Graham S1

you'll all be switching over.

Well, someone had to post about it, it might as well be me . Don't worry, your BBC will tell you everythings fine, don't worry, just carry on as normal.

KSA-Cossie

iTrader: (4)

woodz77

still got to watch last weeks . got it sitting there ready on sky plus

Oranoco

I'll be watching it, find these really intresting. Not saying I buy into a lot of these theories but they certainly raise eyebrows and make you think

RichardPON

Come on Graham!

You going to tell us that there's something shady about Avery and his cronies getting a healthy dose of reality?

Try this - helps explain away that dross video you've been distributing:

http://www.loosechangeguide.com/LooseChangeGuide.html

smitsturbo

are we speeking about topgear tonight?

Less.

and theres little green men on mars

Graham S1

Damn you found that out too?

And thats probably what it will be. Set out destroy Loose Change, because it was the biggest thing out there. And I would be the first to admit there are mistakes in Loose Change, but the final cut will be bulletproof.

But unfortunately better docs have come out since.

Of course, it could always turn out to be a fair and balanced program.

Lets see if they mention.

Northwoods.
Norman Mineta's testimony.
The Jersey Girls.
Able Danger.
Molten rivers of metal underneath the towers.
The thousands of police, medical staff, firemen, and everyday people who are due to die in the next 10 years, because they breathed air they were told was "safe", during the clear up.

MAD matt-sab

if you have sky look on ni or scot channel bbc2 its on at 8 there !!!!!!!

RichardPON

You know full well they wont, as it's a 1 hour documentary.

Let's hope they tear that Loose Change drivel to pieces.

Honestly - how can you still believe in all that drivel, especially when all the "experts" involved in Loosee Change are CTs themselves?

Graham S1

Assumption.

I found out myself about this before even the 1st Loose Change came out.

What about those who have never backed Loose Change?

Like I said, there are other better put together one's out there. "911 Mysteries" for a start. And "Press for Truth".

What about NOW, when you have plenty of experts out there disputing the "Official Conspiracy Theory"?

Graham S1

well, that program certainly cleared things up.

RichardPON

Well?

How do you refute things like saying 93 footage was found 6.9 miles away from the crash site, when they showed that the 6.9 miles is the measurement given when taking the most passable road between both sites, rather than the distance as the crow flies?

It's that kind of diabolical research that explains why you lot have no credibility!

CossieRich

iTrader: (1)

I await Graham's reply

Martin-Hadland

iTrader: (2)

I thought that was quite funny when they showed the map of the 6.9 mile journey

Graham S1

You lot? Which lot?

Talk about a strawman argument.

If stuff was found a mile away, where was it? They couldn't find it. Did something fall off while it was diving? Or was it shot down? Nothing was answered. How much do you actually know about the Flight 93 crash sight, witnesses interviewed etc.

PON, show me some tail sections, wing bits, engines.... or do you agree that planes can simply be "absorbed" into the ground? If you throw a person into the ground at 500 mph, do they simply get absorbed in?



Gets confusing when you listen to eyewitnesses. This guy was at the lake.


http://www.pittsburghlive.com/x/pitt...b/s_12942.html

Cawood

whats this loose change? saw some lad going on about that on TV last night

couldn't figure out what the fuck he was talking about?

Ratty

iTrader: (1)

So he heard a plane with engines at full throttle going straight for the ground, then he heard a crash and saw the resulting fireball from 3 miles away and you wonder why there is little remaining of the airplane

It doesn't say the plane was on fire in the air

Graham S1

This whole 6.9 miles thing is news to me anyway. Haven't heard much about it, and it's not a prevalent "theory". Which is why I'm having to research it while I type.

What had been said was that an engine had been found about 8 miles away, but I don't think they mentioned that at all last night.

RichardPON

You lot. As in closed minded conspiract theorists.

Did the coroner, who was misquoted in that Loose Change drivel YOU distributed, not simply say that there were no bodies......... as in they'd all been destroyed in the accident, yet they found enough human remains to identify the passengers?

Please don't tell me you believe that whole switched flights, Cleveland rubbish that Avery pushes..? What an insult to the passengers' memories to suggest that they are all being held in captivity somewhere because they couldn't possibly have crashed!

