For those interested in MegaSquirt EFI...
#201
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Spark looks ok other than the idle is quite advanced, but the Fuel table looks messy mate even ignoring above 14psi (200kpa) where you've not mapped yet, looks like you just need to put some more time in mapping it maybe?
FYI My spark duration is also 0.7
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FYI My spark duration is also 0.7
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Last edited by Karlos G; 20-03-2010 at 05:17 PM.
#202
Bodger of Blackburn
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as i said, still remapping car after altering fuel pressure a little, really sent the whole thing out loads.
it is a rough map as i only started working on it a couple of runs earlier but had to use it so switched ego correction on.
idle advance was turned up a tad the other day as it keeps bogging down on 0-light throttle at first, really leans out on the first bit of accelerator.
it is a rough map as i only started working on it a couple of runs earlier but had to use it so switched ego correction on.
idle advance was turned up a tad the other day as it keeps bogging down on 0-light throttle at first, really leans out on the first bit of accelerator.
#204
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as i said, still remapping car after altering fuel pressure a little, really sent the whole thing out loads.
it is a rough map as i only started working on it a couple of runs earlier but had to use it so switched ego correction on.
idle advance was turned up a tad the other day as it keeps bogging down on 0-light throttle at first, really leans out on the first bit of accelerator.
it is a rough map as i only started working on it a couple of runs earlier but had to use it so switched ego correction on.
idle advance was turned up a tad the other day as it keeps bogging down on 0-light throttle at first, really leans out on the first bit of accelerator.
If it leans out on the first bit of accelerator and 'hangs' for a second then you need to adjust the Accel Enrichment until it doesnt do it, when the throttle body opens the engine takes a big gulp of air and the you need to give it a bit more fuel briefly to compensate.
#207
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If you buy from www.extraefi.co.uk then yes there is instructions for fitting, setting up, even basic mapping principles.
Also they will supply you with a base map that should be close enough to get your car started, or there are a few of us on here that can sort you one out
Also they will supply you with a base map that should be close enough to get your car started, or there are a few of us on here that can sort you one out
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#209
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Not sure yet mate, if i'm ran in and reliable then I might pop down for the day!
Having just built the engine, fitted a new gearbox, LSD, Hydraulic clutch, and quick rack there is still plenty of time for teething problems... Like my alternator chewing through my bottom rad Samco!
Having just built the engine, fitted a new gearbox, LSD, Hydraulic clutch, and quick rack there is still plenty of time for teething problems... Like my alternator chewing through my bottom rad Samco!
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#211
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The MS3 also gives you a starting point for even more expansion. You will be able to connect the pin headers on this board to additional hardware, such as the MS3X board (not yet released) or other cards to enable features like these:
* 8 channels sequential fuel control
* 8 channel sequential ignition control
* Individual fuel and spark trim for cylinder by cylinder tuning
* 2 and 3 channel PWM IAC control
* 2 stage nitrous controller
* Table switching for multi-fuel engines
* 2 step launch control
* And more!
![](http://www.diyautotune.com/catalog/images/ms3-dbk.jpg)
#214
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You don't need MS3 for sequential, MS2 will do it fine, you just need to add some injector drivers. One of these is ideal:
http://www.jbperf.com/p&h_board/v2_0.html
It's a proper peak and hold 4 channel driver module. Or you could use the v1.1 board which sits inside the original MS case.
Rick
http://www.jbperf.com/p&h_board/v2_0.html
It's a proper peak and hold 4 channel driver module. Or you could use the v1.1 board which sits inside the original MS case.
Rick
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Is MS easy to map? The amout on load sites makes it look pretty easy as there isn't much to do.
This is a spark table out of my ECU for comparison. The fuel table has just as many load sites.
This is a spark table out of my ECU for comparison. The fuel table has just as many load sites.
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#217
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Life Racing F88RS. Thats been reduced by about 6 load sites along the rpm axis as well. There is obviously correction tables on top of that and there is just as many for the fuel table too.
I assume that the MS is relatively easy to map in comparrison with having less load sites.
I assume that the MS is relatively easy to map in comparrison with having less load sites.
#219
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Life Racing F88RS. Thats been reduced by about 6 load sites along the rpm axis as well. There is obviously correction tables on top of that and there is just as many for the fuel table too.
I assume that the MS is relatively easy to map in comparrison with having less load sites.
I assume that the MS is relatively easy to map in comparrison with having less load sites.
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11.5:1 isnt that far off what it should be 11.8:1 doubt you will have lost much fella.
Post your graph and spec up mate be interested to see how and where it makes power!
#221
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fookin 'ell Daz, that is a load of variables to be entered in there.
MS is easy in comparrison and even on the MS3 which could have handled more that 16x16, there was little point making it any bigger really.
i'd quite happily show you how easy it is anytime pal.
p.s. Karlos, done a bit of mapping and we're running sweet now, never really get chance to do any these days, so ends up shite like my last session did. alls good now and have turned EGO off as it was ruining running if i switched off after a run then started up a minute later as the wideband has to enter warmup mode and sends erroneous data to ecu till it's up to temp.
