ajamesc

Na havent been on here long but i have a few pics if u click on my profile

vroooom ptssssh

cool, should get a thread up in the project section! sounds like yove got a few toys under the bonnet

scoooby slayer

iTrader: (4)

in comparison my yb was fairly well specced aside from polished standard size ports on a t4 at 2.2 bar 408 rwhp, the gtr has cost 10k all in very tidy with newly built forged engine by a specialist and made 460 rwhp and 430 fwtq at 1.2 bar ! now running 1.5 bar so it gotta be over 500 rwhp and around 480 lbft at the engine. 4 seconds faster 30 - 130 mph than the cossie was using the exact same measurement method. at 2 bar it should make 650 hp if i ever dare gtr far superseads the cossie in all aspects but with the extra capacity and 4wd its not a fair comparison tbh.

ybs are ALOT fuckin easier to work on though

RSTsteve

Earlier rev 1/2's & st185 yes granted

but rev 3 onwards came with mls HG's

All down to the tuner on how long big power 3sgte's last.

mine running just over 420 hp @ 1.4 bar for the last 18 months and seen loads of 1/4 mile runs and spirited runs

SWR

RB20, I reckon..

mozzy

dont get me wrong i love the YB but the sr20 in a pulsar gtir is just something else (when its working of course) but mildly breathed on to about 300bhp a pulsar will whipe the floor with pretty much anything, shame there so fooking ugly

SWR

2.2 Bar to see 500 on a YB..? Who put the plug on the fun? That thing is just begging to take a full breath of air... Seen 570 on 1.7. On E85, but still, that would be about 500 on 99 V-power, same boost. That setup needs a rethink, not more boost.

just my dos centavos..

Now, back to the scheduled programming.

OldDan

You'll probably find everything on motorsport engines are helicoiled.

vroooom ptssssh

No

on my SR20, with realistic horsepower figures

it has big exhaust, huge intercooler, cossie T4, throtle body's, low comp pistons...2 uprated fuel pumps, 850cc injectors, std cams, I cant ever see it making 570 with 2bar of boost on apexi ECU, theres no restrictions that is as good as the horsepower can be on that spec on 99V power, not even a cossie with that spec would make 570 (queue people telling me they do), the SR20 has VVT so right away its going to be better.


anyway, were talking STANDARD engines here on PUMP fuel so forget what mines making or doesnt make or whatever...


The SR20 is a better engine.

ajamesc

Sounds good mate id love a skyline but just cost too much what with transmission mods thats why im a yb man but i must admit even if i do say so myself mines a very fast car as fast in gear as my r1 without a dought i run just over 500 with around the same torque on a gt30 at 2.6bar on sm4 managment done by m a developments

SWR

I did NOT say that Cossie was stock... All I said was that I have seen 570 in an YB at 1.7 Bar, and if someone needs 0.5 bar more (but I guess you guys don't get E85 easily) to see the same they need to rethink their build, that's all.

m4tt274

iTrader: (2)

given budget you can make any of these engines 500+ and they all have pros and cons.
its just about preferance and the car you want to put it in
if you want the best bang for your buck the 13b mazda rotary is unbeatable.
out an out power a toyota 2jz or a nissan rb26 but they are expensive to get above 500bhp
the YB is at the end of the day a 35 year old pinto with a twin cam head on it. so dont get to touchy if someone says that there multi thousand pound race engine is better.
imo the YB isnt the best of the 4 cylinders but it is my favorite. it has a stigma attached to it and everyone knows what a 'cosworth engine' is, wheras its got a 'nissan engine' in it. dosent sound as good tbh lol

turbotoaster

if i wanted cheap 350bhp with good torque id choose between the YB and the sr20.

Both have potential and advantages.

for the sr20 there arnt really 'cossie tax'...tubular manifolds are cheap, infact all parts are pretty cheap

for the YB pretty much every has been done before so putting a t34/injectors on it and turning up the boost seems to do the job.

now if i wanted more power than that i need to decide what my budget was, how i wanted the power band to look and what application it was going in.

probably 400bhp+ i might love at the evo engine due to you can just pinch bits off other evo engines and make 400bhp, with great powerband.

