Hi,

Please could someone give me their opinion on how much work would be required on the below.

Both nearside and offside sills are corroded, the floorpan should be straightforward with a repair section, but I am unsure of the sills and sadly think that this may be the end of the car, which has been family owned since new

 

It’s metal it’s all fixable. All comes down to money if you can’t do it your self or time if you can. How much do you like it and want it fixed really

 

Yep agree, I've seen much worse than that on my Granada MK1 😀

If you can't do it yourself it's going to cost to do it properly. How much sentimental value does this car have?
My Granada was bought by my dad in1985 and it's still here today after lots of work, it's currently having a bit more welding as the bodywork progresses. It's massive sentimental value to me though especially as my dad is no longer here.

 

So it's my parents car and it obviously failed the MOT.

It's not really sentimental, other than the fact I have grown up with it for the best part of three decades and it's a straight,original car (all original panels).

When I spoke to the guy (who is a welder himself) he says it would be expensive to repair, but as it was a while ago he said he would need to see it again.

I don't want to bother him by taking it back and waste his time in light of this, so ideally was looking for a rough estimate, based on the photos.

Martin

 

I can appreciate that, as money is no object in your case.

I plan on buying myself a MIG going forward, but this would be to much for a newbie, the way I see it is the floor pan is an easy fix.

However, it's the sills which I believe will be more complicated and where the cost will be.

Martin

 

The thing is with rust as most of us know once you commit to doing it you can be opening a whole can of worms and find more problems than you expected. For a confident experienced welder it probably would be fine but at what cost? What you have'nt said is how much does the car mean to your parents? If they think spending the money on an older car, which could be more than it's worth, is ok then get it done but if the car does'nt hold a great sentimental value to them maybe it is time to let it go?

 

This is where I started with a borrowed MIG just to see if I could do it. I had to learn on the job - there were no You Tube vids in1991. 😁
It's a labour of love work though.
​​​​

 

I can solder if that helps

I believe I could pick it up quite easily and as I have old cars it's certainly a useful skill to have, as well as useful in general.

Although all my knowledge is self taught, but I have been looking at a course where I get a C&G qualification, at least I get something personally as well then.

There are also the materials to learn about such as the gauge of sheet metal I would need, clamps etc.

Back to the thread though, really I was looking on someone experienced to put a rough estimate on it.

Martin

 

what car is it? Are the sills available?

 

You are completely right, parents have another car now, so it would be me who would take it on.

For me I always liked it, which is where the Cosworth enthusiasm came from and was probably responsible for me buying one.

Plus having grown up/worked on it for the best part of three decades it's really part of the family for me, analogous to a family pet had gone.

Maybe I just need to get out more, but don't answer that

It's been brilliant though, 160K+ on original transmission and running gear.

I do also have a MK2 Fiesta, which is in a worse state of disrepair (I got quoted Ł600 in welding), again been in the family since new.

I'm toying with the idea of breaking it (interior is immaculate) and keeping this instead.

Martin

 

Really that comes down to a matter of opinion. If you want it repaired and the money aspect is less relevant, then it is not too expensive to repair.

Problem with rust...you can start repairing what you see, then it opens a huge pandoras box of rust you were unable to see until you started the repairs. How readily available are repair panels, vs having to try and fabricate repair sections ?

It can be very labour intensive, time consuming, utterly horrible, crappy work lol. Unless you're well kitted out for it, and even then it's still not nice.

And were they not in time to get the free MOT extensions lol ?

Pics are too close up though. But outer sills ? usually repair panels available ?
Just a case of cutting ALL the rust out, and welding up a new bit. How easy or awkward depends on how that sill interacts with other parts of the body, or folds, corners etc
But the more correct panels are available...the easier it can be. It's just a case of being happy cutting out huge bits if needed.

 

Sierra MK2, yes they are.

Martin

 

MOT was at beginning of year.

