Cosworth injector,s
12-07-2017, 10:48 AM
#81
12-07-2017, 06:22 PM
#84
Blimey - you guys still love to argue I see! LOL
To answer the OP's question, the Siemens 72s work well and are still obtainable. The 83s are great but damn hard to find.
4x Siemens 83s will idle at 1.0% CO perfectly on a L8. (assuming jits not a low comp badly cammed tractor of a thing that mechanically cannot do that)
If closed loop is active on a suitable engine then you can add a cat and pass any 2017 emissions test.
The L8 controls pretty accurately down to about 1.2 ms as long as the firmware is tweaked accordingly and the lower load sites stabilised.
Some tuners can only use the old Pectel way of adjusting injector size via the battery adder table which lost you top end resolution on the main table. (not always a bad move - unless you nee all 83lbph) and in turn ended up with a base fuel table they could only have too rich, or too lean.
The P8 is a little better.
I dont like anything bigger on any Weber than 1000cc and at that injector spec your looking at really big power, so you should want to be upgrading ECU hardware for many reasons other than mere injector control anyway.
You ideally want datalogging, temperature and pressure control along with ancillary control and all the other things that a super highly strung motor shpould have in 2017.
To answer the OP's question, the Siemens 72s work well and are still obtainable. The 83s are great but damn hard to find.
4x Siemens 83s will idle at 1.0% CO perfectly on a L8. (assuming jits not a low comp badly cammed tractor of a thing that mechanically cannot do that)
If closed loop is active on a suitable engine then you can add a cat and pass any 2017 emissions test.
The L8 controls pretty accurately down to about 1.2 ms as long as the firmware is tweaked accordingly and the lower load sites stabilised.
Some tuners can only use the old Pectel way of adjusting injector size via the battery adder table which lost you top end resolution on the main table. (not always a bad move - unless you nee all 83lbph) and in turn ended up with a base fuel table they could only have too rich, or too lean.
The P8 is a little better.
I dont like anything bigger on any Weber than 1000cc and at that injector spec your looking at really big power, so you should want to be upgrading ECU hardware for many reasons other than mere injector control anyway.
You ideally want datalogging, temperature and pressure control along with ancillary control and all the other things that a super highly strung motor shpould have in 2017.
The following 3 users liked this post by Stu @ M Developments:
12-07-2017, 06:41 PM
#86
12-07-2017, 06:45 PM
#87
Because running fine is a vague and meaningless statement to make. It is comments like that YOU and others should be questioning.
To support HIS statement with some actual meaning, HE is the one who should have answered like Stu has done.
To support HIS statement with some actual meaning, HE is the one who should have answered like Stu has done.
12-07-2017, 06:54 PM
#88
I'd think if stu mapped it, its running fine at idle and the rest off the rev range !!! He was trying to point out that on his Weber ecu with big injectors the engine idles and runs perfect as it was done rite by a pro !!! Have you ever mapped a Cossy on Weber management ???
12-07-2017, 07:11 PM
#90
12-07-2017, 07:18 PM
#92
12-07-2017, 07:23 PM
#93
PassionFord Post Troll
The man has spoken lol!
12-07-2017, 07:31 PM
#94
12-07-2017, 09:27 PM
#95
PassionFord Post Whore!!
So you are saying that nobody can post a simple bit of information but have to justify it to you first! Read the hundreds of posts on here about all sorts of random things, not everyone writes a page full of detailed information on every subject! I cannot see what exactly you are trying to prove? Maybe you have superior knowledge of injectors than me but your attitude stinks! Lighten up and stop looking for something to put people down about.
12-07-2017, 09:32 PM
#96
So you are saying that nobody can post a simple bit of information but have to justify it to you first! Read the hundreds of posts on here about all sorts of random things, not everyone writes a page full of detailed information on every subject! I cannot see what exactly you are trying to prove? Maybe you have superior knowledge of injectors than me but your attitude stinks! Lighten up and stop looking for something to put people down about.
13-07-2017, 09:00 AM
#98
Guys,
I can see Stevies point but i think it got lost in the summer heat where the nights are long, but internet answers are kept short...
A YB, or indeed almost any engine will idle absolutely beautiful at 10% CO. But that would be really, really bad.
The same engine running 2% CO wouldnt, to the untrained ear, sound any different at all. But that fuel level would be good. (Unless it has a cat - then that would be bad too...)
