djwilma

Hello new here but was told you maybe interested in this project as some entertainment for you all

I have a 2005 Lotus Elise 111S that was a Cat D, which i bought 2 years ago with a view to building a Rover K series Turbo.




I used to have a Rover 100 with a 1.4 Turbo K Series with just under 300bhp but wanted 400bhp for some unknown reason. The K series above 300bhp gets silly expensive, the 1.4 was about 10k to build, so i heard of someone fitting the T series and long story short made it 420bhp. But it didnt like oil, so one sunny day it rattled its big ends and basically went bang. Engine had less than 2000 miles and was the second T series i had fitted.



So i decided to sell the car and all its bits, came up with a figure and a nice local man said he'd pop round and have it. I panicked told the wife the bathroom was on hold and explained to nice man i had to make it work.

Rebuilding the T series would of been about £4500, but i was pretty certain it would hate its oil again (Engine is tight in Bay and on an angle cambelt to fly, oil pick up is by cambelt)
I looked at 2.3 DISI Mazda engines, but above 300bhp they start needing special bits and ended up being a £6000 build for the engine and aftermarket ECU
So thought 2.5 Duratec Turbo, but again its unknown what it can handle then pistons and rods were scarse and a forged engine was about £4500
I considered the ECOBOOST engine but an aftermarket GDI engine was silly money, £2500 ish plus a loom about £1000

All the above can be used with the PG1 box in the Elise, i have a Rover 620Ti gearbox installed good for over 400lbft

So i did what any idiot would do, i got drunk thought f*%k it and bought an ECOBOOST engine on Ebay for £1700 with everything on it thinking with the ECU and Loom i would be about £5000 so cheaper than the above........



The Duratec has been fitted to the Elise many times before and the ECOBOOST i was told had the same gearbox PCD so i bought some Adaptor plates off the shelf
They also recommended the Silicone Hoses kit, so it looked good (still not fitted to check so heres hoping)


I fitted the Adaptor Plates and Engine mounts, Top mount actually is ok, it has 2 bolt holes and the studs are too big but i can work with it.



The lower mount may not fit.



Adaptor plate is good



I then realised the engine had some balancer shafts, so googled delete and Mountune popped up with a modded Baffled Sump



Then i had a phone call from Specialist Components in Norfolk who are ex Lotus guys, Simon said that he supplied Zenos with their ECU's for the E10S and could supply and ECU and Loom for about £1800 and it would come with a 280bhp map and use all the std sensors and......i stopped him there and bought it

Ford 2.0 Ecoboost Management Kit - Specialist Components

I have 14 wires to connect and the 6 wires to the DBW Pedal, plus Simon has assured me he will give all the technical help i need (he so far is good to his word)




So this is where i am at at the moment

The goal is 420bhp, as this would be about 500bhp/tonne with a 840kg car (T series was 890kgs) so will be looking at either a forged 2.0 or a 2.3 RS Focus engine next year once everything is working

Managed to pick up a C4 K series Pg1 from my mate Tony, who has a magic shed with rover bits in it, cheap as chips and bolted it to the engine




I also spotted a decent sized chargecooler and Tony kindly let me have it for a good price. Will use this with the std engine and it's twice the size of my home made affair

djwilma

Test Fitting on the engine today





Was a little bit of a pain to go in, but removed a couple of sensors and with some giggery pokery she is in.

Cambelt engine mount is different from the Duratec (3 holes on ecoboost 2 on Duratec), but we should be able to use it. Main issue is height, but will put a shim under the chassis engine mount and should be able to get the engine nice and level.