Come on Graham, you're mildy educated - tell me, after official reports found human remains, an engine, plane debris, and a hole in the ground, how it couldn't have been?

Also, please answer the 6.9 mile thing, for the purpose of credibility.

Graham S1

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/programme...es/6341851.stm

So light bits of insulation, and paper, survived the crash, but not multi ton, metal sections of plane.

timrud

Think about it Graham.

Plane hits ground, mass of energy released,the lighter loose bits of fragement get instantly thrown outwards, then the wind carries them.

I'm sure its a basic rule of physics, things don't get incinerated the millisecond the explosion happens?

It seems the CT's like to look hard for the most realistic alternative truth there is. Just to be different. Its a state of mind.

Graham S1

And the big heavy bits of the plane? Even smaller bits such as the seats?

And the wind... yes. Do you know the conditions of that day? Light breeze, 5-10mph winds. Hmmm....

You have a while to answer now. I'm off to work. Back lunchtime.

Rhys

PMSL you know my view on this....


But i sooooooooooooooo knew you was going to post about the programe Graham Also as pridectable as the programs

Also they was on about this on Radio two in the week if you want to listen to it.

GARETH T

Ratty

iTrader: (1)

In normal crashes the pilots will attempt to bring the plane down as a glider, by dumping fuel. This plane was crashed at full trottle

The plane was traveling at more than 500mph. It crashed upside-down at a forty-five degree angle. The 128,730+ pound Boeing 757 gouged a 50-foot-deep pit. The force of this impact disintegrated metal, bone and flesh. It took investigators more than three months to identify the remains of the 40 passengers and crew, and, by process of elimination, the four hijackers. The black box containing the flight data and cockpit voice recorders was recovered by investigators two days after the crash



Engine below

Gary F

iTrader: (1)

Warning secret agents from amersham have discovered the true




































Bush run for the hills

JjCoDeX75

I watched about half of it before going utterly insane and switching over!

Beware - they are watching you!!!! PMSL


Utter bullshit that borders on insulting!

JJ

timrud

Those pictures could be from anywhere!

What your saying is its IMPOSSIBLE for ANYTHING to have got this debated distance from the crash. If that is right then your right.

However I'm saying it IS possible, enspecially for light bits to travel that far.

Yes the wind might of been 5-10mph at ground level. But didn't the bits get thrown upwards? And isn't the wind a bit stronger up there?

I'm sorry, but your grasping at straws. Straws that contain a bit of information that can be misinterprited in an imaginative way.

Please don't give up your day job and join the police, the ones I have to work with already are bad enough

JjCoDeX75

I am pretty sure that Disney were behind the whole thing.

Tourism figures have been poor in the US for a while now, and it stands to reason that by bringing them to the top of the news page, it would enhance Mickey and Minnies fortune.

Rumour has it that Pluto was one of the Suicide bombers, but it hasnt been corroborated.


On a serious, note, the wonderful thing about conspiracy theories is that they can be made with very little basis in fact, and nobody needs to sensibly corroborate their 'facts'. Moreover, they can simply retaliate to any evidence put forward by the officials as propaganda!

There is little point in engaging people like this in debate. It is like trying to tell your five year old that they dont want sweets. An utter waste of effort!

Not to mention the fact that many people died in these attacks, and this is not a particularly honerable way to remember them IMHO

JJ

dojj

iTrader: (3)

i watched the first half hour and then had to other stuff, but the pentagon one was the biggest surprise
the show you a plane
then the hole
and there is no way it could have been a plane hitting it
100 tones doing 500 mph is going to do a bit more damage than knock a 20 foot hole in the wall ain't it

the whole twin towers being a crontolled explosion i couldn't buy, but it's not been prooven either way

intersting viewing but thats about it we all know bush is a bit of a clown but he's got to be doing something right, or else his oil puppeteers are pulling the right strings

JjCoDeX75

It was a plane that hit the Pentagon. Dont believe the raves!

JJ

Billy Sasterd

Graham,

Go take all this absolute drivel for the criminally stupid and gullible back to turbosport where there are a few like minded dimwits who will listen to this sh!te

Oh, did Graham tell you that the planes that hit the towers were remote controlled bombs and they kidnapped 400 passengers and killed them, and they secretly wired WTC1 & 2 (112 floors each )and building 7 with explosives and brought them down in a controlled explosion................ FFS grow up

It is just disrespectful to the poor bastards who died that day and the fact that some Yanks will make money and notoriety from that is no great surprise

RichardPON

That's a myth. All official reports on the scene place the hole at 75' in diameter.