So Stevies point was just that the mere fact it idles lovely doesnt mean the injector pulsewidth was able to be set low enough in that ECU for nice sensible emissions levels and indeed fuel; efficiency.
Stevies reply was actually on topic, but came across a little blunt I think.
Steve, to be fair, is one of the most knowledgable people on here, most of us can learn something from him, so dont hang him just yet... he might know something that I still need to!
I can see Stevies point but i think it got lost in the summer heat where the nights are long, but internet answers are kept short...
A YB, or indeed almost any engine will idle absolutely beautiful at 10% CO. But that would be really, really bad.
The same engine running 2% CO wouldnt, to the untrained ear, sound any different at all. But that fuel level would be good. (Unless it has a cat - then that would be bad too...)
So Stevies point was just that the mere fact it idles lovely doesnt mean the injector pulsewidth was able to be set low enough in that ECU for nice sensible emissions levels and indeed fuel; efficiency.
Stevies reply was actually on topic, but came across a little blunt I think.
Steve, to be fair, is one of the most knowledgable people on here, most of us can learn something from him, so dont hang him just yet... he might know something that I still need to!
13-07-2017, 09:18 AM
#99
PassionFord Post Troll
Stu what other ecu's do you tune for cosworths?
13-07-2017, 09:27 AM
#101
PassionFord Post Troll
I'm weighing up my options mate, I have an l8 but by time I buy wasted spark, closed loop, launch control anti lag and electronic boost control I'm wondering if I'd be better off going for a different ecu altogether? What would you recommend and map?
Need a new loom regardless of what ecu I use
Need a new loom regardless of what ecu I use
13-07-2017, 12:48 PM
#102
13-07-2017, 12:50 PM
#103
So you are saying that nobody can post a simple bit of information but have to justify it to you first! Read the hundreds of posts on here about all sorts of random things, not everyone writes a page full of detailed information on every subject! I cannot see what exactly you are trying to prove? Maybe you have superior knowledge of injectors than me but your attitude stinks! Lighten up and stop looking for something to put people down about.
That isnt putting anyone down, it's just trying to get proper and useful information out there so people without experience will not be mislead.
13-07-2017, 12:54 PM
#104
I'm weighing up my options mate, I have an l8 but by time I buy wasted spark, closed loop, launch control anti lag and electronic boost control I'm wondering if I'd be better off going for a different ecu altogether? What would you recommend and map?
Need a new loom regardless of what ecu I use
Need a new loom regardless of what ecu I use
There are so many options out there these days it's easy to pick something that initially looks ok or cheap, only to struggle with it weeks, months down the line, especially if you cannot get support for it, or if you decide you want more at a later date and it's a dead end or cannot be upgraded.
Although must stuff these days is fairly good
13-07-2017, 02:15 PM
#105
PassionFord Post Troll
Always pick an ecu that your chosen tuner is happy with, and that meets your needs both for now and the future. And that you know you can always get good support for, locally if needed.
There are so many options out there these days it's easy to pick something that initially looks ok or cheap, only to struggle with it weeks, months down the line, especially if you cannot get support for it, or if you decide you want more at a later date and it's a dead end or cannot be upgraded.
Although must stuff these days is fairly good
There are so many options out there these days it's easy to pick something that initially looks ok or cheap, only to struggle with it weeks, months down the line, especially if you cannot get support for it, or if you decide you want more at a later date and it's a dead end or cannot be upgraded.
Although must stuff these days is fairly good
13-07-2017, 02:48 PM
#106
13-07-2017, 05:02 PM
#110
PassionFord Post Whore!!
That was my line of thought mate they seem to go out of fashion quickly these days and get branded dated as soon as the next model comes out so last thing I'd want is 2-3 years down the line when I change spec to find no cosworth specialists will touch a it. MSD isn't a ridiculous journey from me so it would be whatever he could do really.
Mark
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Adam-M (13-07-2017)
17-07-2017, 07:48 AM
#111
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using low impedance injector on this setup is illogical. its very problematic tune high flow low impedance injector on idle!!!
if you want to reduce cost...and have still IAW. buy 4Q4 ECU from fiat coupe, find immo off bin, put high impedance motorsport injectors...and you are fine.
but you need to tune it
if you want to reduce cost...and have still IAW. buy 4Q4 ECU from fiat coupe, find immo off bin, put high impedance motorsport injectors...and you are fine.
but you need to tune it
17-07-2017, 09:46 AM
#112
using low impedance injector on this setup is illogical. its very problematic tune high flow low impedance injector on idle!!!
if you want to reduce cost...and have still IAW. buy 4Q4 ECU from fiat coupe, find immo off bin, put high impedance motorsport injectors...and you are fine.
but you need to tune it
if you want to reduce cost...and have still IAW. buy 4Q4 ECU from fiat coupe, find immo off bin, put high impedance motorsport injectors...and you are fine.
but you need to tune it
To say using low impedance injectors on a setup/ecu that uses low impedance injectors is illogical...is also "illogical". Even more so when it's already been well proven they work.
