89xr2

Ok, basically my mate is running an Innovate Motorsports LM1 Wideband meter on his renault 5. We've been having a play with the boost and i'm basically trying to find out what I should be looking at with regards air/fuel/lambda etc. Now, i'm quite a beginner to this so would like a bit of help trying to understand what I should be looking for, what's good, what's bad etc. Things I should be listening out for and that sort of thing.

Now the car, it's a Renault 5 GT Turbo, running 20psi of boost through a T25. The only other mods to the car is a side exit, big cone filter mounted right at the front of the engine in the cold air. And a big front mount intercooler mounted through his bumper. The rest of the engine etc is standard.

Any info etc you could provide would be brilliant. He's tried asking on the RTOC website but found alot of the info contradictory and people don't seem all to eager to help. I know we've got alot of very knowledgeable people on here so figured this would be the place to ask.

The car in question :




Thanks in advance.

The DIVA

iTrader: (3)

On full boost cycle in fourth gear you want to be seeing about 11.7-11.8 AFR max........Anything over that is getting lean and once you get over 12.2-12.3 AFR you are approaching meltdown territory.....

89xr2

That's the sort of info I want to get. Cheers mate.

That's what I mean about the info on the RTOC being contadictory as well, on there they say seeing 12.5 on full boost is good.

Chip

iTrader: (3)

12.5 on full boost is the reason so many of the cunts melt their headgaskets, lol

It will make more power than 11.7 like robbie suggests, but Im with him on this one, stick it to the 11s where its safe, sod 5bhp extra!

89xr2

Ok, 11's it is then. It's been running at 12.1/2 on full boost for the last week including some rather spirited driving on sunday when it was bloody warm. I can't see it making that much power running in the 11's would it?

It's bloody quick already considering what he's spent on it. 0-60 is well under 6 seconds. I'm seriously tempted to buy one myself as I have a certain one in mind as well

Any chance you could give me a rundown on the sort of AFR's he should be running throughout? Obviously I know you can't go into too much detail and cover everything but any info you can give me would be brilliant. I'm really interested in learning this kind of stuff and am more than willing to learn.

The DIVA

iTrader: (3)

If the carb is in good nick and it will stay at 12.1-12.2 on full chat it may be ok mate,but don`t forget these little motors are already highly stressed as it is and it only need a little fuel flow glitch on the limit to toast a motor....

89xr2

I meant to write I cant see running it in the 11's losing that much power

I know he'd rather sway on the side of caution as he's only running a standard engine and 20 psi is a fair bit to whack through it. To drop the afr a touch would it be ok just to make the main jet slightly larger or would that have a detrimental effect on the car at all the other throttle openings?

CozzyBrom

what you mean to say diva is there shit french crap that forever blow engines

i think the only good thing reno do is there f1 cars

The DIVA

iTrader: (3)

I was trying to be diplomatic..

Chip

iTrader: (3)

The ballpark i would be aiming for personally would be something like:

25 psi = 11.7
20 psi = 12.0
15 psi = 12.2
10psi = 12.5
5 psi = 14-15 (you need to be checking EGT before holding a 15 flat on even moderate boost, so go 14 if in any doubt)
0 psi = 15
<0 psi = 15

And obviously interpolate between those

Rick

Very good ball park figures those. At the top end of the rev range you may see cooler EGT's going down to 11.2, but it depends on the individual engine and how agressive the ignition curve is. With a carb u will be shifting the overall fuelling one way or another - if you can get the top end in the 11's but u have an area in the midrange which is in the high 10's, then don't worry too much

GARETH T

i would love a fuel injected R5,,, ive always liked them

89xr2

Can you elaborate on what jets etc do what at which throttle opening etc etc. on the r5 carb? and at which psi each would be working? I know a bit about it and my mate knows a bit more but it would be good to get peoples thoughts etc. on here.

89xr2

If we can get an R5 cheap enough my mate and I are going to do a budget 1.7 conversion and see what power we can get out of it

foreigneRS

he should get a better bonnet catch first - his bonnet has fallen off into the hedge when he stopped for that photo

Stavros

Do a search for FiestaCossies setting up of his XR2T

He used a R5GTT carb and played with all the jet sizes and knows EXACTLY what to change for what reason.

In my experience there no massive harm in running them rich, they 2valve per cyl 1.4 engines with very basic ign control, not the most det resistant thing, and they need boooooooooooost to get em going, a tiny bit rich isnt gonna lose much, but will help it live.

Awesome cars though, i love em, FWD 1.4turbo where theres loads of them running 11sec quarters, that tells you they far from shit

89xr2

Stavros Do you know if you can adjust the fuel pressure on a standard GTT setup? Basically we need to slightly richen it and i've been advised that we should be able to sort that out by upping the fuel pressure very slightly.

Stavros

they run an injection style setup with a high pressure pump and a return to the tank from a fuel pressure reg, so in theory, yes.

thing is, i cant for the life of me remember if the regulator is adjustable at all, but easy thing to do is to buy a carb adjustable reg and fit that.

needs to be a carb one as it needs to give the base pressure of about 7psi fuel or whatever they run (i forget).

cant go too high pressure as it will fuck the carb.

on some GTTs you can mess with the mixture screw enough to sort out minor fueling issues, but guess this one is too much for that then.

fuel is but a mere bigger main jet away tho... (as long as youve uprated the pump, as they not great for big power)

89xr2

I think the regulator should be 4psi above boost from what i've read on the RTOC today.

He's been running the standard fuel pump and also the fuel filter hasnt been changed since he bought it. Was completely standard when he got it and now running the T25 and 20psi.

I've been out and bought him an uprated bosch pump today along with a new fuel filter. Do you think they might sort out the fueling enough to get it a bit safer?

The other night it was running 12.4/5 on full boost but I think that was because of differences in fuel. He's only run Vpower before and it's always been 12.1/2 but used normal super the other day and the afr went up. Does that sound feasible? Basically i'm trying to learn as much as I can but am still having quite a bit of trouble understanding what has an effect on what.

When you say mixture screw is that the second stage enrichment adjuster? Screw on the right hand side of the carb?

I totally agree with you on them being brilliant cars as well. Since he's sorted the suspension (rears were fucked when he first got it hence it feeling like I was going to die. ) and the car is spot on. Handles really well and goes like hell for a 1.4 especially for the amount of money it's cost him to do the bits he's done. I'm actually thinking about getting one myself instead of a 205 now.

Stavros

yeah, the screw on the carb, careful it dont fall out, put a blob of silicone sealant in the hole once u finished messing with it.

4psi higher than boost? thoughyt they was rising rate? Ie 1-1 with fuel? If not, thats well dodgy surely?

Suprised its coping well as it is with stock setup barring 20psi on a t25, but fair play.

Experermenting is fun, just careful nnowt goes wrong, as then it gets more expensive, lol.

Uprated headgasket n bolts is childs play to fit tho.

And yeah, the handlings amazing, but as they accelerate so fast the handling never gets a mention.
Thats why people spank one off over 205s, the handlings amazing compared to the average straight line speed, wheras 5s have it both IMO.

Get one. Get me one too, i want another, lol.