ST170, mondeo brake upgrade!

[Burnzybubbles]

it's coming up to mot time and my brakes where feeling a bit shite esp with my new tyres (they wouldn't even lock the wheel up) and got worse when carrying stuff for work. decided on upgrading them too 300mm st170 disks with mk3 mondeo calipers and have to say there just bedding in and there the bollocks not given them full force yet but tried them out slightly and it pinned me to my belt . best of all only cost me about £120 for new disks and pads and some second hand st220 mk3 calipers i don't think that was too much of a bad deal tbh. so for anyone else out there looking to upgrade to st170 disks it's well worth it, i can only imagine how much of an improvement they would be on an escort gti or rs2000, obviously not as good as a set of 6 pots or summit but for the fraction of the cost don't think you could find any better . (edit to say) i think to fit them onto an escort you need the st170 calipers but not 100% sure on that. some piccies just to see the difference for people that care oh! and excuse the state of the wheels and how dirty my car is i do alot of miles in the week with it so basically impossible to keep clean

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[zetecdan]

done mine a few years back, a worthwhile upgrade.

[dojj]

any mk3 mondeo will provide the calipers mate
just need to go with the st170 discs unles you're like me and plan to drill out the mondeo stuff

[melinamotor]

I did this on my old ST200, well worth the investment

[phil_focus]

i did the st170 upgrade to my 2l zetec focus. more involved as the knuckles have to be changed aswell but i agree its well worth doing...especially as the modeo is a heavier car than mine.

ps. its also worth checking your rear discs and pads too. mine were well worn...to the point where the handbrake lever (on the caliper) wouldnt return to the stop. put new discs and pads on last week and wow, brakes feel even better!!!

[Burnzybubbles]

my mondy is only a 1.8 so has drums at the back at the mo, and they deffo work , with such a shite turning circle i'v given up on 3 point turns .

but like you stated made such an improvement my brakes where shit before, and they'v got alot more bite at higher speeds esp for when that twat pull's out on you in the fast lane , if i find a high spec mondy in the scrappers i'll deffo be taking the rear hubs off it for some rear disks .

bet it made a massive difference on the focus too, i was gunna do it to my little mk5 escort i'm gutted i didn't now, i bet it would of outbraked alot of cars on the road esp as it was a 1.4 it weighed about 950kg's

[hineho87]

iv got a 1.8 focus with drums on the back and was lookin at upgrading to the st170 set up on the front. Would it make much difference if i left the drums on the back as money is bit short at momentMatt

[tabetha]

I think one of the reasons for not locking thw wheels before may have been the tyres, having so much grip, they are good though aren't they, can't wait till I get some more on the astra, and rear of sapphy.
As you say though a massive improvement for minimal money, though I do know a festa mk2 1.0(950) with ap's and 355mm discs/calipers, and the brakes are shit as they don't get hot enough, and a boggo std car at that.
tabetha

[dojj]

Originally Posted by hineho87

iv got a 1.8 focus with drums on the back and was lookin at upgrading to the st170 set up on the front. Would it make much difference if i left the drums on the back as money is bit short at momentMatt

on a smaller road car the fronts do a lot of the stopping so the rears can be ok with just drums

i don't think you can ever over brake a road car

[rsturbo27]

wot do u guys think on these discs http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/FOCUS-ST170-FR...item45e8b1f0e2

[hineho87]

Originally Posted by dojj

on a smaller road car the fronts do a lot of the stopping so the rears can be ok with just drums

i don't think you can ever over brake a road car

yea thats fine, just means it will be cheaper option for now.

Matt

[yellowsierra]

I done mine a while back now and just like you, mine was due its mot and the brakes were gonna be a deffo fail so it was ripe for an upgrade as they are shite for std brakes
I went the V6 Mondy route which is still 280mm
Simple job as you say and very inexpensive
Here's mine
Before

after

Now you want to do the rear and really make the difference and get a working handbrake as well by fitting an RS2K disc beam

[dojj]

if you want to go the 300 disc route, you can use the calipers from any mk3 mondeo as they are all the ame, so don't pay over the odds for st220 ones over the bottom of the range 1.8

[yellowsierra]

I think the whole front conversion cost me about £200 as everything is available from Factors
The disc beam came via ebay for £100 shipped

[hineho87]

Originally Posted by dojj

if you want to go the 300 disc route, you can use the calipers from any mk3 mondeo as they are all the ame, so don't pay over the odds for st220 ones over the bottom of the range 1.8

yea herd you can go for any mk3 mondeo calipers. How much shud i be lookin pay from scrappy for them?