Next is the Turbo, close on the inlet but the outlet hits the main chassis. Dont see this as being too much of a problem will be able to rotate it 45 degrees (New bracket for actuator) and should fit




Couldnt get under the car but the other issue was the Aircon Bracket hitting the drivers side water hose, should be able to get round this

Plenty of clearance on the pulleys even with the double crank pulley (supercharger)



Also the Oil Filter Housing was removed, looks like i will need to fit a remote filter which i already have



All in All, not a bad day out. Hopefully have a few more updates before Xmas

Gearbox is being rebuilt to a k series bellhousing and Flywheel has been ordered 4.25kg

turbolee

great project you are building keep us all updated cant wait to see it finished and video of it running

Glenn_

iTrader: (1)

Cool project this. I will keep an eye out for your updates.

PaulinhoT

Looking good, one to watch

TimWeeble

I can vouch for Simon and his work i have the older tornado ecu with separate DI driver module and have been running it for two years in my 2.0 ecoboost swapped fiesta. looking like an excellent project..... i just know im going to be jealous of your engine as ive just bought a house so have had to divert funds from the forged engine big turbo pile.

Carlos-Titx

Nice to see something different.

Be a good thread this.

djwilma

Tim, thanks and thats good news Simon has been spot on everytime and i really like the GDI4 ECU they provided

Your figures are they on std injectors and std turbo ? Do you have the curve anywhere ?

djwilma

Christmas came kinda early today, luckily the wife was out too



Grant from GB Enterprises sent me a nice new 4.2kg lightened flywheel, this has been made for the PG1 box (std Elise) drilled to suit the T series (Rover 620Ti) Helix clutch i have (rated to 425lbft). Dual Mass flywheel is about 10kgs (no scales) so a decent saving. I even fitted the Focus clutch (its the same size as the T series), shame the PG1 uses a funny spline





I wont be using the MMT 6 speed, and the Gearbox for the elise as i had a T series PG1 fitted. Good news is this is similar, t series has an additional bearing, to the K series PG1 which is std fit on the Elise. So this is with a great friend who is changing the bell housing from T series to K series and we are looking at reducing the final drive to 4.2 as this is similar to the MMT Gear ratio's 1st to 4th. Fifth being slightly longer at 23mph per 1000rpm which isnt too bad and i wont have a 6th speed. Gearing will be about 160mph which is plenty for a 850kg car made by Farmers from Norfolk with Aluminium and Fibre Glass



Also hated the foam filter i had so bought a massive K&N Air Filter again from Grant




Please note the carpet wasnt my choice, its a new house and the previous owner was Scottish and Colour Blind (its for sale if anyone wants the carpet)

CrOwSoN15

Definitely be keeping an eye on this! I'll pass on the carpet.

djwilma

i bought the wife a little Xmas present, she loved it, then mentioned we could of changed the tartan carpet for what it cost and she had better be getting something nice for Xmas

Think i got away with it but saw this on eBay and thought i best have it

Its a Pro Alloy Charge Coooler, these have been run up to 550bhp

Glenn_

iTrader: (1)

Cool selection of parts there. Lol at the carpet.

XRT_si

iTrader: (2)

Cool project, great engines these.

TimWeeble

Yes indeed. Std everything apart from bolt one. It was mapped by Will Pedley on aet's hub dyno so this graph is at the hubs.



From there we pulled 40% in 1st 25 in 2nd and 10% in 3rd iirc before giving full boost in 4th. It's aiming for around 1.7bar. There was an issue with my aem wideband lambda giving funny readings so we mapped it to run open loop and it's been fine for the past 18 months. Simon just adjusted the warm up fuelling as it was way to rich when it wasn't at temp. I think as a daily driver like I use it the huge torque that comes on is great for engine flexibility but it hits hard so it needs finesse to drive. In the next stage when I go to an efr turbo I want to aim for the transition to be a lot smoother.

djwilma

Many thanks that's an impressive curve

I have GTX2867R from the previous engine so I am 50/50 whether to fit this or keep it std then fit the Gtx later once it's all working but the cars built for 450bhp

That torque jump I am sure can be smoothed out with mapping / boost control, plus I have RWD and an LSD

Simon told me not to use the wideband, maybe for that reason. I will run one but not for mapping

If you fit the efr what will you do for fueling as it seems your power output is the limit of the injectors and HPFP

So 270 wbhp is about 320bhp fly?

