Gazzonator

iTrader: (9)

Hi all,

I'm converting my 4x4 saph to 2wd and basically want to get it handling as best as possible.

The car is mainly a road car but will be used on track aswell.

I intend to change the wank standard rear beam for a proper adjustable one and also things like coilovers, adjustable tca's, proper diff etc but it would be nice to get a few other peoples views on what they find works best.

I'm aiming for over 500 bhp so I know whatever I do it will be a handful but I can at least try to make handle better!! Lol!!

Thanks in advance!

ShiftyOldScoob

iTrader: (3)

I've got mine on koni top adjustables and Ahmed Bayjoo springs...fitted them on the advice of Mike Rainbird...totally transformed the car! instead of squating and spinning the wheels now it grips like fook and the stance is perfect!

Got a chunky anti roll bar and a poly diff mount to go on next

As far as I'm aware if you fit an adjustable rear beam, you shouldnt have any of the camber issues normally associated with lowering a rwd saff as you can just dial it out...would love an adjustable rear beam myself but I'm too much of a minge to fork out 900notes

R5FORD

iTrader: (1)

Black art design coilovers

http://randbmotorsport.co.uk/shop/De...?ProductID=288

pacwest

Don't lower it more than 20mm.

I have AVO coil overs and compression struts. The ride is pretty hard. I think my rear springs might need some softenting up.

I really think you have to be very careful on spring rates.

Rod-Tarry

[quote=R5FORD;4832919]Black art design coilovers

The MD of BAD is the guy from Leda he started that company when they went down the other Leda guy started GAZ. I recommend Leda coilovers, decent rear beam, chassis connectors, standard road height & a Jag Diff also arches rolled to fit decent width tyres. This combo will give you great handling (for a Cossie) & gob smakin grip even with 700+bhp.

rssapphowner

i would get a 2wd no of 4x4 shit lol

tabetha

Why bother with a £1K + cost of a modded beam, fit struts instead at the rear, will piss all over the modded beams, but depends what you want.
Also remember, that an opinion is just that, someone else's opinion you might disagree, so try to get a ride in cars with different set ups.
I've used both koni and ahmed springs, but find the avo coilys vastly better.
Any decent shocks and springs will kill 90% of thr tramp under hard acceleration, a decent diff mount will cure the other 10%, then add a 22mm rear arb, or listen to the ones that have never used it that say it doesn't work, your car you make your mind up.
tabetha

Gazzonator

iTrader: (9)

Thanks for the advice people!

I understand what you mean Tabs about going in few cossies with different setups and seeing what suits me best but the problem I have is everyone I know with a cossie all have the same setup (konis) and have no interest in making their car handle properly, just rather put as much power through it and make it as undrivable as possible!! Lol!

I would rather have a car that is enjoyable to drive and handle well round a track than one that makes me feel as though it's going to try and kill me whenever I go round a bend! Lol!

R4N SS

iTrader: (6)

what jag diff is used?

ajamesc

It dosent matter what shocks springs or coilovers u fit lol the standard rear beam lets the wheels go up into the arch at an angle under squat so the tyre dosent have its full foot print on the road for grip! The modded rear beams dont do this so the wheels gos up straight so u get the full tyre footprint on the road if u get what i mean

Char1ie

iTrader: (6)

Mine is a race car and I'm getting to the point where it handles well. Every set-up is personal though - you wouldn't want the spring rates that I use for road use. Also for 500bhp you'll have to go for a strong diff.

The obvious places to start are good dampers and springs, make your diff mount stronger, stiffen the beam, think about adjustable beam, fit 3 door hubs (if you have Sapph hubs), make sure your tyre pressures are right, fit sticky tyres, get the ride height correct.

Charlie

RS500/364

9 inch jag diff me brother in law has 2 dont think there will be much diff !

Mike1

What are you free to change on yours Charlie under the race regs in the series you race in?