Outer sills have been previously repaired, the corrosion is on both inner sills at the rear, a small hole in drivers floor and the top photo depicts the corrosion of the floorpan/sill.

So I have found a guy, who charges by the half day or day for a reasonable price.

From looking at this, I can't see that is more than a days work at the outside, but of course I do not know what lies beneath. I would be happy to pay for him for a day, but it's not worth me spending anymore on it than this.

Decisions, decisions...

Martin

 

Anything can be bodged up in a short space of time.

It's a lot harder and more time consuming to do it well, with a view to preventing the rust returning for as long as possible.

 

Probably best part of a weeks worth there to strip out the interior cut the rot out prep it make the new parts fit weld it all up then paint it

 

If you fancy doing it yourself then just go for it I say and learn on the job. Chances are you will do it and then as you go along will decided you can do it better and start again but once you get into it I would think you will pick it up.

 

I would do the stripping of interior, so he could literally just start on the job. That's really what I was wanting an estimate based on the photo's, he has not answered and just said his prices, which implies that once he has started he may not be able to do it in a day, and at that point you are committed, is my concern.

I also am concerned about the standard of repair, I asked him if it would be seam welded, so it would pass an MOT, again he has not answered.

Think I will give it a go, and move the MK2 Fiesta on, the thing is no one is going to want either of them, so they are scrap value.

Ideally I would like this to go to someone as a "donor" car.

Martin

 

I'm about to do the same. My fiesta has been sat in a garage for almost 2 years waiting for someone to sort the welding and it's not happened. Since I've now got a fair bit of time on my hands i'm going to get it back and do it myself. I'm not the best welder but i'm willing to have a go and learn. Plus I've got a couple of mates that can help out if I really need it.

 

If you can strip back to good clean solid metal, the welding is pretty easy ( except if it's upside down....)

But trying to weld anything thin or dirty/rusty is a nightmare.

No doubt there will be countless videos on YT to view to give you an idea of what's involved etc.

 

If its a saph I will have the back bumper ha ha ha.

 

I bought one of these welders to do my cossie. Cracking welder. I would defo recommend one.

 

The thing with welding. If you put too much weld on you can always grind it down. Just practise you will soon pick it up.

 

I have been looking at the Clarke 102NG, it's cheaper than yours, but less powerful and does not use gas.

Is gas a big advantage? The 102 can weld steel up to 4 MM, which is plenty.

Martin

 

I have used flux cored mig welders for years, I used to weld outside so it was my best option, with practice you can get a near perfect weld, loads will tell you not to do it but I would go for it

 

get a gas mig welder without a doubt i've been using clarke welders on cars for 30 years there fine for the job ive currently got the 151TE model like Glenns and its does its job well
if your doing a lot of welding buy a large bottle of gas plenty of companies sell them now so its not a expensive as it used to be and its a one off payment then you just swap the bottles when there empty
the small bottles from machine mart don't last long at all
Steve

 

#metoo 🤣 although I’ve not used one for “years” I’m still very much learning.

I've got the 130en that i bought second hand for hardly any money, slapped flux cored wire into it and been practicing when I get chance.

i just finished some drop out cat sections for my s4 and they are the best looking welds I’ve done so far, I’ve made some right manky welds whilst I’ve been learning though 🤣 nothing has fallen apart at least so that’s a plus point, and I’ve become really handy with an angle grinder and a flap disc at times 🤣




I think gas is much cleaner for welding though, I’ve only had a small go with gas, but I do want to get a bottle for doing some stuff, problem is I’m not welding all the time so the gassless wire works out better.

 

If I was the op for what you want to do and the price go for gas less, I have just ordered a tig welder to teach myself to tig and just the gas is around Ł100,

when I was younger my only welder was arc because it’s all I could afford, I ended up welding wings on with it, body repairs and made a few straight through exhausts for mates for a few ŁŁŁ back in the 90’s, A flux cored mig was a step up

there are a few videos online showing the difference and on thicker material the flux core actually penetrates the metal deeper,

if you take the flux core option you can buy different wire thickness, like all welding just make sure you prep

 

Burnzy. Good looking welding, nothing wrong with that!!