TimWeeble

I would be less optimistic of the correction factor at 10-12% it's going to be around 300hp. It drives well but as the torque drops away due to the turbo you can really feel that it's at the turbos limits.

If you've already got the gtx I'd be tempted to say fit it now as even mapped to around 300hp it will be far more efficient and easier on the engine than the standard turbo. The advantage to the gtx is that if you mock everything up around the standard turbo so long as you have the physical space for the bigger turbo all the boost piping and down pipe will join straight up as opposed to the efr where everything needs to be made to fit. (What flange is on the gtx as that would be a determining factor in which flange you where going to buy).

The issue with the bottom end is that everyone has pushed it on standard injectors with the standard ecu and from the few who have done it in the uk and the many who have done it in the US (focusst.org is an invaluable resource I have found) the ring lands crack and fail due to leaning out. Realistically so long as you can supply the fuel and you map sensibly the bottom end should be good up to around 400hp at the wheels which would equate to around 440hp at the crank although that is pure speculation that I hope to validate at some point this year.

In order to supply enough fuel there are currently two options for di injectors. Mountune which have been proven up to 400hp at the crank although which depending where you look seem to be rated at 1250cc and give you 10% headroom over stock or the deatschwerks injectors that have just been made available that are rated at 1750cc ( although I have no idea how the compares to conventional injector ratings) and claim 30% headroom which should get to that 400whp target optimistically. As far as the hpfp is concerned from the limited info I've seen available it is already a higher end Bosch unit. Where the VAG engines where running 1700psi rail pressure and the internals had to be upgraded to get to 2200psi+ I'm led to believe that the ecoboost is already running around 2200psi rail pressure with some headroom available in the ecu ( I would check that with Simon though as I cannot remember what actual figures will ended up with and those numbers are just from what I had read in my research). I know on the lpfp side I'm running an st180 system at 100% duty cycle through a regulator to supply 4 bar and it's got no issues supplying my current tune and I have no plans to upgrade it with the big turbo as it should be fine.

One thing that is continually recommended by the us tuners is a totally upgraded PCV CCV system. There is the PERMPLATE or SpeedPerformance do there own design of the same thing. If you search focusst.org for info they will have piping diagrams and everything but it certainly seems the way to go.

My aim to prove the research above is going to be deatschwerks injectors, mountune or peron turbo elbow, efr6758, new down pipe and boost piping, mountune sump baffle and an upgraded PCV system. If some one disproves me before then I'll forge the engine first and whilst its out I'll probably fit some piper cams as well. But let's see how the money goes first.

One final note I wouldn't expect the torque to be any higher than what it's already pulled and I'm still on the standard clutch with absolutely no issue so in the even lighter Elise I don't think you would need the expense of an updated clutch unless it is needed for other reasons.

Happy to offer what details I've gleaned from many hours of reading so feel free to ask.

Cheers

/Tim

*edit* I did see an injector table for the deatschwerks injectors that suggested the hpfp from 2.3 in the mustang is capable of 3500psi rail pressure where as the plots for the 2.0 stopped much earlier so if the hpfp did ever become an issue that could be a viable upgrade assuming you could get hold of one. I will try and find the plot now.

*edit 2*

http://www.deatschwerks.com/images/s...0Summaries.pdf

That's a plot showing the deatschwerks injectors on the various ecoboost engines and the below is the flow comparison on a 2.0.

djwilma

Agree, the Hpfp on the 2.3 is a different set up and the cam has four lobes not three for the Hpfp, I am speaking to a few people about an upgraded fuel system hence the comment. Will let you know

The ATP Gtx setup looks horrible, I'm not a fan, so I will be making things up from scratch. Thought about a 7167 twin scroll but have the Gtx so will use that.

The USA tend not to track the car just 1/4 miles so I was shooting for 400bhp crank on std internals and see what happens.

