new focus rs 2009
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new focus rs 2009
Cologne, December 17, 2007 – Ford of Europe is confirming its plan to deliver an exciting all-new, high performance Focus RS model for launch in 2009. A design image released by the company today hints at the exciting direction the new model is taking.
The new Focus RS will be based on the dynamic new Focus ST. It will be developed by Ford Team RS, a specialist team led by Jost Capito who, as previously announced, is being appointed to the new role as Vehicle Line Director for Ford of Europe Performance Vehicles from January 1, 2008.
"With two consecutive Manufacturers' World Rally Championship titles under our belt, the time is right to create a new Focus RS," said John Fleming, Ford of Europe's President and CEO. "With the Fiesta and Focus ST models, Jost and his team have proved already that they can deliver exciting and practical performance road cars. The success of these models, combined with Jost's experience in motorsport and Ford of Europe's positive business results, mean that we now have a credible business case for a no-compromise Focus RS roadcar for more enthusiastic drivers."
The basic concept for a new Focus RS has been under development within Ford Team RS under Capito's leadership for some months already. Now that the programme has been given the 'green light', Capito and his team will be concentrating fully on this programme.
"We have reviewed our technical options and worked closely with the Design team on how the car might look, and I'm very excited by the results," said Jost Capito, "Now with the programme going ahead, the hard work really starts as the small team working on the project takes the car from prototype to production."
Stay Tuned
Ford of Europe will not reveal any of the technical details of the new Focus RS until closer to launch in 2009. The company plans to show a concept version of the car publicly for the first time in mid-2008.
"We will use the redesigned 2008 Focus ST as the base for a no-compromise RS model that will become the ultimate road-going Focus," Capito added. "Just as the Focus RS WRC owns the rally circuit, we want the new Focus RS to own the road, so we have the major competitors in our sights as we develop the car's performance, design, handling and braking."
"We're not ready to confirm any of the technical details of the new Focus RS yet - Jost and his team have a lot to do to finalise the exact specification and styling," said Fleming. "But make no mistake, I can assure you that ultimately, the car we plan to launch will be worthy of wearing the coveted Ford RS badge."
tease pic:
The new Focus RS will be based on the dynamic new Focus ST. It will be developed by Ford Team RS, a specialist team led by Jost Capito who, as previously announced, is being appointed to the new role as Vehicle Line Director for Ford of Europe Performance Vehicles from January 1, 2008.
"With two consecutive Manufacturers' World Rally Championship titles under our belt, the time is right to create a new Focus RS," said John Fleming, Ford of Europe's President and CEO. "With the Fiesta and Focus ST models, Jost and his team have proved already that they can deliver exciting and practical performance road cars. The success of these models, combined with Jost's experience in motorsport and Ford of Europe's positive business results, mean that we now have a credible business case for a no-compromise Focus RS roadcar for more enthusiastic drivers."
The basic concept for a new Focus RS has been under development within Ford Team RS under Capito's leadership for some months already. Now that the programme has been given the 'green light', Capito and his team will be concentrating fully on this programme.
"We have reviewed our technical options and worked closely with the Design team on how the car might look, and I'm very excited by the results," said Jost Capito, "Now with the programme going ahead, the hard work really starts as the small team working on the project takes the car from prototype to production."
Stay Tuned
Ford of Europe will not reveal any of the technical details of the new Focus RS until closer to launch in 2009. The company plans to show a concept version of the car publicly for the first time in mid-2008.
"We will use the redesigned 2008 Focus ST as the base for a no-compromise RS model that will become the ultimate road-going Focus," Capito added. "Just as the Focus RS WRC owns the rally circuit, we want the new Focus RS to own the road, so we have the major competitors in our sights as we develop the car's performance, design, handling and braking."
"We're not ready to confirm any of the technical details of the new Focus RS yet - Jost and his team have a lot to do to finalise the exact specification and styling," said Fleming. "But make no mistake, I can assure you that ultimately, the car we plan to launch will be worthy of wearing the coveted Ford RS badge."
tease pic:
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#8
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I'm hoping 4WD. Ford are not stupid, what with the complete fuck up that is the new Impreza & Mitsu now concetrating on competing with Audi & BMW means there is a big gap in the market that Ford pretty much created in the first place!