After that ie 500bhp i would go with either the rb26 or the 1JZ/2JZ but to be fair if it was only 500bhp it would be the 1JZ as they are really cheap, just bang a big journal bearing turbo on it, some injectors and it will be very reliable as your not pushing it hard.

if 600bhp+ then it has to be the 2JZ, can easily take 800bhp on stock bottom end so if you can get one at a decent price the money you save in other areas pays for itself.

if it was in a small car and i had to keep the weight very light i would just bang a 13b in it and depending on the fuel it was running on i could choose my power output.


Alot of people are forgetting yes its nice to make big power but you then have to attach it to a gearbox that will take it.

yb engine.....gets worried at 450bhp on a t5, less that 400bhp on a mt75
rb26 engine....seems to take power pretty well on that box, up to 700bhp and will hold together.
2JZ engine....seen it running massive power, up to 1000bhp and dont have problems
13b engine, seen 800bhp full drag launches on slicks and hasnt panicked.


they are both good engines but sometimes you need to find the best package for your vehicle

vroooom ptssssh

You've lost me mate, I dont even know what your chattin about.......and I dont think you get what im saying either...


an wtf is E85? i'm assuming it's some high octane fuel....in which case your theory about 570bhp on lower boost compared to my bhp/boost being shit is a lot of bollocks as it's mapped on V power....I happen to think 355@wheels on 1.4 bar is what you'd expect....on pump fuel...

sake.


like I said:

SR20 good points
VVT
weight
chain driven

cossie good points
lots of parts available
errr...

m4tt274

iTrader: (2)

the cossies have a stronger following and more guys who know about them ready to help whereas the sr20 scene is just full of teens who drift them in coned of carparks on the revlimiters all day knowing fuck all about the mechanicals.

turbotoaster

E85 is a fuel used around the world but not in the UK, its touted as a green fuel because its ethanol, infact the name comes from it being 85% ethanol and 15% gasoline.

Its a very very good fuel as its pretty high octane and also 4 times the BPU of gasoline so it burns alot cooler hence you can push an engine much harder.

You can get it in the UK from certain morrisons, its popular all over the world because its basically racegas at pump gas prices

I think the reason the guy thought that it isnt much power as he doesnt understand how much of a fuckwit the country is runby.

E85 should be avaliable everywhere, its a green fuel so they can claim they are helping, you need 20-30% more fuel at the same AFR so they will get more tax from people using more of it and performance guys will benefit from it massively from being able to run more boost/ignition.

his 570bhp at 1.7 will either be a massive turbo(like they normally do over there) or the E85 means they have mapped the ignition very aggressively, or a combination of both

you have to say, they are good in japan with the sr20, Juns car was 700bhp for example, quiet a few time attack sr20s running 450-600bhp.

It just seems there isnt really the budget put towards these engines, many because of the age of the drivers etc, but dont discount the engine, big power can be achieved, ive seen them running 9sec quarters in 0Z pushing 900bhp+

Fast Guy

Rev a cossie to what? I rev my Gtir everyday just about to 7500rpm and the valve train doesn't fall apart. Occaisionally they do throw rockers, but that's often over 8000rpm. I missed a gear once and the rev counter swung way past 8000rpm, probably nearer 9 and it's still running. What does a standard cossie rev to?

What power can the standard cossie internals take? The americans claim 500bhp+ for the sr20det, I know over here 400+ is fairly common.

Don't forget there's a few different forms of SR20DET hydraulic or solid lifters, SR20VET, vvl, neo,

SWR

I don't think 500 hp on 99 at 2.2 bar is much, no... I understand that you guys are talking of mostly standard engines, in which case I agree with you. But a stock YB is MILES away from optimal.

