just seen on "police interceptors" that 46% of 15-17 year olds carry a knife for self defence!!!

Now thats quite simply fucked up!!! Are the streets really that dangerous that almost half of teenagers truley believe they need a knife or is it mostly "hardman" syndrome?????

What do you think can realistically be done???

Is banging them up, no cautions, no getting off for possession of a knife the way forward???

Debate!!!

 

No matter what punishments you have people will always carry kinfies,oh the days when I was a teenager things where settled with fists

 

But surely we must be able to reduce the number significantly??? Of course i realise we will never eliminate knife crime.

Metal detectors in every school??

deliberate intense targetted stop and search on children to catch as many as possible???

 

anyone who carrys a knife should be dealt with harshley and have a good punishment for it, these guys ruin lives not only of the people who get stabbed but off there familys too. only a pussy carrys a knife.

 

Stab the cunts.

 

Only way knife crime will drop, is when guns get more common

 

cheers for the optimistic outlook Chip

Turn Isle of White into a prison???

 

A 18 yearold girl was stabbed to death on saterday night in the next road where I live in Luton. Thats so bad as I live in the quite part of town.What is it all coming too? I cannot believe it has not even been on the t.v much.

 

i cant get my head round the idiots,when we were there age we used to scrap with our fists not knives and shit like that

 

Harsher punishment for those caught carrying a knife, no matter how small.

Proper 'life' sentences for those that commit murder and man slaughter.

Also better policing of shops that sells knife, more random checks to see if they're selling to underage children and also harsher punishments for those that do.

 

but why .......

poor girl R.I.P

thay should hang the fuckers that murder others end of

 

more police, end of. more beat bobbys walking the streets 24 hours a day will be there to stop it BEFORE it happends. govenment need to stop being cheap and hiring pcso that clock off at 5pm, cos crime stops at that time doesnt it, not like they can do anything anyway!

 

i guarantee that the above statement will be the truest post on this thread.

 

Knife crime as in any other -- unfortunatly its here nothing can be done---------
youve had it since time began (more of it now though-you wont stop it)
if they cant stop gun crime how the f-ck they going to tackle a hidden knife------
you may not be old enough to remember tail combs>>>>no though not-ha-ha
they were used for the same thing-just moved onto knives now

 

i blame a lot of it on the do-gooders, for years they have pushed rules for right for people who have little or no dignity, they end up getting away with most of their wrong doings because they are protected by a law, the law that should strike against them & keep them in line......

 

I'd have to challenge that figure, I suppose on certain sink estates it's possible. In the country as a whole though I'm just not having it that every other kid is tooled up.

I don't accept the self defence arguement either, if it was the case there would be knife fights going on the length and breadth of the country, yet its always an innocent who is the victim.

 

They dont have the man power to do that as the guy driving with a defective number plate is far more of a danger to society it would seem

 

bring back corporal punishment

 

Bring back national service

 

"There are lies, damned lies, and statistics". I don't believe that 46%.

 

its the monkey with a stick scenario...

• monkeys play fight & stronger (bob) one wins
  
• weaker monkey (jim) tries again and looses
  
• jim picks up a stick and hits bob off guard so that jim "wins"
  
• bob finds a sharper/stronger stick and beats jim
  
• jim finds bigger stick and hits bob
  
• bob starts to carry a stick round to protect himself/look cool to the lady monkies
  
• jim finds stones to throw at bob form long distance... the cycle continues

now replace sticks with knives and stones with guns... sound familiar???

its all a game of who has the biggest weapon... world leaders do it regulary (i.e. india & pakistan with the atomic bomb scenario not too long ago)

unfortunately Chip is the most accurate. sad but true...

if a possesion=jail ruling were to be brought in, then you would be getting more tradesmen in jail then anything... i have, many times, gone into town right after work only to reach into my pocket and find my stanley knife that i forgot to put into my box...

personally i blame these american rappers & the uk ones that seem to glamourise(sp) prison and gangster activities... i.e. "50 cent" - famous and sings about how he used to deal crack, and got shot umpteen times... but now he is rich and famous... nice role model!!!

 

I dont believe that 46% carry a knife, and i think the problem is worse down south especially in london. Obviously there are scruffy cunts who carry a knife up here but the whole problem of people getting stabbed doesnt seem to be that bad where i live.

