Finally fitted my msd chip after weeks waiting for a standard daughter board, followed instructions and it fired up lovely, when to get the co checked, it was showing 9% as apposed to the 0.9% in the instructions or so I thought, however the guy with the equipment said that 0.9 was probably reffering to AFR on the instructions I think im correct and its refering to CO. When I left the car was 2% co at adle with all electrics off but dropped to 0.83% when the fans cut in, both these figures where accompanied by lambda 1 AFR do I need to further adjust the CO? will 2% CO on idle cause me a problem with the closed loop chip. Thanks in advance Trev.

 

Did you set the co with the idle speed control valve disconnected ??

Al.

 

no i dont recall the instructions saying to do so

 

Did you turn Co screw five times clockwise and back two turns?

Mine's 0.7 Co at idle

What lambda sensor are u using?

 

you can't have lambda = 1 at 2 different CO levels at lambda = 1, CO should be 0.9% simple as that.

check the graph here http://www.autoshop101.com/forms/h56...oxide%20Nox%22

sounds like the operator doesn't have a clue what he's talking about

 

yes and that put me miles off

 

Speak to Stu then sound's an odd one

sorry can't be more help.

 

To be fair perhaps my statement was a little miss leading it was very close to lambda 1 at both points 0.8 and 2% co unfortunately the sun gas analiser I was looking at did not show the ratio but a lamda value so it was like 1.01 and 0.96 something like that obviously the lower figure was for the 2% co reading

 

Evening Trevor.

The most common reasons for high idle co are as follows:

1) Tested engine too cold so closed loop not actually active.
2) Fuel pressue wrong.
3) Cam timing wrong.

The above all pressume correct sensor operation of course.
(map sensor output drift is a common one, affecting idle pressure most)

If i can be of any assistance whatsoever please feel free to call me on Monday mate, happy to help.

 

Fuel pressure 3 bar at idle?

is that correct Stu?

cheers

Paul

 

3.5bar with the pipe disconnected and plugged Paul. Pressure with it then connected should be in teh region of 3.0, but the most important measurement is the one done with it DISCONNECTED.

 

Hi Stu Thanks for the reply I dont know if the fuel pressure is correct i need to check it, the anti tamper cap is still in place though, car was nice and warm I waited for the fans to cut in and out before checking the CO I could have made it less than 0.9% but was miss guided by the guy that owns the equipment I.e if it was a CO value or Lambda value. The thing that concerns me is the large change in co between fans on and fans off?

 

Cheers stu the book say's 3.5 bar ign on and 3.0 bar running.

BUT i will check it and do it as you said as thats the pressure you map on

trevCOSS you will find a difference due to the amount of amps the fans take to run and if your alt is up to it.

 

Engine running i presume stu?

 

Dont forget you have to adjust the base idle speed to make sure its stable with such low fuel levels. When you have it all correct you can unplug the ISCV and nothing will happen at all. NOTHING.

The ecu has a large voltage drop with the fans kicking in id say. Try a meter on pin 20 of teh ecu with fans off and on, see what you get. You want it to stay above 13.5v at all times ideally.

Try the same at teh fuel pump too, worth a check.

 

Thats the same as i said if you think about it.
Engine running only means 2 things to the reg.

1) Fuel is flowing through it.
2) vac is applied to the pipe.



The reason to do it my way is simple, with engine off, you will get a brief peak and then it will start to fall down. Its better to take a constant real world reading.

 

LOL i'm tired yes PLUGGED is the key word

cheers Mate very happy with all you have supplied me



Paul

 

Fuel pump is a new 044 with a dedicated feed straight from my power distribution block (connected directly to the battery) fusable links have been replaced but I think you are correct as I am only seeing 13v on my secs monitor and a good 0.5v drop at least when the fans kick in on idle

 

following Stu's advice I spent today My Wifes Birthday hunting for more voltage on the car I started by putting new earth straps on for both battery to body and battery to engine, this gave me Altenator 14.1V altenator with earth on battery 14.1V battery 13.7v various points in the car 13.6v fuel pump 13.68v SECS monitor 13.3v all readings hot idle all electrics off. I then decided to check what voltage I was getting in and out of the relay that switches/ powers the ecu 13.6 volts, I then traced the supply wire to the ecu and found it to be interrupted by my imobilisor circuit! I think I have my 0.3V and will check tomorrow. Any ideas why I see 14. at the altenator and 13,7 at the battery, I have removed the altenator terminal and cleaned it all and the same for the other end, also checked the resistance of the wire which showed 4 ohms. Do I need to replace the wire from the altenator to the battery?

 

That voltage drop is minimal what ur getting now seems ok to me

don't think theres any need to change wire..

Hope this sorts it out for you

 

4 ohms is very bad. You should have a reading of zero ohms.

 

Hmm, aint that lamda figure you mention on the SUN gas analyzer something completet different than the lambda AFR? I thought it was a figure that you got from adding up the different values like CO and HC und so weiter...?

 

that was my thought but wasnt to confident, been a long time since I did electrical stuff in collage you know 4 isnt exacly a big number I will replace the wire to be sure that its ok and hopefully see more voltage at the battery

 

the best way to test the operation is if you can get hold of an oscilloscope, or lots of later Mot gas analysers have a lambda test function
measure the signal and it should look like mine, alternating from rich to weak around the stoich. point

measuring lambda and CO are not ideal as an exhaust blow will raise lambda and drop CO
which sun analyser was it , dga 1800 or 2500? was the reading you're talking about at the top or bottom of the screen?

cheers
Stu

 

you are quite coorrect in that lambda is calculated from CO, CO2 and o2 etc, however there are 2 different methods ( brettschneider, spindt) that give different results, and the SUN machine can be set to either

 

4ohms is poor on a wire of that size and length and indicates serious corrosion and should be changed. You will find its rock hard around the turbo area...

 

yeap, i did the alternator wire on mine ,and gained 1 volt at the battery!

Made all the windows etc work better!

 

does the fuel adjust even make a difference to the car at idle? surely if the car is in the parameters of closed loop ,whatever you do to the mixture it will set itself to lambda 1, thats the whole point of it?

The fuel adjuster changes the fueling on the original map when out of closed loop parameter, im probably completley wrong!!

 

stu can you please move to london and set up a garage here so i can get you to insall my closed loop chip, as i thought it was plug and play, but it seems there is more too it.

i know a good estate agent

 

i did mine myself ,as long as the car is set up as stu recomends ,ie fuel pressure/boost, and all sensors are working and correct, all you will need is a fueling check after to make sure its good and thats it.

 

how do you check the fuel pressure yourself.

i feel i may have a long drive ahead when i want this done, at least i'll use less fuel on the way back

 

you need a fuel pressure tester, and check the line presure. ,any good garage should have one, they are quite expensive to buy.

 

you think you have a long drive! i want a live map

 

Its well worth the drive And with closed loop suprisingly not that bad on the wallet Plymouth to Blackpool on 3/4 tank

 

i got to get that done

 

That was at 75-80mph with a few full boost test runs

 

seems it will be well worth it.

dont need the live map, but a good check over wouldnt go amiss.

sometime soon

 

Not bad on 83lb Siemens injectors with a T38 eh?

 

am i right stu?

 

Not bad at all Stu, just don't tell Kenny