what power would a cossie make with this spec??
7.2.1 cr gt30turbo external rs500 front mount 3bar map sensor bd10 cams ported head gray injectors

 

what injectors?

 

grays

 

well i think greys are maxed out to the max at 440 bhp so would say around 420 ish?

 

whats the nxt step after grays?

 

I am running greys with 408 bhp and 407lb of torque at the wheels so must be near 450 at the flywheel. I was also told the the old standard type exhaust was limiting me and choking it at revs. I've since changed it to a mongoose and the difference is quite noticeable.

My engine is much the same spec but with BD14 and 15 cams and a well ported head. I've also got a wrc head gasket and long studs etc.

Its crap at low speed but when the turbo (T4 on an rs500) comes in you'd better hang on tight!! Great fun ;-0

 

Andy, 408 atw is WAY past 450 atf mate, you're near on 500 atf with that fella..

Mine was 443 atf= 378atw..........

Mind you, is yours 4wd??

 

Gray Injectors will be your limiting factor............430 - 440 absolute max.

 

Mine made 450 bhp and 390 ib/ft with a standard bottom end, standard cams, ported and polished head, grey injectors and a few other mods.

 

YEA........OF COURSE IT DID.

450bhp..........with standard bottom end, standard cams, and a T34..............Someone's pulling your plonker mate, or it did that for 10 seconds at 3bar., because any longer and your engine would have melted.

To start off with, grey injectors would have ran out of cycle way before 450bhp, and your engine would be melted. Standard cams... ! ! ! ! ! ! Then you hold the world record then.

Sorry, but I've been in the Cosworth Engine scene long enough to smell BIG Cow Shit a mile away.

Physical Impossibility with those components.

Simply compare the spec of Staffi's Sapphire Engine against yours, and put two and two together..........

 

wot power would the spec i put up make jim?

 

400bhp id say


mine is maxing out the greys and running lean between 7-7500rpm,so have went siemens 83lb

and mine was 373@wheels

 

Jim Greys will run 450bhp flat out and starting to lean off quite badly at the top end, the most they usually get ran at though is 430-440bhp like you say. Theres no chance it would have made that power on a T34, would have been more like 390bhp Max imo.

Allways makes me laugh when you get people saying i have a 440bhp from a T34, Funny how they get made to look stupid by a 420bhp T4 powered car isnt it?

 

Ta for the nudge Staffi - mine is a 2wd rs500 with the usual T4 etc. I know external shots dont say a lot but here it is going in...




The power figures were mapped by PJ motorsport btw and the dynapack doesn't go over 6,500 revs - but the graph was still rising at that point when the figures were taken. She goes on to 7,500 as she is lightened and balanced too - sorry should have mentioned that earlier.

On the road I've yet to meet anything to touch me, including a mates new Audi R8 which I think cheezed him off somewhat. Still learning to drive it tbh.

 

Andy why didnt you go 8x Greens seeing as you have a 500 inlet. Just interested thats all mate.

 

That was an original plan mate and the greys were a short term solution. I was expecting less power really from them really. I was also learning about the ecu side of things at the time and it seemed to be the cheaper option.

I don't see how on paper it develops the power it does, esp regards the grey's limits as mentioned here. btw I also took out a 380 (Interpro figure) bhp cossie today with quite some margin - big difference... his words not mine.

Does this chat help at all rst-g???

 

yes mate thanks!!!!!!

 

I see where your coming from Andy. The only way it will have made 450bhp+ at the fly will be if the fuel pressure has been wound up a bit.

I loved how mine went on T4 and Greys.

 

Yeah the fuel pressure was upped mate - was yours?

 

No mate mine was set by Ahmed when he mapped it, 3 bar iirc.

Mine was probably only about 420-430bhp though.

 

Mines just so rubbish at the bottom end and I hate traffic.

Right now tho I am super happy when I open her up - you can see the grin for miles

Nice to have some paper 'proof' but being 'the car to beat' around here is probably the best bit. Down side is the whine that is developing in the gbox and I'm on my second diff.

Might get it rolling roaded at some point to see how it compares, especially since the Mongoose feels like its pulling more - or is that just the noise - lol!!

 

Mine was a very different spec to yours tbh, 7.8:1 Comp, Mildly ported head, Port matched inlet, Ahmed inlet cam and standard exhaust cam.