How much roughly for other bits i need for front conversion?

Matt

[Burnzybubbles]

Originally Posted by tabetha

I think one of the reasons for not locking thw wheels before may have been the tyres, having so much grip, they are good though aren't they, can't wait till I get some more on the astra, and rear of sapphy.
As you say though a massive improvement for minimal money, though I do know a festa mk2 1.0(950) with ap's and 355mm discs/calipers, and the brakes are shit as they don't get hot enough, and a boggo std car at that.
tabetha

yea it was that exact reason lol, as soon as i put them hankooks on my brakes couldn't handle it , had to swap them onto the back for now cos i'v been quite hard on them and chewed them up already , i'll burn down the old set of tyres and then put some new ones on so i have them all round, my car is also in desperate need of a alignment so it's hasn't helped one bit, and yea for the cost you can't go wrong, if i went to a garage to have them done back to standard it would of cost me loads more.

i can't see the point of wasting all that cash for a little 1 pop fez i bet they cost more than the car itself, can see where your coming from but i bet the choice of pad for the ap's need more heat in them as they are a race upgrade instead of getting mk3 pads witch should work from cold, still extremely chuffed with them they are so much nicer to drive with compared to the standard brakes.

Originally Posted by dojj

if you want to go the 300 disc route, you can use the calipers from any mk3 mondeo as they are all the ame, so don't pay over the odds for st220 ones over the bottom of the range 1.8

tbh having the st220 calipers was just by chance, seen them on ebay at £30 with no bid's and they went for £30 in the end and £45 with delivery , i was searching for any type of mk3 but these came along cheapy cheap.

Originally Posted by yellowsierra

I think the whole front conversion cost me about £200 as everything is available from Factors
The disc beam came via ebay for £100 shipped

i managed to get it down to £120 but that was with searching alot on the bay, was gunna do the rs2000 beam conversion on my escort but it got written off before i had the chance (not by me i might add lol)

Originally Posted by hineho87

yea herd you can go for any mk3 mondeo calipers. How much shud i be lookin pay from scrappy for them?

How much roughly for other bits i need for front conversion?

Matt

like said i got it for £120ish i'll get on my ebay and put links on the disks and pads i got there budget and they have been fine so far but with the weather i haven't given them a real caning to see how hot they can handle, and the calipers are the only thing to really change the price cos it varies so much i was quite lucky but thats not to say you couldn't find another bargain on there, oh yea don't forget the 3mm washers to push the carrier out as they sit in too much without them and you'll be pissed with no brakes when you find out, another note my calipers came with hoses and they where quite tight the standard hoses looked shorter so not sure if they'll go hopefully someone can come along and correct me though.

one more thing change all your fluid for dot 5.1 i'v found mine still a little spongey as i'v got the bigger calipers but still firm i think dot 4 would make this worse, made my clutch feel better too

[hineho87]

Originally Posted by Burnzybubbles

yea it was that exact reason lol, as soon as i put them hankooks on my brakes couldn't handle it , had to swap them onto the back for now cos i'v been quite hard on them and chewed them up already , i'll burn down the old set of tyres and then put some new ones on so i have them all round, my car is also in desperate need of a alignment so it's hasn't helped one bit, and yea for the cost you can't go wrong, if i went to a garage to have them done back to standard it would of cost me loads more.

i can't see the point of wasting all that cash for a little 1 pop fez i bet they cost more than the car itself, can see where your coming from but i bet the choice of pad for the ap's need more heat in them as they are a race upgrade instead of getting mk3 pads witch should work from cold, still extremely chuffed with them they are so much nicer to drive with compared to the standard brakes.



tbh having the st220 calipers was just by chance, seen them on ebay at £30 with no bid's and they went for £30 in the end and £45 with delivery , i was searching for any type of mk3 but these came along cheapy cheap.