 

nottingham mate... its bad there!

 

I wouldnt say nottingham was in the north of england more the midlands.

 

Carry a gun and get your country back so you can defend yourself

 

Nah, anywhere North of Watford is the North mate.

 

Ye its amazing once your past the watford gap services going south everyone starts driving like a tit and being generaly aggressive and inconsiderate

 

for mee...

in my defence, "NORTHhampton" is south of Notts & Derby...

 

You need more police on the streets conducting more stop and search and not being tied up with pointless bureaucracy. The good old 5090 stop slip when I started out was a very small bit of paper that basically recorded the persons name, desc and reason as to why they had been stopped...well the goverment wanted us to be more accountable and decided to make a form that was so long it would take half hour to complete just for one stop.

It is only now they have realised that it was ridiculous to record so many things that they are reverting back to the old form.

What annoys me is, parents of the kids... well some of them. You stop a youth, conduct the search with a negative result and then hand him a little bit of paper saying you were stopped for x reason. They then take the paper home and show it to mummy or daddy. The next thing is you either have them in the station office or on the phone complaining that their child was stopped by the police, they want to make complaints etc etc. What is the big deal about being stopped by the Police? ok your liberty, (if you want to go into the realms of human rights ) is taken away for a very brief time whilst a search is conducted but if it was my son that was being stopped I wouldnt have a problem with it. Is a 5 min search going to have that negative an effect on his life. I would prefer to think that maybe the Police will actually stop that person with a knife and arrest them, and later that day that person may not stab another youth or worse still their child. I just cant get my head around why parents dont support the Police.... If someone said, we are putting people onto the streets to protect your child you would be over the moon... well thats who the Police are, and that is what we are tring to do!!!!!!

We are fighting a losing battle in my opinion, as no matter what we do, especially around stop and search, we are seen as the bad guys. We are in a no win situation. Policticians, the do gooders and the public should get behind the Police and support them as we agree that knife crime is getting worse... How many kids were stopped wearing body armour 10 years ago!! I think it is a sad world which we are living in... I think we need to take drastic action to take our streets back... no i dont mean being vigilantes, but allow the police to do their job.

I dont believe for a min that youths take knives for their own protection... they take them to look cool in front of their mates and to potentialy use it against someone..

I like many others have a young son and wouldnt like to see him being injured or even worse killed when he is a bit older. I want him to go out playing with his mates in his normal clothes, not dressed up in either a ballistic or stab proof vest. I want him to go to school and being greeted in the morning by his teachers...not by Police officers making sure they walk through a knife arch before they enter..How sad life has really become.

obviously the above is a very small part of the problem.. we need to seriously look at the justice system with regards to sentencing.....

Sorry to rant on, but I really believe that the Police can deal with this problems if we are allowed to.. yes I am a Police officer, I love my job and want to really make a difference.

Oh and as for the comment with regards to number plates and traffic offences.. well we do that as well, and that is a very small part of our work. You may think traffic offences are minor (most of them are), but Policing the roads is as important as policing the streets... criminals use vehicles to travel, and if we can intercept someone before they get to their blag, then we have done a good job... unfortunately a lot of good people get stopped by the Police for your minor offences, ie number plates... all I can say is, if you dont want to get stopped for that reason then dont put them on, simple..there are good reasons why we dont allow non standard font and spacing.. I use to get stopped all the time for mine.. I learnt my lesson and dont use them anymore... They look shite anyway

 

agreed thats the first step

then

* caught with a knife 10 years automatic
* use a knife 30years

not these pathetic sentences that they get

 

see my post above... if we did that then lots of more innocent people would get done... i.e. tradesmen... i use a knife at work almost everyday for various things, but everynow and again i forget that its in my pocket and go into town after work in work gear... if were to get stopped (bearing in mind i have NO intention on using it other than to cut some insulation off a wire) then 10 years inside for being forgetful with further implications for the rest of my life?

anohter scenario - you have just bought a craft knife from a DIY store, leagally, you open and use it in your car for some reason. on your way home you get pulled and the knife is seen on the passenger seat and in your possesion... thats 10 years minimum for buying a knife leagally???

