jattpower

Hi,

new to the forum and from the london area

I have a Escort Cosworth which is a Large turbo...

It is modified stage 3 but likes to overheat which makes me reluctant to put my foot down.

On a long cruise the temp stays fine, but in traffic with stopping and starting it starts to overheat especially when you give it a bit.

I've looked on numerous threads and see the possible solutions are

-thermostat
- saff fan switch

It would be ideal for the fans to kick in earlier but what is the fix for this??

In terms of the sapphire fan switch, how easy is this to install and where do you get one from?

Any help would be mostly appreciated

cheers

Chopper1981

Get yourself over to www.EscortRSCosworth.com mate

james kiely

iTrader: (5)

msd does these switches mate ,82 degree switch is what your looking for

martysmartie

iTrader: (1)

You need to find the underlying cause, you should not need to start changing things.

The Escos uses a two stage fan switch and is far superior to that of the terrible one fitted to the Sierra/Sapphire this is what causes problems with Sierras due to the massive span they have so if you fit one of these you will have more problems.

The MSD 'Uprated' fan switches are completely different to the standard ones and has a span of just a few degrees (Circa 92 degrees on and off at around 88 degrees) opposed to the 11 degree span of the original, it's the 82 degree thermostat you can buy not the switch.

The above about the fans applies to Sierra's though NOT Escort's.

You say it's fine when on the move, which leads me to ask if your fans are working, if not this will be causing the overheating when in traffic.

Where about's in London are you from?


Martin

jattpower

Hi mate,

So its the 82 degree thermostat that will fit?

Yeah the fans are working, but the problem is..they don't kick in quick enough which I think is the problem and thats why I thought a fan switch might be of some use!

West my friend!

I did try and look further but noticed a lot people installing these MSD switches have RS Turbos.

Could the original thermostat be the cause of this problem??

martysmartie

iTrader: (1)

No as otherwise it would be overheating all the time, you say it's only when it's at a standstill but as your fans work it shoulden't be overheating, I guess when the fans come on it does actually cool down and they switch off again?

MSD do an uprated fan switch for both RS Turbo and Sierras but not Escort.

As I say the Escort one is actually far better and works like a modern setup with it being able to have the fans on at different speeds.

I would check the radiator isn't sludged up followed by a flush of the system, or you could try a replacement switch as the current one may be faulty but these very rarely cause problems. Some owners do use the Sierra ones as the Escort ones are hard to come by trouble is you then have only one fan speed and if you do make sure it's the uprated MSD one.

Martin

jattpower

Hi thanks for that,

Sorry for so many questions! Its just that I read that the Sapphire ones are better than the Escos ones? But you've said the complete opposite lol

Thanks for the help, the radiator might be a good check.

MarkN

Could be your fan relay mate;- a few people are starting to have problems with these now. It essentially turns the fan off and on a toggles between high and low speed. If this fails the fans won't work and the car will get hot in traffic.

jattpower

Thanks for the reply.

The thing is, the fans are working, they're just not kicking in earlier enough!

I'll look into all the possible sugguestions you've guys made.

I'm intrigued about the sapphire switch although I've been put off about it possible causing problems?

This is what i read...

'The single stage switch is an UPGRADE on an Escort, as the twin stage one is no good and the temps hover around 100°C all the time in hard use if retained, so keep the Sapphire one'

martysmartie

iTrader: (1)

Oh I get where there coming from, the Sierra one closes at 86 degrees so this would bring your fans on earlier, the trouble is though as I say with these switchesthe 9 to 11 degree span these switches have, this is why the Sierra suffered with melted fuses etc due to the long period the fans are on for although I guess if others are doing it and haven't had problems they may be ok on the Escort.

It was due to the above reasons MSD introduced an uprated switch with a span of just a few degrees and also closing at a higher temperature around 92 degrees opposed to the 86 degrees of the Sierra hence bringing the fans on to early and then they either take ages to go off or stay on all the time.

I should think the first phase of the Escort is around the 92 degree area and so buying an uprated MSD switch woulden't help but a Sapphire one would,the Escos two stage setup was designed to keep the temps high for emission reasons.