I didnt find it that bad low down and in traffic, just the clutch that was a pig but that will be sorted when it comes back with a Hydro conversion which i now need in order to drive the car.

 

Low comps are generally expected to be lumpier anyway I'm told?? Paddle clutch is heavy I admit. Saw Marco's hydro conversion - impressive!

 

Yes thats true and also your cam choice is very different to mine, this all contribute to it being a bit lumpier low down. The flip side is yours would want to rev more than mine.

 

RST-G : I honestly believe you should get over the 400bhp mark with your GT30, BD10's, Low Comp, and a good modified head. As mentioned above.....with grey injectors, they're on the limit at around 430bhp, and will start running lean underload at high rpm (Basically they're maxed out to their limit for supplying enough fuel at the sort of boost you'll need for 430bhp). Too Lean to risk melting an engine, and not worth the risk. Put in a set of Siemens Blacks, and you should get the 430bhp.assuming you have the right ancillaries....Big Intercooler, Group A Fuel Pump, etc.

 

thanks jim!!!!

 

Talking rubbish am I?

Here you go.



And before you start going on about there must be more done to the engine that I'm letting on then bollocks because I know whats gone on with that engine because I built it.

You're quite welcome to contact Torque Of The Devil and ask them if I'm talking bullshit if it bothers you that much.

Dont start calling me a liar unless you've got the facts.

 

And another thing.

I'm running a T38 not a T34.

Even I know that you wouldnt get that out of a T34.

 

i had a dyno print out for 459 bhp from my t34 engine.....i threw it in the bin and never went back, the t34 simply does not and cannot flow enough air for that power..... 450bhp is t38, or t4 ground.

i did make 377bhp on a t34.48 std cams, flowed head 32psi....went really well, squeezed absolutly everything out of the turbo

my new t4 engine will make big numbers im sure, but be a pig off boost

 

Kitchen Devil: Jim was under the impression the same as I was that your car was running a T34 not a T38.

What was your AFR reading when it did that run on the rollers out of interest? Also what is the base Fuel pressure set at? I know DD dont give unduly high figures either so not doubting those results.

 

AFR was 11.5% which I was assured was perfectly ok.

Regarding fuel pressure, not too sure what it was set at.

 

yes mine makes 391bhp 430lbft at 2.3BAR T34 STG3.48 std engine 1000cc inj so 400 is possible

 

Kitchen Devil : The topic was refering to running a T34..........Not a T38, and from your first post you made no mention of it running a T38. Hence I stated what I did.

With your T38, 450BHP on the engine you described is a very good figure. However, I'm only trying to help people from my own experiences over 16 years of Cosworth ownership and Engine Builds. One bit of advice though (It's down to you wether you want it or not).....But at that BHP Figure, keep an eye on your AFR's if you do any long high speed runs, as the greys are honestly on their very maximum cycles, and any degrading over time of the injectors will lead to your engine running weak, and melting pistons.

Only Offering Advice

By upgrading to Siemens Black injectors, you'd get even more power (Maybe), but you'd definately be running with a safety margin that would protect what appears to be a very good engine, putting out those figures.

 

From what I can see, the thread was referring to the use of an external wastegated GT30.

Maybe I was wrong for not stating what turbo I am using but on the other hand you were also in the wrong for assuming that I was using a T34 and claiming I was talking bullshit.

Best off leaving it at that methinks.

 

kitchen devil - i ll have to keep an eye out for your car... we're pretty local.... looks good. my t34.63 is nearling the end of its life.... i quite fancy going along the t38 route... engine spec doesn't seem drasticaly different to mine.... you've got me thinking now!

 

I think ive seen you about a few times!

I keep getting you confused with one of my mates as hes got a moonstone 3 door with white rondells! looks very similar from a distance!

When I was putting the car together, everybody told me to steer clear of the T38 and fit a T34 as it would be crap, too laggy etc but I dont think its too bad.

Ok its a touch laggy but I just drop down a gear! Lol!

I'm well happy with it though! It pulls really well now!

 

cool.... i'm not overly fussed about the lag... like you say just change down.... i do like the old skool wallop when it finally does make the power

where didyou get your t38 from? i think i might price this up

 

Mines a universal turbos T38 which I got off a mate after he switched to roller bearing T38. I think he got it from Steve Scott at A1 Rallysport.

 

TORQUES ARE PRINTING FAKE GRAPHS!!!!! BE WARNED!!!!!