Presumably an adjustable beam is not allowed but obviously springs and dampers are. Are you allowed to fit anything that was fitted to a production line Cosworth i.e you've got the 3-door hubs. Can you change ARB's, adjust caster/camber etc?

Char1ie

iTrader: (6)

You're right - can't change the beam as the "pick-up points" cannot be changed so arm mounts, beam mounts must be original. I have braced the centre of the beam to stop it flexing and connected it to the roll cage in the floor. Three door hubs are OK, coilovers are OK, compression struts are allowed but not adjustable TCAs, bushes can be standard or poly. I have adjustable top mounts. ARBs are free I think but I use standard Sapph front and back.

At the moment it turns in well but has a bit too much power on oversteer so need to work on the back to try to iron this out - may go lower and softer dampers next time. Also I should lower the front a little bit more.

Charlie

ajamesc

Whats the differance with 3 door hubs are they alot better

Mike1

Interesting stuff Char1ie - I assume as you have used bracing things like strut braces and Adrenaline chassis connectors would be allowed ( but might be superfluous seeing as you have a roll cage already ). Are you allowed to shim suspension points to change camber. Interesting about adjustable top mounts and compression struts ...but not adj TCAs. So you can introduce more caster and camber via comp struts & mounts ...but not on the arms themselves? I guess going lower with a standard beam will get you a camber increase anyway. What tricks do the E30 boys use as they have fundamentally the same problem with their geometry, albeit a less severe rear arm angle

Char1ie

iTrader: (6)

Yeah, I could introduce shims and was thinking about trying the ones on the rear sometime. Chassis connectors I haven't thought about, but yes, the roll cage adds stiffness. I have the rear turrets connected with a bar, and a front strut brace too.

Don't know what the E30 people do with the rear beam.

Charlie

Craig J

iTrader: (1)

As an entry level into coilovers you cant really go wrong with Leda, AVO or Gaz. All much of a muchness and based on twin tube tech. Alternatively a second hand set of Bilstein refurbed by them would be another good option. Lots of spring rate advice on here but depends on your usage. Once you want to get a bit more serious then monotube dampers from Avo, Reiger, Proflex are the dogs, but very very expensive.

Sorry to go a little off topic

Are you sure?

The regulations state:

5.8.3

PROHIBITED MODIFICATIONS

'The fitting of suspension or suspension components from one model to another'

I guess there needs to be clarification whether a Saph is a Sierra or vice versa.
Interested in the answer as it would allow me to make an appearance in TTRS this year when I have a weekend off from Pre93.
I have nothing but Saph arms and uprights to replace my adjustable TCAs on my 3dr and I had assumed reading the regs that the parts were not interchangeable.

Mike1

Hi

http://www.randbmotorsport.co.uk/sho...Suspension.pdf

This article ( page 2 ) might explain the differences

Cheers

tabetha

In case you hadn't noticed the sidewalls of tyres are FLEXIBLE, this is so that they contour to the road surface, at any angle you can get on a cossie rear beam.
I know full well what the std beam does, just saying for prices it may be possible to isntead get struts which are a millions miles better in every way than a beam will ever be.
The beam with the modded mount points imo is expensive for what it is, but is about as much as you can do if keeping the beam arrangement.
Undersquat there is even more force pushing the WHOLE width of the tyre into the road.
Read some good chassus books such as chassis & suspension engineering, by Geoffrey Howard, even has piccies of the twin tyre wheels, now they would seriously brought the modern car forward in grip terms!!
tabetha

ajamesc

Side wall flex dose not take up the negative camber problem the standard rear beam has under acceleration lol thats the big problem with the sierra rear beam hence the modded rear beam! and as for twin rear tyres lol are u realy being serious. But ill agree with u it is a lot of cash but people who do have it done say it give u so much more grip!

Char1ie

iTrader: (6)

Hmmm, good point. I'd forgotten that one. A Sierra is a Sierra, maybe.

Mike1

Well the Sapphire was badged as a Sierra RS Cosworth on the bootlid

Craig J

iTrader: (1)

Ace. I guess that answers the question then.