I'm just laughing at all the self-titled experts on other sites who said it wouldn't happen at all
I'm just laughing at all the self-titled experts on other sites who said it wouldn't happen at all
#12
Originally Posted by monkey nutz
I reckon it will be 4WD, for the simple fact that it'd just be competing with its older sibling - the ST - otherwise. Think about it!
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If it was 4wd i think it would attract a lot more buyers, It'd even have me interested.
Hopefully you'd get currend RS focus owners upgrading meaning more of them on the second hand market which can only be a good thing.
It looks really mean in the pics.
Hopefully you'd get currend RS focus owners upgrading meaning more of them on the second hand market which can only be a good thing.
It looks really mean in the pics.
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Originally Posted by T4KAF
minute names getting taken for new rs,mines will be 1 them!!!
I'm over the moon when i can afford a pair of tyres every now and again!
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Originally Posted by ryan_belfast
It will only be FWD... sure the ford test driver on here said so.
It hasn't even got off the drawing board yet! Don't listen to the so-called experts & haters - they're the same lot that said the car wouldn't happen in the first place (certain members of a long-established car club especially - shame on you!)
I'll say it again, it's madness for Ford to put out a car that's going to compete in the same sector as the ST; which a more powerful FWD MK2 RS most certainly would. IMO it has to be 4WD to make business sense!
I could be wrong, but until Ford say FWD, I'll be keeping an open mind (and my fingers crossed!)
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Originally Posted by MalteseFalcon
it's confirmed that it will be 4wd and will be STI/EVO killer! HOPE SO
#25
PF's Guitar God!!!
all they have said is that they have been playing around with all-wheel drive and front wheel drive. They havent made a decision on what layout they will use.
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i do have funny feeling it b 280bhp@low pressure and 350bhp@ high pressure but funny feeling it will b fwd as well with atb diff etc and 0-60 time of 5.5secs i read somewhere,dont think its gonna b 4wd cos of the cost,cost ford nearly 30k 2 build 1 of the last focus rs,s and sold them for 20k so this 1 needs 2 make money so dont think it have 4wd,wouldnt b surprised if it was still quicker round the track than an evo evan still with fwd!!!
#28
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Originally Posted by ryan_belfast
280bhp - FWD - Trick Front Diff....
Mark my words.
Mark my words.
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Originally Posted by monkey nutz
Originally Posted by ryan_belfast
280bhp - FWD - Trick Front Diff....
Mark my words.
Mark my words.
#31
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They say ( FORD of Europe) That has to own the road just like the focus owened the circuit so something BIG is coming just like when they lounched the Cosworth !!!! Again hope so!
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Originally Posted by MalteseFalcon
They say ( FORD of Europe) That has to own the road just like the focus owened the circuit so something BIG is coming just like when they lounched the Cosworth !!!! Again hope so!
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Ford need to create something special something that will be loved and cared for 10,15 maybe even 20 years down the road something special like the cosworth was and still is today they need to show these jap companys what they can do and the next time someone is out for a blast in his/hers (not sexist ) subaru or evo or even honda they see a mean looking focus shooting up behind them then straight past them.... all in favor??? say i
would like to see 4wd 300+
would like to see 4wd 300+
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Boys pull your heads out of the sand...
taken from crash.net
When Ford announced that it would be producing an RS version of the first generation Focus, fast Ford fans all over the world worked themselves into a frenzy of anticipation. It had been ten long years since the Escort Cosworth, and it was about time that we saw another truly fast Ford. The car that arrived was eventually accepted by those in the know as being one of the truly great hot hatchbacks – despite the infamous, and ongoing, diff fiasco. However, in spite of its eventual critical acclaim and cult status, I don’t think anyone would pretend that they weren’t gutted that it wasn’t a true spiritual successor to the late, great Escort ‘Cosseh’. Put simply, it wasn’t a rally car for the road – just another very decent hot hatchback. This was no super saloon to compete with the motor sport cachet of the Evo, Impreza and Cosworth-badged Fords.
A generation on and Ford released the successor to the RS, the ST, alongside yet another completely irrelevant WRC machine at the Autosport Show. The dropping of ‘RS’ signalled that Ford was planning another model to slot into the range above this one – possibly one with a Rallye Sport badge. Possibly four-wheel drive. Possibly something to tie the road cars in more closely with the company’s WRC programme. Possibly 300bhp. Possibly a true successor to the last Cosworth.