Thanks on pcv

TimWeeble

agreed on the atp setup looking horrid. i take it your not in luck of having a t25 flange on the turbo then?

if you were thinking twin scroll were you going to try and source a head without the headifold?

seems we have similar goals in mind so looks like ill be living vicariously through your posts for a while.

i have spoken to charlie at Peron about an efr kit and he has some experience with it so may be worth your while dropping him a line for any additional info.

Looking forward to updates.

djwilma

I was looking at the Evoque / Mondeo head for the twin scroll.

I may just buy a 2.3 RS engine as Specialist components did the mapping for Zenos next year instead of forging.

So many options and so little knowledge

Good call on Piper Cams as I want the engine to rev to 7500rpm, Hpfp doesn't like that apparently though as spring bounces (stronger spring)

I thought about a normal injector inlet manifold, but ecu won't run them......

Rod-Tarry

Im a Lotus fan had a few my self so love this project. Make sure you have a harder think about the Turbo. The EFR range are totally on a different planet especially in twin scroll format. I wish you well with this.

TimWeeble

i have thought about trying to source a 2.3 my self but i like the idea of using the 2.0 with the mountune components that are available on the usa store if it came to forging it.

i want mine to stay with the 7k redline.

Agreed with the many options and little confirmed knowledge or backed up claims. I'm surprised simon hasn't implemented an option for secondary injectors yet though.

have you found any details for the mondeo evoque head? i.e how the valve size compares its something that i almost passed off as i couldnt find any details and the head itself seems scarce.

Willka

Nutty project, would love that power to weight ratio!

djwilma

So things have been slow for a reason, we worked out that the Std Turbo wont fit with the subframe where it is. I can chop this about but not a fan of this, it would be easy to do but......when i have a GTX2867R sat in my office doing nothing i needed an excuse to fit it

This brings with it some problems, the std pistons tend to go after 300bhp, the Guys in the USA throw Meth and Water at the problem which helps get them to a higher rated BHP but its a bodge for me. So this means i need new pistons, then i might as well get some rods, uprated bearings a new PCV plate. Then there is the question of how much fuelling the Ecoboost can do, see below, and i may need another way of inputting more fuel.

So my fit the std engine and have fun has gone for a burton and its back to i need 450bhp

A friend popped down to have a look at the car on the weekend and it gave me a chance to chat to Tech1 about what we need to do, mainly after speaking to Simon at Specialist Components as he confirmed that above 300bhp the pistons are the weak point.

I also spoke to Total MPS in Newcastle who have made a 420whp (2.0, GT3071) and 895whp (2.3 and wow) ecoboost engine.

Their 2.0 had forged rods / pistons and bigger injectors (Tim these were std 2.3 injectors which i am told are the same / similar to Mountunes) but using the std fuel system made 420 at the wheels which is more than i want (didnt say need, as i now need that) but it was on the limits, so advised additional fuelling

So the list of things to do just got bigger, and a whole lot more expensive.........carpets for the new house will have to wait

1. Custom Engine Mounts the Duratec ones definitely dont fit
2. Custom Loom, remove the elise engine loom and place the ECU and new relay / fuse box in cabin (saves weight, honest)
3. Mounting of the GTX above the subframe, small adaptor needed and Randy thanks for the advice i never took but it will be V-band
4. Tial 0.86 a/r Exhaust housing
5. New Forged Pistons and Rods
6. Upgraded Head Bolts
7. PCV Plate, the Ecoboost has a habit of holding boost pressure in the crank case so needs venting via a catch can
8. Bosch Motorsport Pump and 4l swirl pot
9. Inlet adaptor plate to hold 4 x injectors (std ported) or 2 x injectors after the throttle body (SC have made one before)
10. Build engine and send it and the ECU back to SC who will run it up on the Engine Dyno
11. Re-fit Engine
12. Fit charger cooler
13. Fit Custom exhaust
14. Try not to change mind
15. Drive it, hopefully further than the last car

Seems pretty easy written down

djwilma

This is a very rare 4.2 final drive for my U spec PG1, so this will make a C4BSTU box (additional bearing) all steel caged and new seals.




