THANKS AGAIN, NUTS rus.
ya iv,e been on a long ride, they said it was the thermostat that was making the car judder when hot, the thermostat was telling the ecu it was cold so more fuel was given, and thats what i took it in for, so its sound like it was the thermastat all along, beats me how a ford dealer could miss something as simple as that,.
thank you

ps. i plan to take this to head office and more, could i use your information as some back up please.

Toniboy