 

If you can prove that you have the knife for a good reason there isnt a problem... You say you bought the knife to cut something in the car... show me what you cut... You cant.. why is it open... Then we start the investigate... There is not a blanket ban on knives.. Otherwise evertime I open my fishing tackle box I would get nicked as I keep a big filleting knife in there. Its the legitimacy of having the knife on your person at that time.. Lets face it, you are still allowed to carry a pen knife... as long as it dont have a locking blade and doesnt exceed 3"...

Well as for carrying a knife in your pocket after forgetting its there... bit silly I know.. but if you have a chap in clean clothes, knife in his pocket.. then questions are going to be raised with the reasons for you having it..down to how good your excuse is for having it

 

thats my point, a blanket, no questions asked ban would not work as knives have legitimate uses

 

as wank as our justice system is, im sure most could tell the difference between a tradesman and the scum who roam the streets, and the difference between a knife which is used for mr bloggs job, and a kitchen knife on some chav

 

but a blanket ban is a blanket ban - no knifes period. how can you have a rule then make exceptions for people who "look" like they shouldnt have it on them or are not going to harm someone. as Metpol said, a valid reason is ok. but a blanket ban is just stupid...

 

it's not a rant, it's a very good post from someone that knows and that i for one am very interested to hear from, and i fully agree with you

 

Good oppertunity to get some genuine answers here guys,seing as we have a member of the police force posting.

Metpol, i'd like to ask what the police themselve feel should be done to stop this happening? given that the views on the street and at the top are very different and its usually the guys at the top that make all the rules.

Would you like more time/manpower to activily patrol the streets or do you feel theres enough already? Do you think the police need more power to search people without having to justify for days as to why?

we can all sit in our armchairs and shout what we think should be done, but i think its the person actually dealing with the issues on the front line day in day out thats more qualified to answer.

 

I belive it all boils down to the do-gooders, not enough support of victims and FAR too much support for crims! Metpol makes some very good points regarding parents not taking responsibility for thier kids, if I had ever come home with any problems with the police, it would have been hell to pay if I was in the wrong!

Unfortunatly people fail to differentiate between the police catching and succesfully prosecuting a crim, only for the courts to hand out a complete waste of time of a sentance, and more than likley be back on the streets the same day ..

The whole country is broken, and needs mending fast. The problems as I see from my own point of view:

1) It is "cool" to be "gangster", totally agree with Nilrem about rappers glamorising being a cunt basically, it is much cooler to mug a granny than help her cross the road

2) No one takes responsibility for thier own actions anymore... If you fell over and grazed your knee, you got up, worked out why you fell over and thought "that hurt, I must learn to not do that again and watch where I am going".... Now, it's who can I sue, ahh, must be the councils/shoe makers fault! Learn to take the concequences of your own actions!! The comp culture is disgusting, especially all the "no win no fee" ambulance chasers making it 1000 times worse

3) A justice system that hands out menial sentances to repeat and serious offenders, and cushy prisons where it is more of a holiday camp. Do you know that prisoners get the same amount of phone call allowance per week as the British forces serving on ops in Iraq/Afghan get?? How is that punishment?

4) The dole/benefit culture.. Why do we support scum? It is there for people who need it not lazy people!

5) No pride in our country

I could go on and on, but basically we need some decent leadership and MUCH tougher sentancing for a start, building a few more prisons would create empolyment as well!

 

Metpol mate I pity all coppers some times, I've got a mate in force and the amount of paper work he has to do is laughable, its not what he joined up for.
The politics, bits of paper prevent you from doing your job, and you get slaughtered in the paper and computer forums for doing your job by the very people you try to help.
The risks, the violence, resentment and anti police feeling you put up with on a daily basis only to see these people given pitiful sentences by the courts would drive me personally insane

I honestly never had a problem with the police and fail to see how others do with the right attitude. I appreciate what you all do, but I just can not comprehend why you do it.

I believe the police can make a difference if permitted to do so however our local community's also have their responsibility to report crime and its this area where I think the members of the public are failing to do enough

 

Unfortunatly, some coppers don't really do themselves or the force any good, a lot of them struggle to talk to "normal" civillians without sounding condecending, and the years pf picking on motorists for petty crap like plates/ speeding etc etc has criminalized most of society, hence the vast majority of the public DON'T trust the police!!