 

Yea it is good, I was really proud of myself too 🤣 but I’m not consistent yet, and still loads to learn.

I’ve done some welds that would make Stevie Wonders skin crawl 🤣 I mean I even welded a set of flexi’s to an exhaust and used gas wire without gas 🤦🏻‍♂️🤣

in my defence I didn’t know it was gassless wire and pretty sure I was told it was gassless wire when I picked up the welder 🤣 I did improve considerably when using the correct wire though 🤦🏻‍♂️🤣

 

I have a sealey 185 that I have had for years. Used to think it was fantastic until I used a decent plant at work.

 

That rust doesn’t look like anything serious to me, I’ve repaired a hell of a lot worse than that before. Probably looking at about a weeks work to sort it out. I’ve got a friends gt hatchback sierra I’m doing soon and it’s much worse than that

 

This is the thing though, that's two of you that have estimated a week, which is really helpful.

It means there is no point in me paying a welder for a day's work, as I would have essentially wasted my money.

I will probably keep it as my own personal project once I have learnt, but need to get rid of the MK2 Fiesta for the space.

By a weeks work, I assume you are referring to prep work (i.e. interior removal) in which case what would you estimate for the welding alone?

Martin

 

using gas with a mig is defo better

Like people have said if your using it alot just buy or rent a bigger bottle.

 

If you can’t weld I would 100% get some thin gauge metal and have a lot of practice before starting a project like that

 

Photo from above, part of the floorpan has disappeared. The thing is the inner sill is corroded as well, so won't be able to weld to it. I'm aware in an ideal world the rot would be cut out, but if necessary could a plate not be seam welded over the top of this to the sill, as the metal further up is good?

Martin

 

Exactly my plan, to buy some sheet metal and get some welds to form. Been doing a lot of theory work on wire speed and heat and what it should sound like.

Martin

 

As I tell the kids at work when they try lol welding isn’t that hard. If the metal is clean and you have a good earth and obviously your welder is good. The hardest bit is setting the welder up. Once you have a good setting for what your doing it’s not that hard. Well unless it’s really thin metal or your upside down lol

 

You could do anything you want, even fibreglass it....depends whether you just want a quick fix, or the job done right.

If repair panels are available, that makes life a lot easier as you can buy them, get the correct shapes and then cut/replace what is needed.

If you need to fabricate repair sections...it takes a lot more work.

But that strip of rut could be cut out, make a repair section to clean metal and seam weld it in.

Recently spotted this on the MIG welding forum.....he's definitely keen !

https://www.mig-welding.co.uk/forum/...pefully.81348/

 

It seems panels/sills are still available, but not repair sections.

I have contacted the guy again, who says the repairs can be done in a day (with me having removed interior etc) and this week he done inner and outer sills on an Escort within the same.

I'm not knowing what to do, as my concern is, I could pay him for a days work and still not get the job done.

What would your advice be?

Martin

 

I do all my own work...so it's hard to advise someone who is paying someone. I know how much work I'd do, and how far I would take it...and also if I cut any corners etc or not.
Paying someone and not seeing what they are doing, you will not have that option unless you stand over and watch them which isnt an option.

And until you cut it open to see how far the rust extends....you do not know.

But if you just want the external visible parts patched up, which is basically all anyone would do for a basic MOT pass....then the job gets much faster and easier. But maybe not what some would deem as the correct job. And likewise for a crude patch just welded over the top as most will do, as opposed to cutting and trying to replicate the area removed so it looks reasonably original.

It all goes back to how fussy do you want to be ? Is it just an MOT repair you want or need, or is a restoration type repair you'd like to last as long as possible ?
Realistically how much longer do you expect to keep the car ? Does any repair need to be fussy or just quick ?