIMES CHEAPER THEN OTHERS,YOU GET WHAT YOU PAY FOR IN THIS LIFE

also bought off notts rs spares,,,, he was a top bloke who called me when he got stuff in ect,,,,,,,, think pete took over for him but cant be sure as he dissapeared

NO MARK CAME INTO THE GAME WAY WAY AFTER ME AND ENDED UP RUNNING HIS BUSINESS INTO THE GROUND AND SELLING UP TO SOMEONE ELSE WHO INTURN WENT BUST

If Iam that bad a business and that expensive I wonder why Iam still trading after 19 years ?? can you in all your wisdom answer that ??
Yes E bay is making life harder but we will see,people like personal attention when it comes to there cars,all I hear now from people is e bay stories of being ripped off,you dont hear stories like that when using a proffesional trader as we have reputaions to keep.
Iam not saying we not encounter the odd problem BUT the difference is you dont hear about it as its alway sorted within reason

Ginge !

pete you kssed the fucking point what i was making there, im a fucking old customer of yours and not having a fucking dig at you

as for prices,,, tbh i agree, you get what you pay for ive never mentioned that paul was the cheepest place about,,,,,,,,, ive never checked just that he helped me out and so i recomend him

pete you ahve prob had 1500quid worth of business off me maybe more in the past,,,,,, the point i made was that the cheeper places ive noticed dont tend to have the stock,,,,,,, so its a give and take part for me


so dont get all humpy with me moany bollox

Big Will_

I was carrying about Ł200 cash on me yesterday, nothing specific in mind - but in case i saw something i felt was a good price and would improve my car etc.

But to be honest, there wasn't a lot that did - i had a thorough rummage through the autojumble before the gates opened to the public and felt everything was very very pricey compared to what i've bought and sold bits for on here...

There is however a lot of truth in the 'better the devil you know' statement and if a known source could supply something to me within say Ł5, maybe Ł10 on larger purchases, then i would deal with them over ebay.

dave_y

iTrader: (4)

exactly the same here, looked everywhere for a Roose Motrsport stand.

Ended up buying 2 sets of Samco Hoses (Bailey Stand) and saved a fortune. ( Ł300 worth for Ł200)

I usually buy stuff from the traders (APT/Power Engineering) etc as they are accessible and i can contact them through PassionFord as well

Dirty Harry

iTrader: (12)

Iam not moaning mate far from it just putting you right on a couple of issues,and i thank you for you business

DOO

RS / cosworth parts are at all time low ATM only the very rare and new parts make good money.


I would collect what you can and store it away prices will only rise again in the years to come.

As for bedroom traders Ebay there loads of bargains out there to be found as for trust you just got to check there feed back

As for shows i just laugh at some of the breakers saleing parts(NONE THAT TRADE ON HERE) everything covered in oil mess shit etc.. i have binned better cond parts

some of there prices are crazy as well more expensive for 2nd hand crap than you could by new from ford.

ellicoss

The price you gave me for a 044 fuel pump was brilliant mate even ebay cant compete with that would rather buy on the day than ebay as you get to see what you get sorry to here it was a slow day for you mate

dave cos4x4

iTrader: (5)

i think ebay has a lot bigger auddiance out there and the traders should not be slagging it off they should be selling their own stuff on it.

like they do already.

most parts on ebay make more money most times than putting a price on it.

you just have to pay ebay,thats the only downfall.