Martin

tabetha

Sorry to ask the obvious but how do you quantify overheating ?
What ACTUAL problem is there, is it boiling water out the tank ?, do the fans cycle on and off as they should ?
The bit you qouted is pure shit tbh, temps are regulated by the stat when in motion above around 30mph(sustained) fans should not be needed, if they are then the fans are the least of your problems.
Of course there comes a time when there is insufficient airflow for "natural" cooling when the fans come on, if it is at 100C it doesn't matter so long as they bring the temps down so they cut out again stop worrying, 100C is nothing, and not even remotely boiling wise for an engine, mine are set to come one at 95C and go off at 92C, but in winter will be 100C and 96C, to give me a better hetaer when stuck in traffic ha ha!!
The temp gauges are notoriously unreliable/inaccurate.
You could easily convert to single speed fan if you wanted and have your own set temperature to come in.
Other things you can do is to panel in the rad, and any leak points where air can escape between rad fans etc, but I think you are worrying about nothing, you haven't said it does x/y/z when it "overheats" so I assume the only issue is the gauge reading ?
Two stage fan is for air con, the slow speed runs almost constant when in slow moving traffic to cool the condenser, the high speed is just the "normal" fan.
tabetha

martysmartie

iTrader: (1)

The fan setup was designed to keep temperatures high for emissions reasons when standing still, I am fully aware the way the fans work in fact if you read the earlier posts in the thread the OP states the fans are cycling ok.

Martin

MarkN

Just a thought, -but have you replaced the pressure cap? If this isn't wokring correctly the cooling system will run at a lower pressure and then boil at a lower temperature.

It's a cheap fix; - but it all depends how you describe "overheating".

My cossie will run pretty much half way up the gauge whether moving or stationary.

tabetha

Stat regulates temp not the fan, the temp difference on a fully warmed up engine doesn't need to be artificially high for good emissions just up to temp, around 70C +.
tabetha

martysmartie

iTrader: (1)

I am not saying the fan regulates the temperature the fans will only come on when there is a need to do so, I.E insufficent airflow due to sitting in traffic.

My exact quote was "The two stage fan system on the Escort is to hold the temps high for emissions reasons" which it has nothing to do with the air con either like you say, the exact same can be backed up with quote from Mike Rainbird which reflects what I said below:

"Completely normal for a standard two-speed switch on an Escort. For emission's purposes, the fans try and hold the engine as close to 100°C as possible in traffic. The first (slow speed) comes on at around 93° and the second (high speed) at around 99°."

Martin

Mike Rainbird

iTrader: (3)

As has been said, you really need to define your definition of "overheating".

A Sapphire fan switch will put the fans on full speed at 93°C, which will prevent it from exceeding this in most situations. The Escort one (two speed), comes on slow at 93° and full speed at 99°C. So if this is what you mean by overheating, it is completely normal for this particular car.

jattpower

After giving it a bit or if its in traffic, the temp gauge is max!

And I know this might sound stupid, but just from popping the bonnet and then engine seems very hot and alot hotter than the other cars ive owned

Or maybe I should just get used to the engine producing that much heat?

martysmartie

iTrader: (1)

The engines do run and will be hotter than other cars, the bulk of the heat is generated from the turbo, this does not constitute overheating though.

As said don't rely on the gauge they are not accurate there ok most of the time but do fluctuate badly especially when driving hard, but once you settle down to constant speed they show a more accurate reading. The fact the fans cycle show the temp to be ok!

Martin

Mike Rainbird

iTrader: (3)

That is not very scientific and until you present some factual figures, you're just pissing in the wind "guessing" LOL . Even when my car has just come in from a run (where the temp hasn't exceeded 90°C), the slam panel is too hot to even lean on.

The close confines of an Escort engine bay is a very hostile environment heat wise and for track use, you have to go to a LOT of lengths to shield everything - look at my shielding around the turbo as a prime example:








Despite this, there is nothing I would want to touch in the engine bay once the engine is up to temp .

cossie col

If it is overheating when you give it some and fans are working sounds like you have low pressure in water system. Leave for a while and when you remove header cap is there pressure in there. If not try new cap or might be air lock or in my case start of head gasget on it's way out