Steering self centering
30-01-2014, 12:12 PM
#1
Fast Ford snapper
Thread Starter
Steering self centering
Something which has forever annoyed me in Sierras is their slow self centering, and my Cossie is pretty bad in that area. I like to do some occasional drift events in it, but the self centering really makes it stupidly hard work, as it's so slow compared to so many other cars.
Not even just during drift, but in normal town driving the self centering is annoyingly poor when coming off lock. Compared to my 328i and Volvo 960 it's shocking, as they'll perfectly spin central or onto opposite lock whenever needed.
My car is quite low which I know knocks the steering arms out of line (making the effort required to push the rack back greater). But I have S body track rod ends with a lowered centre to combat this. The arms do still slightly sit at an upward angle though, so I'm thinking of adding 3dr hubs with their lowered roll centre in as well to further straighten the arms.
I've also got adjustable top mounts with some added castor, but there's still room for a bit more if I loose some camber on them. I will need to get adjustable TCAs or redrill the crossmember to regain that though.
I could add compression struts too, but I would prefer to avoid this if possible, as I had them on my previous competition drift Saph car and they made it constantly rub the front tyres on the bumper, and I had to run much higher spring rates to compensate for the lack of ARB.
But is the main problem even down to lack of castor?!
So I'm looking for reasons as to why it's like this, and ideas at all on how to improve....
Not even just during drift, but in normal town driving the self centering is annoyingly poor when coming off lock. Compared to my 328i and Volvo 960 it's shocking, as they'll perfectly spin central or onto opposite lock whenever needed.
My car is quite low which I know knocks the steering arms out of line (making the effort required to push the rack back greater). But I have S body track rod ends with a lowered centre to combat this. The arms do still slightly sit at an upward angle though, so I'm thinking of adding 3dr hubs with their lowered roll centre in as well to further straighten the arms.
I've also got adjustable top mounts with some added castor, but there's still room for a bit more if I loose some camber on them. I will need to get adjustable TCAs or redrill the crossmember to regain that though.
I could add compression struts too, but I would prefer to avoid this if possible, as I had them on my previous competition drift Saph car and they made it constantly rub the front tyres on the bumper, and I had to run much higher spring rates to compensate for the lack of ARB.
But is the main problem even down to lack of castor?!
So I'm looking for reasons as to why it's like this, and ideas at all on how to improve....
Last edited by Ade; 30-01-2014 at 03:35 PM.
31-01-2014, 11:34 AM
#2
Lowering the steering connection without lowering the tca is a bad idea as this creates bumpsteer. Better is to fit 3dr hubs, they will also correct the roll center.
I'd say the whole self-centering issue is caused by a lack of castor. My sapph centers perfectly. I have only added a few washers in between the tca and arb to move the wheels forward.
I'd say the whole self-centering issue is caused by a lack of castor. My sapph centers perfectly. I have only added a few washers in between the tca and arb to move the wheels forward.
31-01-2014, 12:52 PM
#3
Fast Ford snapper
Thread Starter
Lowering the steering connection without lowering the tca is a bad idea as this creates bumpsteer. Better is to fit 3dr hubs, they will also correct the roll center.
I'd say the whole self-centering issue is caused by a lack of castor. My sapph centers perfectly. I have only added a few washers in between the tca and arb to move the wheels forward.
I'd say the whole self-centering issue is caused by a lack of castor. My sapph centers perfectly. I have only added a few washers in between the tca and arb to move the wheels forward.
You know what toe setting you have?
04-02-2014, 12:05 AM
#5
PassionFord Post Troll
Lowering the steering connection without lowering the tca is a bad idea as this creates bumpsteer. Better is to fit 3dr hubs, they will also correct the roll center.
I'd say the whole self-centering issue is caused by a lack of castor. My sapph centers perfectly. I have only added a few washers in between the tca and arb to move the wheels forward.
I'd say the whole self-centering issue is caused by a lack of castor. My sapph centers perfectly. I have only added a few washers in between the tca and arb to move the wheels forward.
04-02-2014, 08:17 AM
#6
I had the alignment measured at two places as the alignment on the rear wheels had to be done, but on the front nothing had changed. The first reading was:
Left right
camber -1°24' camber -1°54'
caster 3°30' caster 3°30'
The second was:
left right
camber -1°31' camber -1°33'
caster 3°07' caster 4°04'
So what the exact value is I don't know, I guess it's difficult to measure that precisely.
Left right
camber -1°24' camber -1°54'
caster 3°30' caster 3°30'
The second was:
left right
camber -1°31' camber -1°33'
caster 3°07' caster 4°04'
So what the exact value is I don't know, I guess it's difficult to measure that precisely.
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04-02-2014, 08:43 PM
#8
My car is only used on the road and not for track or drifting. I used to have a sapph for drifting though. If you let go of the steering wheel during the drift it would immediately go to full lock by itself, getting the car out of the drift again.
05-02-2014, 11:27 PM
#10
Fast Ford snapper
Thread Starter
06-02-2014, 11:43 AM
#11
They are different, such as the steering mount point, i wasn't sure if the TCA fixing point was a couple of mm different to change castor.
I have 2wd hubs and new adj TCAs to fit to my car at some point, was just wondering if i will need to space the ARB to TCA with washers to give extra castor.
I have 2wd hubs and new adj TCAs to fit to my car at some point, was just wondering if i will need to space the ARB to TCA with washers to give extra castor.
06-02-2014, 08:25 PM
#13
PassionFord Post Troll
They are different, such as the steering mount point, i wasn't sure if the TCA fixing point was a couple of mm different to change castor.
I have 2wd hubs and new adj TCAs to fit to my car at some point, was just wondering if i will need to space the ARB to TCA with washers to give extra castor.
I have 2wd hubs and new adj TCAs to fit to my car at some point, was just wondering if i will need to space the ARB to TCA with washers to give extra castor.
They added the H14 ARB ( standard on the Sapphire 2wd ) to late 3-door builds/RS500 and as a recall for people that complained about poor high-speed stability as it added about a degree more castor ( to about 3.5 degrees ).
If you want more than that it's down to top mounts or shimming the ARB with washers as you say
08-02-2014, 05:44 AM
#15
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