Did you not see the independant computer modelling they did..... and then the CTs refuting it, claiming that the computer animation company must have been bought off by the goverment!

If it wasn't so serious, it would be laughable.....

andyhardy

I don't hold any belief in the conspiracy theories surrounding the 9/11 attacks.

One thing that is sad is that the US government get hundreds of terrorist alerts every day and you can't chase after all of them without creating mass-hysteria among the general public.

I remember the day of the attacks and before 5pm GMT (12pm EST) the hit list of potential suspects had Osama Bin Laden at the top of the list. For whatever reason this information was not prioritised and the rest is history.

People always question governments (as they should), but somebody has to make these decisions. It's just unfortunate they can't always be right!

Andy

dojj

iTrader: (3)

i don't think it's as simple as that pon, the hole is shown after the inpcat, and then again after more of the wall falls away, thus making the hole much bigger
a 124 foot wide plane doesn't make a 20 foothole in the side of a building, no matter how hevily fortified it is

Thrush

iTrader: (1)

I missed the programme (was out, forgot to set timer) but Dojj mentioning the "controlled explosion" of the towers - always makes me chuckle when people mention this, or when they claim that the towers were demolished in a controlled explosion....

1) Do you know how long it takes to set up a controlled explosion on a building the size of the WTC? Not to mention there were TWO towers?!?! A long fucking time, thats how long...

2) Do you know how much of an expert you have to be to bring down a single tower of that size? Not to mention BOTH towers? You would have to be a fucking good expert, and have a crew of fucking good experts aswell...

3) DO you really think that if a crew of experts had been setting up in preperation of a controlled explosion on both towers, that NO ONE in the ENTIRE world would have noticed? Or that there wasn't a single leak about it? Fuck me, you can't release a new album of your band without being leaked on the net in advance, and Britney Spears can't go to a nightclub without it being posted on the net - do you really think that an operation on this scale, which would mean that the US Government is deliberately intending to kill it's own civilians, that NO MENTION of it AT ALL, not even one raised "hmm, wonder what those people carriny thousands of metres of cable and tonnes of explosives are doing drilling holes in the walls of my office building?" eyebrow?????/

I think not

Graham S1

Thats a lot of people you're including in that sweeping sentence. Including our own Michael Meacher MP, and Tony Benn. Have a look at some of the other on the list, and tell me they're ALL crazy.

http://www.patriotsquestion911.com/

Do I "beleive" it? No. Do I consider it a possibility? Yes. We cannot know until a proper investigation is done. Not a forced investigation, done by Bush's buddys, at minimal cost, with evidence removed from all sites.

Where are all the relatives complaining about these "theories" then? I can show you more who are still waiting for answers.

Makes a change from "nutjob".

Whose credibility? Mine? The whole Truth movement? Like I said, it's a new one on me. Was it an engine they claimed to have found?

Rhys.. yes... I said that in the first post.

Shall I move to the North East? Will that make it more credible?

And many more are going to die still. Like many of the first responders... fire, police, medical staff. Think they don't deserve answers to their questions? Do the innocents in Iraq deserve it?

Hi Chris. Not a very nice thing to say about the Turbosport lot. Hope there's not too many over here. Not much going on on the RSOC these days?

Yes, after the collapse of that section. What about the initial hole before the collapse?

You mean the Purdue animation they showed last night? The one where the engines simply "melted" into the building (leaving no outside holes), and the wings simply disintegrating on the outside wall?

You might want to educate yourself about "Able Danger".

Depends on what they used to bring it down, and how much access they required.

If you're doing a black op, you only hire the BEST! So answer me this Thrush, how come both towers came down in exactly the same manner, in pretty much the same speed, give or take a second, considering one got hit in the middle higher up, and one on the corner, lower down. They must have been good.

100,000 people were involved in the "Manhatten Project", yet Trueman kept that a secret from his entire Government. And the Government already considered a plan to kill it's own in the 60's (Operation Northwoods), only JFK wouldn't sign it off, and we all know what happened to him don't we.