Now if you had already changed to an ecu that does not necessitate low impedance injectors, then it might make some sense. Changing to an ecu purely so you can use high impedance, especially an OEM ecu that can still only be tuned by a handful of people...makes no sense.
17-07-2017, 11:48 AM
#113
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which injector is better for 4 cyl engine with 800cc
low or high impedance?
you have your answer....
ofcourse you can buy another ecu like vems, link...etc
low or high impedance?
you have your answer....
ofcourse you can buy another ecu like vems, link...etc
17-07-2017, 11:52 AM
#114
Whichever is correct for the ecu you are using.
There is no generic answer that one 800cc is better than the other, because there are many makes and designs of injector regardless of HighZ or LowZ
There is no generic answer that one 800cc is better than the other, because there are many makes and designs of injector regardless of HighZ or LowZ
17-07-2017, 09:24 PM
#115
PassionFord Post Whore!!
And another example why peoples posts need questioned !!
To say using low impedance injectors on a setup/ecu that uses low impedance injectors is illogical...is also "illogical". Even more so when it's already been well proven they work.
Now if you had already changed to an ecu that does not necessitate low impedance injectors, then it might make some sense. Changing to an ecu purely so you can use high impedance, especially an OEM ecu that can still only be tuned by a handful of people...makes no sense.
To say using low impedance injectors on a setup/ecu that uses low impedance injectors is illogical...is also "illogical". Even more so when it's already been well proven they work.
Now if you had already changed to an ecu that does not necessitate low impedance injectors, then it might make some sense. Changing to an ecu purely so you can use high impedance, especially an OEM ecu that can still only be tuned by a handful of people...makes no sense.
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Cossy3486 (17-07-2017)
25-07-2017, 07:04 PM
#118
PassionFord Post Troll
26-07-2017, 11:52 AM
#119
Regular Contributor
Blimey - you guys still love to argue I see! LOL
To answer the OP's question, the Siemens 72s work well and are still obtainable. The 83s are great but damn hard to find.
4x Siemens 83s will idle at 1.0% CO perfectly on a L8. (assuming jits not a low comp badly cammed tractor of a thing that mechanically cannot do that)
If closed loop is active on a suitable engine then you can add a cat and pass any 2017 emissions test.
The L8 controls pretty accurately down to about 1.2 ms as long as the firmware is tweaked accordingly and the lower load sites stabilised.
Some tuners can only use the old Pectel way of adjusting injector size via the battery adder table which lost you top end resolution on the main table. (not always a bad move - unless you nee all 83lbph) and in turn ended up with a base fuel table they could only have too rich, or too lean.
The P8 is a little better.
I dont like anything bigger on any Weber than 1000cc and at that injector spec your looking at really big power, so you should want to be upgrading ECU hardware for many reasons other than mere injector control anyway.
You ideally want datalogging, temperature and pressure control along with ancillary control and all the other things that a super highly strung motor shpould have in 2017.
To answer the OP's question, the Siemens 72s work well and are still obtainable. The 83s are great but damn hard to find.
4x Siemens 83s will idle at 1.0% CO perfectly on a L8. (assuming jits not a low comp badly cammed tractor of a thing that mechanically cannot do that)
If closed loop is active on a suitable engine then you can add a cat and pass any 2017 emissions test.
The L8 controls pretty accurately down to about 1.2 ms as long as the firmware is tweaked accordingly and the lower load sites stabilised.
Some tuners can only use the old Pectel way of adjusting injector size via the battery adder table which lost you top end resolution on the main table. (not always a bad move - unless you nee all 83lbph) and in turn ended up with a base fuel table they could only have too rich, or too lean.
The P8 is a little better.
I dont like anything bigger on any Weber than 1000cc and at that injector spec your looking at really big power, so you should want to be upgrading ECU hardware for many reasons other than mere injector control anyway.
You ideally want datalogging, temperature and pressure control along with ancillary control and all the other things that a super highly strung motor shpould have in 2017.
..