IF it's a semi-built YB engine (proper porting - about 260 real CFM @ 28# and "enough" port area on stock valves, real cams - not the silly BD14/16 stuff - decent manifold, well-tuned intake system, and a midrange turbo) that's not too hard. Have seen well-built NA-YB's pump out 274 hp at 7200 rpm - ok, that was 100octane fuel, so deduct some 25 hp to the ignition increase - if you triple that "plenum bar absolute" what do you get of hp? Not 500, even if you have to back off the ignition a little more.. If a 2-liter engine gets no more than 500 at that boost and it's the ultimate max, a comparable 3-liter, in this case a 6G72, would make no more than 750 yet we see almost 800 to the hubs (DynaPack), still on 99, this on a daily driver? Boost is just a number describing the restriction to flow. If ANY engine needs 2.2 bar to make 500 it just doesn't breathe properly, somewhere in the system. Unless it's a sub-1.5-liter engine. End of story. Even my own 1342cc engine makes an easy 326 hp to the rear at just 1.14 bar on regular Shell 98-octane pump, and that was 12 years ago... ok, that revs a bit.

An ancient T04E 60-1 is miles away from a "massive" turbo, strap a GT4202R to it -like we're doing now on another one - and you have a "massive" turbo for a 2-liter... Had we run a proper one and a better manifold 650 would have been doable. Ignition curve is 3 degrees up from the 99 settings all over the range, no need to increase anything further as the turbo was already spent. Off the compressor map. Hardly "very aggressive" ignition... But I won't argue about it, I'm not spending much (any) time of my day working on "mostly standard" engines anyway..

To get back on topic: The YB has better intake port shape, the SR has more decent intake port area for big hp. YB exhaust port shape sucks (where's my TIG?). SR exhaust port is too darn big in some places (Where's my TIG? - The sequel). Both engines have their drawbacks, so I won't say that any is "better". I'll leave that argument to you. Thank you and good night.

turbotoaster

Well to be honest mate i do lift my hands up to you when it comes to YB tuning, having never ported one myself or built a special one im going off other peoples specs and a bit of common sense.

When i said massive, i was more thinking around the GT35 sized turbo, ok its not huge but for people in the UK they see that as a large turbo.

Im a rotary boy more than a piston guy now, i class a gt35 as a tiny turbo, ill be running a gt4202 sized turbo with a t6 rear turbine housing on my car soon as i class that as a big turbo.

Alot of people run quite small turbos as they want very early full boost and dont really want big revs hence 500bhp at 2.2bar is acceptable for them, by running a smaller turbo and alot of boost they get the powerband they request.

I suppose this thread has many different levels when it comes to power.

Your talking about properly built engines with all the bases covered, unfortunately that only covers probably 1% of the people on this site, they normally just choose a power level and change the engine specs to meet that goal, dont care whether that power level is achieved at 1bar or 2bar as long as its reliable.

We all know 500bhp isnt the max of a YB engine, its just the max that the turbo on the example engine, as we have seen from MAD 800bhp seems to be reaching the limit and maybe more in greece but i forget what power the drag car made in the end.

I would say its most likely on the YB and the SR20 that 1000bhp is achievable as an ultimate power....gt24, methanol etc

if we are looking at the best of each engine as a horsepower point of view its best looking at the biggest power ones and what stumbling blocks have to be overcome to achieve it(your last paragraph for example)

Glenn_

iTrader: (1)

cossie yb all day long.

V8monster

cut the inner wings out and stick a forged 454cuin chevy with a blower on it if u want to rip your face off and have blood come from your eyeballs in a straight line..
or just shut up arguing and enjoy whichever car it is that you liked enough to buy...

sideways in a 270quid sierra GLX... doesnt matter if ur Evo's got 800bhp, u aint gona race the sezzer while its peg-legging round a roundabout on one wheel are ya!!

Csm

Both great engines imo but similar...............

Leak oil like fuck

Still cant beat the sound of a cossie on full chat tearing up the road

Cant really say that much for jap RAGE exhaust upgrades