Once this is back we make the engine mounts

TimWeeble

nice! i missed your post on the 11th somehow.

good to know about the 2.3 injectors upto 420 as at most i would push 400whp but probably a little less in all honestly and was aiming for the deatschwerks ones but maybe the 2.3 ones will be cheaper.

I think i've come to the same conclusion of don't bodge it do it once and right.

Didn't realise that mps had done so much work on the ecoboost although it is fairly equivalent to the mzr disi engine.

The mountune MRX turbo is calling to me though......unfortunately i just bought a house -.-

as far as mounting the aux injectors i know there is a US made billet manifold but sico developments have just put the boomba aux fuel rail on pre order. looks nice anodised but i have no idea of boombas expertise or quality (their brake deflectors and testing look fairly comprehensive though if thats any indication).

Is simon going to engineer a solution for the aux fueling?

what pistons rods and pcv plate are you looking at?

considering cams as well?

Awesome as always!

Tim/

djwilma

Allegedly the 2.3 injectors are the same flow as the deatsche werks ones....but no one knows

Specialist components made an aux fuel system before but never tested it so may go this route.

Mahle Pistons and Molinar rods with Clevite bearings, may key the crank too while it's out.

Cams I am 50/50 on as it's a lot of money, only reason I like them is they increase the rev range to 7500rpm. But Mps had 420bhp at 7250. I had a 7750 rev limit so for no reason other than that I'd like to do the same. But the GDI doesn't like big revs.

The ecu already has the software for 4 port injectors and is set up to bring them in smoothly

TimWeeble

excellent.

I thought simon had said that port injection wasn't supported but as it is that's great.

i'm tempted to add the new delta ecu to my list to replace my tornado even if it was just to reduce it to a single box rather than the added gdi driver module that i have.

i'm so glad you've pointed me to mps however as their pricing is excellent think i may need to start having a chat with them.

djwilma

Looks like the engine will be taken apart shortly as going to forge it, possibly adding some cams and maybe a new intake with ported injection

Luckily Tech1 have agreed for me to post items to them so the wife doesn't kill me. The horse also helped out as he needed a tooth pulling which I had to pay for, insurance will send cheque, so wife thinks I am lovely and that the carpets will have to wait.....again

Tial 0.82 a/r exhaust housing and V Band adaptors turned up




As did a 4 litre swirl pot, and I know it's a cheap ebay item but it pressure tested ok and was the biggest I could find

Fudgey

iTrader: (4)

cool project this!

i have a focus ST estate, they go well in standard form but another 200bhp should be good hahaha

djwilma

Its been a while since my last update as i've been doing some head scratching about what to do

So, parts are limited in the UK and i had not heard great things about total MPS and they didnt have all the bits i needed so decided to look to the USA. This means cheaper prices but more import tax and a lot longer delivery

Spoke to a few tuning companies and settled on www.speedperf6rmanc3.com

Gave them a call told them what i wanted to do and they giggled, mainly as most tuning as in 99.9% uses the Ford ECU with a tuner tool, like cobb. They use a lot, and i mean most tuned ecoboost engines, of Meth injection where as speed just use pump gasoline, i explain its called petrol. They have 450whp engines running the same turbo as i do, even better its at the wheels with rev limits of 6750rpm.

