Ridgey

iTrader: (5)

Hi all.
Where are the likely sources if metal flakes in a YB sump

Found quite a lot in my oil pickup, it looks like brass! Thin metal fakes, possibly a plating?

Crank looks ok in position, nothing obvious out of place.

I wanted to check the oil pump due to a slight drop in oil pressure.

Cheers

RobbieBambino

Maybe big end bearings? Ive had this a couple of times not on a ford mind, it was on bmw petrol engine any noises noticed before strip down or what was the reason for the strip down?

Ridgey

iTrader: (5)

To checkout a 10psi drop in oil pressure from my high pressure oil pump.
Was running fine.

AJC

iTrader: (6)

Where did you get the pump from Dave?

tony66

iTrader: (7)

flakes will be pick up from an engine shell normally
i would remove and strip bottom end-more likely picked up on a main bearing if oil pressure is low

-i wouldnt run it any more either untill you pull it apart

Ridgey

iTrader: (5)

Andy
Pump has been in the car for years (7ish), unsure of origin.

Tony
Put complete new shells in earlier this year main and big end bearings and thrust bearings.

cossynut2

That is not a good thing to find, nor is the drop in oil pressure, unfortunately points to bearings on the way out due to failing oil pump. As Tony 66 has advised stop driving it until you find the problem. Hopefully it wont be to bad.

Ridgey

iTrader: (5)

Pictures



Plus these as well:

tony66

iTrader: (7)

either some of the old-or some of the new are in your oil strainer...i would tear it down tbh
its not an awful lot-but it needs investigation -imho

Ridgey

iTrader: (5)

If I strip out the crank for bearing inspection, do I need to replace the arp con rod bolts, they were new when car was put together earlier in the year?

tony66

iTrader: (7)

there is a stretch/length spec for arps
personally they are not expensive so i would renew tbh as if a rod bolt lets go the motor is scrap

RobbieBambino

Looking at the pics it really does look like bearings to me, exactly the same ive seen when the bmw engines ive done had spun bearings. For the job it is i would just replace the arp bolts as its just another thing that could go wrong if not replaced

tony66

iTrader: (7)

its amazing how knackered a main bearing can be and not make much noise-just drops oil pressure and a wee bit of a grumble when warm-particularly the centre one...

Ridgey

iTrader: (5)

I'll investigate further

gcfcos

Everyone I know who's fitted these high pressure oil pumps has major problems with there engine and oil pressure afterwards. I'm not
Even exaggerating i can think of at least 4 people with rst and Cossies with same probs

Ridgey

iTrader: (5)

The pump has been great no issues for many thousands of miles over many years.
The cause of my issues are not known yet.

gcfcos

The metal u have found is what the main end bearings are made of just looking through your
Pics and
Description. Yeah your oil pump may be fine but know loads of people who have done fresh engine builds and the new high pressure oil pumps pack up within a few miles. Strange

Ridgey

iTrader: (5)

Sure is fooked main bearings, pics to follow tomorrow.

And crank probably.......

Adam-M

Out of curiosity mate what psi of oil where you getting on your gauge after the 10 psi drop?

Ridgey

iTrader: (5)

Hot idle 18psi
Hot running 60psi

cossynut2

That is not what you would get if the oil pump is knackered, I would expect it to be much lower psi.Keep us posted as to what you find out. Best of luck.

Adam-M

I agree that seems not bad pressure for hot tbh.

MONSTER

The pump came from GGR and is a Kent item

Ridgey

iTrader: (5)

Picture of the main bearings, No 1 and 3 are shot.
Not dismanteled the big ends yet but i hope they are OK.
Crank was already on a 0.25, so i'll have to see if a 0.5 grind will clean it up.
The hot oil pressure was good when runnig but below the spec of 24psi at idle.
Only other issue i have had since putting new bearings in in May this year was over heating at National day on track.

Ridgey

iTrader: (5)

Bearings were new ACL ones from Matt Lewis.

tony66

iTrader: (7)

thats what i expected[sadly] when you posted your pic up,centre main to be trashed-engine is rebuildable though-thats the main thing..

Glenn_

iTrader: (1)

Or dear. You dont mess about stripping the engine down.

I hate doing engine jobs in case shit like this happens.

fraser9764

iTrader: (3)

Bloody hell Dave, you don't have much luck do you! At least it should be salvageable.
I wonder if the bearings picked up as a result of low oil pressure, or the other way around?

tony66

iTrader: (7)

i wouldnt think it started as an oil pressure issue tbh looking at the parts on show
perhaps bad clearance[tight] debris behind shell,poor bearing,eneven clearance across journal ...who knows without a real good look at the components
somebody who builds these every week would be the one to ask for an opinion-maybe mark shead ..?

Ridgey

iTrader: (5)

Dont know Graham.
Car was over heating at Nat Day and at Shelsley Walsh after my spin the thing didn't want to run for a few minutes, but i didn't notice oil pressure (normal OR otherwise).

cossynut2

Have you got a baffled sump upgrade? If not that could be the reason if you have been doing a lot of high speed cornering?

tony66

iTrader: (7)

have you got the right dipstick sump combo?
my first cossie engine failure was caused by a previous owner having the wrong combo-205 block 4wd sump on a poorly done conversion
full on the stick was just over half of what was needed...it packed in a day or so after i bought it-which was a pity as i only bought it to convert back to 2wd

but having had the car you would probably notice if under 3 litres took it to the top of the stick

i suppose it could have been starved of oil after/during a spin.. but the shell/journal furthest from the pump flow normally suffers first from starvation
ends being worn badly too
is the oil pump drive still very good/no wear also?

Ridgey

iTrader: (5)

Car has big winged and gated sump, takes a good 5 litres now.
My suspicion is that maybe an oil way has somehow got blocked and caused oil starvation, that's my current thinking.
Block was stripped and long studded earlier in the year then rebuilt.

dojj

iTrader: (3)

I'd be worried about what else has happened with all then bits floating about in the oil

Rob_DOHC

iTrader: (4)

When you built the engine up last time did you check bearing/journal clearances or just fit new bearings? If not it might be worth doing it this time, I like plastigauge if you don't have access to better measurement tools.

Sounds like a good excuse for a winter project

Nash

iTrader: (3)

Gutted Dave, fingers X crank can go to .50.

Ridgey

iTrader: (5)

Hope so.

dave cos4x4

iTrader: (5)

hope its not too expensive Dave.

cossynut2

Oil surge can be ruled out then as can oil pump failure, it really only leaves oil contamination blocking an oil way as you have said. It must be frustrating for you as there wasnt anything obvious that caused it.
Are you doing the rebuild yourself or getting it done by one of the Cosworth specialists?

Ridgey

iTrader: (5)

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