MS is easy in comparrison and even on the MS3 which could have handled more that 16x16, there was little point making it any bigger really.
i'd quite happily show you how easy it is anytime pal.
p.s. Karlos, done a bit of mapping and we're running sweet now, never really get chance to do any these days, so ends up shite like my last session did. alls good now and have turned EGO off as it was ruining running if i switched off after a run then started up a minute later as the wideband has to enter warmup mode and sends erroneous data to ecu till it's up to temp.
#222
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Originally Posted by Karlos G
Good work mate
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11.5:1 isnt that far off what it should be 11.8:1 doubt you will have lost much fella.
Post your graph and spec up mate be interested to see how and where it makes power!
With slipping stock clutch. Thats why there is spike on the graph. One of my friends gained 50php with this correction, increasing AFR 11,...- up to 13,....
http://www.youtube.com/user/MTechVid.../0/jLWX-FCJdVs
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Last edited by bomsch; 27-03-2010 at 10:25 PM.
#223
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12.5:1 will make good power but without monitoring it for detonation it's too close to a meltdown.
IMO 13.5:1 is ridiculous for a forced induction engine, it will run way to hot and you'll have to retard the timing massively to stop Det.
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12.5:1 will make good power but without monitoring it for detonation it's too close to a meltdown.
IMO 13.5:1 is ridiculous for a forced induction engine, it will run way to hot and you'll have to retard the timing massively to stop Det.
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Last edited by bomsch; 27-03-2010 at 11:48 PM.
#225
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It will make power for sure but how long will the engine last?
I supose if there is not Det and the EGT's are not too high then it's ok...... just seems way to lean to me!![Confused](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif)
The extra 100bhp can be down to many things... Turbo, port work, valve size, cam, valve timing, ignition timing, CR, ACT's, manifolds, etc..etc...
I supose if there is not Det and the EGT's are not too high then it's ok...... just seems way to lean to me!
![Confused](https://passionford.com/forum/images/smilies/icon_confused.gif)
The extra 100bhp can be down to many things... Turbo, port work, valve size, cam, valve timing, ignition timing, CR, ACT's, manifolds, etc..etc...
#226
Bodger of Blackburn
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nowt wrong with running higher afr's, however peak torque is around 13.5 and peak horsepower is around 12.5.
running too lean for too long will make things get a little too hot for sure, too rich and you sacrifice power for safety.
basically you want it as lean as you can get without DET and EGT's getting too high.
the extra richness keeps the cylinders and pistons cooler, all engines pretty much have similar tolerances to heat and an rst is no different. i have run on boost at 12.5 without problems, but retarding ignition is needed to do this safely.
with careful monitoring you can get it as lean as you like safely, just start rich and lean out as it's much safer to do this.
running too lean for too long will make things get a little too hot for sure, too rich and you sacrifice power for safety.
basically you want it as lean as you can get without DET and EGT's getting too high.
the extra richness keeps the cylinders and pistons cooler, all engines pretty much have similar tolerances to heat and an rst is no different. i have run on boost at 12.5 without problems, but retarding ignition is needed to do this safely.
with careful monitoring you can get it as lean as you like safely, just start rich and lean out as it's much safer to do this.
#229
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I have maxed them out on my engine running 18psi @ 7000rpm, the injector duty is at 95%! Although they were fuelling ok at 106% it's too risky that one or more cylinders might be lean so I have had to turn my boost down!
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#230
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#234
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#237
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i was thinking about it on the way into what fuel pump are you useing? do you think maby your presure is droping off?
my mates st turbo has gone to totd for mapping this week hes running 440's and they seem to think they will be fine with his gt30 and hes looking for around 320hp
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#238
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It's because the BSFC on an 8v CVH is much higher than on a multivalve engine. You'll struggle to get 300 out of 440's on a CVH.
Don't forget the ST has 5 of them so 330 is no problem.
Don't forget the ST has 5 of them so 330 is no problem.
#239
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For anyone that didnt know (including me) what BSFC is...
It's the ratio of an engines fuel consumption to an engines power output as measured at the flywheel.
BSFC has units of grams of fuel per kilowatt-hour (g/kWh) or pounds mass of fuel per brake horsepower-hour (lb/bhp-hr).
BSFC is a measure of engine efficiency!
So basically the little CVH is not very efficient and needs a lot more fuel to make the same power as an engine with a lower BSFC
It's the ratio of an engines fuel consumption to an engines power output as measured at the flywheel.
BSFC has units of grams of fuel per kilowatt-hour (g/kWh) or pounds mass of fuel per brake horsepower-hour (lb/bhp-hr).
BSFC is a measure of engine efficiency!
So basically the little CVH is not very efficient and needs a lot more fuel to make the same power as an engine with a lower BSFC
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Last edited by Karlos G; 14-04-2010 at 03:35 PM.
#240
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How have you all learned how to map ms? I have rebuilt my engine, car , painted it everything realy so I'd like to map it myself to.
How hard is it to get the map to a "safe" standard?
Btw carlos loving your work, very interesting top job
How hard is it to get the map to a "safe" standard?
Btw carlos loving your work, very interesting top job
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Last edited by johnenright150rst; 14-04-2010 at 04:11 PM.