At this power the engine starts to get expensive, the timing crank pulley is held on with friction washers and if it slips then the timing goes and bye bye engine so the crank needs to be keyed, the pulley(s) then needs to be changed as well. Pistons are first to go, but even the forged Mahle pistons are rated to 25psi, so first on the list was a set of custom forged Mahle pistons. I will have a little slap on start up so be it they are rated to 250bhp per cylinder and as much boostness



OEM bearings are good, but the MPS boys (same bottom end) use Clevite bearings if they use high revs, so i bought these



Next up, above 25psi the head starts to lift. So i was one of the first people to have the CA625+ head bolts, these are power station grade steel (which is what i do for a living) and are good for 35psi. Main benefit is i dont have to machine the block as they are std 11mm



Next up is the PCV, positive crankcase ventilation, basically uses manifold vacuum to pull the oil fumes out and a non return valve to stop pressure going in and another valve that allows air in (to replace the air being sucked out). Its mainly for emissions and they clog up and cause problems so its being removed and a catch can fitted




I also bought an oil take off, this means i can use a remote oil filter and oil cooler and the oil filter housing had to be removed to fit the engine so thought it easier to do it this way as i already have the cooler and filter housing. took a while to find one with inlet exit on the bottom. This is a std duratec part so i hope it fits



i bought more parts but as it was cheaper to ship seperately they sent two packages, ones in customs still so hope to have that next week.

Also been speaking to Piper as the std cams are low lift and short duration, 224 degrees for the exhaust with 7.5mm lift

Good news is they are looking at some custom cams for me, which will allow me to rev more than std with a linear power curve. I will of course loose some bottom end, but it wont be worse than the t series which was more than tractable. Plus i have lowered the gearing

So next is the inlet manifold and cams........

djwilma

Finally the remaining bits turned up today

I have some Manley Forged rods, these are the I version and perfect for what i need




Next is the keyed lower pulley, my god its heavy, but the std engine has a friction washer and they tend to stop working above 400bhp its best to key it. Will need to key the crank too





Also checked the Oil adaptor against the gasket and the Duratec one fits so happy with that

Cams have been specc'd and ordered from the ever helpful Piper

Just need these to be delivered and a full engine gasket set and we can build the engine

Mk1 engine mount is being made as we speak as well

Its almost like i have a project moving at last

Fudgey

iTrader: (4)

Great stuff.

Will you a detailed engine build?
I would be interested as i have that engine in my focus st

djwilma

Will do as detailed as I can and yes will pop up photos

Twellsie

iTrader: (1)

A really interesting read, I look forward to your updates.

Good work👍🏻

Fudgey

iTrader: (4)

Cool cheers.

djwilma

Cams have been spec'd and ordered from Piper, just need a full gasket set and we are good to build the engine "FINALLY"

But, i after asking many many peoples and many many companies to make a custom dash i finally got one fitted to the car today

Its still a prototype but i said i'd have it there and then. Fantastic piece of kit and its plug and play. No fancy screens for people to see and adds to the std look inside. Easy to use and was fitted within an hour

Showed it to a neighbour who has a VX220 and a MK2 escort and he wants one too

Just simply awesome

djwilma

So the Ironman is out of the way and the new house is starting to look like the wife wants it (still have the tartan carpet)

So i have had some time to speak to Piper, who are genuinely wonderful. I asked for some cams for the specs and what i wanted and got talking. Ended up talking about three specs and they have added them to the website and sent me all three specs hoping i will try them all. i did say i may not have the time or money to do so but they sent me three cam specs to play with, and i just have to send back the ones i dont want

The rally specs are the ones i wanted, but need to check the lift and the rev range they have also increased the lobe for the fuel pump from 4.7mm to 5.5mm. We have no idea if this will work but thought we would give it a go

The other issue is no one has revved an Ecoboost past 7000rpm, i am told Mountune have but they dont give out details, and we have no idea if the fuel pump (it has a spring return so may float) or the VVC (both cams) will cope with the revs

Only one way to find out

http://www.pipercams.co.uk/pipercams...n=8&engine=369







Full gasket set is on order from Ford and engine build is pencilled in for next week

JUst need to to get all the parts put together, engine mount fitted and..........

Fudgey

iTrader: (4)

Top stuff!

Caddyshack

Great thread. Love the dash.

Mark V8

iTrader: (2)

Cool project and the dash is very nice

Who made it ?