i managed to get it down to £120 but that was with searching alot on the bay, was gunna do the rs2000 beam conversion on my escort but it got written off before i had the chance (not by me i might add lol)



like said i got it for £120ish i'll get on my ebay and put links on the disks and pads i got there budget and they have been fine so far but with the weather i haven't given them a real caning to see how hot they can handle, and the calipers are the only thing to really change the price cos it varies so much i was quite lucky but thats not to say you couldn't find another bargain on there, oh yea don't forget the 3mm washers to push the carrier out as they sit in too much without them and you'll be pissed with no brakes when you find out, another note my calipers came with hoses and they where quite tight the standard hoses looked shorter so not sure if they'll go hopefully someone can come along and correct me though.

one more thing change all your fluid for dot 5.1 i'v found mine still a little spongey as i'v got the bigger calipers but still firm i think dot 4 would make this worse, made my clutch feel better too

cheers for that m8, will keep eye out on ebay!! Dont think i need the 3mm washers as its on a focus.

Matt

[Burnzybubbles]

the disks and pads i'm using, like said i brought budget just to get me going there more than useable, and can upgrade when you'v got a bit of cash sitting in your pocket

Disks

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...ht_2097wt_1028

Pad's

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...#ht_3162wt_682

i'v gone for the same makers so i no they will work best instead of chopping and changing brands

a list of calipers

http://shop.ebay.co.uk/i.html?_nkw=m...pers&_osacat=0
there usually sold seperately but there is a pair from the same seller for £19.98 with £7.50 postage that looks a good deal from what i'v seen in the past.

you wont find a mk 3 mondy in the scrappers really atm and even then doubt they'll let a pair of calipers go for £40

[hineho87]

Originally Posted by Burnzybubbles

the disks and pads i'm using, like said i brought budget just to get me going there more than useable, and can upgrade when you'v got a bit of cash sitting in your pocket

Disks

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...ht_2097wt_1028

Pad's

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.d...#ht_3162wt_682

i'v gone for the same makers so i no they will work best instead of chopping and changing brands

a list of calipers

http://shop.ebay.co.uk/i.html?_nkw=m...pers&_osacat=0
there usually sold seperately but there is a pair from the same seller for £19.98 with £7.50 postage that looks a good deal from what i'v seen in the past.

you wont find a mk 3 mondy in the scrappers really atm and even then doubt they'll let a pair of calipers go for £40

cheers m8, will keep look out and check out fittin costs as i wudnt want do it meself. Any idea on timescales to i can price it up?

So i will need calipers from mk3 mondy, discs from st170. i wil also need knuckles and pads, can they be from mondy or st170? wot is best for brakes hoses?

Matt

[Burnzybubbles]

well it took me about 4.5 hours all in with the fluid change and setting up, on a ramp in a workshop i'd hope to have it done in 3hrs top's, but tbh it's really not that hard the changing of brakes is basically bolt off and on, then fluid change is best done with a pressure bleeder and if so more or less fool proof .

i'd say have a pop yourself if you've got a mate that know's a little about cars get the tins in and let him give you a hand , make sure you have some copper grease too used it on most the bolts you take off and the backs of the pads then clean the disks up at the end with brake and carb cleaner just to make sure there clean to bet them in, the copper grease is just to help for future removal i use it on every bolt that's submitted to the elements so it'll never seize and snap .

P.s they'll feel shit once done for the first 200 mile whilst you bed them in (i mean proper shite) so just use them gently, after that they'll stop like fook

[hineho87]

Originally Posted by Burnzybubbles

well it took me about 4.5 hours all in with the fluid change and setting up, on a ramp in a workshop i'd hope to have it done in 3hrs top's, but tbh it's really not that hard the changing of brakes is basically bolt off and on, then fluid change is best done with a pressure bleeder and if so more or less fool proof .

i'd say have a pop yourself if you've got a mate that know's a little about cars get the tins in and let him give you a hand , make sure you have some copper grease too used it on most the bolts you take off and the backs of the pads then clean the disks up at the end with brake and carb cleaner just to make sure there clean to bet them in, the copper grease is just to help for future removal i use it on every bolt that's submitted to the elements so it'll never seize and snap .

P.s they'll feel shit once done for the first 200 mile whilst you bed them in (i mean proper shite) so just use them gently, after that they'll stop like fook

well my m8 is mechanic but dont trust him now as he knackered my dampers last time lol.

If i do it my mechanic is pretty cheap so wud prefer pay him and no its dun properly, especially as its brakes as well.

[Burnzybubbles]

:cry very true i no my work is of a good standard but i still am a bit curious when i first set off

if your mechanic will give you a good rate then use him is probs best, saves you getting covered in shite too.

[dojj]

Originally Posted by hineho87

cheers for that m8, will keep eye out on ebay!! Dont think i need the 3mm washers as its on a focus.

Matt

the hoses on the mondeo are slightly different to what i was expecting but they do need to be longer on the mondeo

[James]

whats this conversion been done on? mk2 mondeo?

[Burnzybubbles]

Originally Posted by James

whats this conversion been done on? mk2 mondeo?

yes!

[xr4x4rs]

dojj you seem to be a man of mondeos

do you know if the mk3 hubs will fit onto a mk3? front and rear, they look the same but im not 100%

[BRIGSPORT]

Are the calipers o.k. on my mk2 v6 for this conversion, or do i need the mk3 ones?
it's a 1999 ghia x.

[xr4x4rs]

need mk3 calipers mate

[dojj]

Originally Posted by xr4x4rs

dojj you seem to be a man of mondeos

do you know if the mk3 hubs will fit onto a mk3? front and rear, they look the same but im not 100%

mk3 onto a mk3?

you mean mk3 onto a mk2 yes?

it's been done before, but no one was exactly forthcoming with the timesacle/cost involved

you can pick up hubs for not a lot of money so if you have the same offset on the bottom ball joint, everything else can be solved with some jiggery and/or pokery to the suspension strut side of things

if you have a mk2 i can compare it with the imensions of the mk3, or you can wait till sunday and i'll post up some numbers

[xr4x4rs]

i have a mk2 mondeo st24, i was just wondering as if you could then you could have a much better choice for wheels etc and ive never seen it done

i carnt see it being that much of an issue as the engine bay and front struts look the same aswell and engines bolt straight in

[Ricky ST]

anyone got any more on this? my mate is looking at getting AP's for his ST225 and there will be a set of ASBO's up for grabs. think that might help the brakes on my ST200 a bit if its possible

[dojj]

Originally Posted by solskjaer99

anyone got any more on this? my mate is looking at getting AP's for his ST225 and there will be a set of ASBO's up for grabs. think that might help the brakes on my ST200 a bit if its possible

they will be a virtual direct fit fella

if you are going to put them on the mk3 mondeo they are bolt on bolt of jobbies

if you are going to put them onto anything with 4 studs just drill 3 new 14mm holes into the disc and elongate the 4th by 2mm and it's job jobbed

[Ricky ST]

yeah its for the ST200, mk2 mate. just the small matter of price to sort out with him. Gonna need bigger wheels now tho!

[godrikki]

would these fit under 16in wheels can remember comparing the old discs off my focus against the ones on my fiesta but never tryed fitting them

[cjwood555]

allegedly not, sadly

[godrikki]

ah well not to worry cossie ones will do for now

[dojj]

ok, i did this mod yesterday and, for the mk4.5 fiesta in any case, there were some issues

the brakes will fit, but not as a direct replacement
the holes only need drilling out on 3 points, the 4th is already in line as it's going from a 5 x 108 pcd to a 4 x 108 pcd, but you need to have them at 14mm bore
i needed to remove approx 2mm from the face of the mounting brackets (the casting marks) in order to get them to fit, some poel have said they need to use 3mm spacers so i'm not sure what's what
if i were going to do this again, i would invest in longer wheel studs and then use a 2mm spacer "behind" the brake discs (so it owuld go onto the hub directly, then the disc goes over the top of this) in order to save the hours of grinding and filing it needed to take to get them to fit flush, unless you've got access to a miling machine in which case it would take minutes
the brakes do work well, but the pedal travel is a bit much so i will be investing in a set of rear discs and master cylinder/servo to complement the set up (assuming the one from a mk3 mondeo will simply bolt into the fiestas chassis)

i'll stick some pics up later but when you compare just the pad size, th fiesta's 240's are about half the size of the mondeo's 300mm pads