Just before Christmas, Ford showed a teaser picture of the new RS to whet our appetites and forums across the internet went mental. The existence of the ST – a car that already has over 200bhp and, following an announcement from Ford, will soon be available with 260bhp – meant that the RS was going to have to be properly special. The teaser pic showed swollen arches, a gaping hole in the front bumper and bonnet vents. A few months earlier, Ford put out a press release saying that it had appointed Jost Capito as its new vehicle line director for Ford Performance Vehicles – a man with an illustrious motor sport career history. This was it: the new Escort Cosworth.
Advertisement [Go Advertisement Free]
But, yet again, it looks like the prospect of a proper tarmac terrorist with a blue oval on its nose is going to be nothing more than a day dream. This month’s issue of CAR proudly proclaims – in an interview with Capito no less - that the new RS will not be a stripped out road racer and, most disappointingly of all, the new RS will not have four wheel drive.
Which does beg the question: what on earth is the point?
It seems that all we’re getting from Ford is a warmed over ST. Capito says that “The majority of people don’t want stripped-out cars. These days they expect creature comforts.” A fair point, but are the ‘majority’ of people going to buy an essexed-up Focus with a big rear wing, flared arches and no back doors? Are the ‘majority’ of people going to want a car that does 15mpg? Are the ‘majority’ of people going to think, “Yes, I think I will pay a Ł5-10k premium over the ST for a few extra bhp, a badge and a bodykit”? The answer to all those questions is: no, probably not.
When you put a 300 brake horsepower engine into the front of a family car you are, whether you like it or not, aiming at a very specific audience: the enthusiast. Manufacturers don’t make cars like this to make money – they either do it for motor sport homologation or, the other 999 times out of 1,000, to bath the rest of the range in a warm glow of desirability so they can make more money from the lesser models.
So why not go the whole hog? Capito says, “There’s absolutely no need for four-wheel drive” but I’m afraid that is complete rubbish. Even if he thinks that putting 300bhp through the front wheels of a car is a good idea, or that in engineering terms it’s the most elegant solution, from a desirability point of view (which is what these cars are all about) it makes no sense whatsoever. You only have to look at the success of the Evo and the STi, never mind the fact that a decent Escort Cosworth still sells for Ł25k, to see that having four-wheel drive adds an exotic element that simply cannot be achieved with only two wheels being driven.
It’s not even a money thing – and that just makes it even more infuriating. The Focus shares its platform with the Volvo C30, which has both the capability to accept a four-wheel drive transmission and a four-wheel drive system that fits it – it would require very little development to put it in a high-power Focus.
I just can’t understand why Ford are taking this approach to the new RS – there is so much potential, both from the point of view of tying the completely irrelevant World Rally Championship into the road car operation and creating another timeless Ford legend.
I had hoped that I was going to missing the Cosworth badge, not everything that the car should have been. Let's hope this is a very ellaborate smoke screen.
The new Focus RS is set to make its debut at the British Motor Show in August.
taken from crash.net
When Ford announced that it would be producing an RS version of the first generation Focus, fast Ford fans all over the world worked themselves into a frenzy of anticipation. It had been ten long years since the Escort Cosworth, and it was about time that we saw another truly fast Ford. The car that arrived was eventually accepted by those in the know as being one of the truly great hot hatchbacks – despite the infamous, and ongoing, diff fiasco. However, in spite of its eventual critical acclaim and cult status, I don’t think anyone would pretend that they weren’t gutted that it wasn’t a true spiritual successor to the late, great Escort ‘Cosseh’. Put simply, it wasn’t a rally car for the road – just another very decent hot hatchback. This was no super saloon to compete with the motor sport cachet of the Evo, Impreza and Cosworth-badged Fords.
A generation on and Ford released the successor to the RS, the ST, alongside yet another completely irrelevant WRC machine at the Autosport Show. The dropping of ‘RS’ signalled that Ford was planning another model to slot into the range above this one – possibly one with a Rallye Sport badge. Possibly four-wheel drive. Possibly something to tie the road cars in more closely with the company’s WRC programme. Possibly 300bhp. Possibly a true successor to the last Cosworth.
Just before Christmas, Ford showed a teaser picture of the new RS to whet our appetites and forums across the internet went mental. The existence of the ST – a car that already has over 200bhp and, following an announcement from Ford, will soon be available with 260bhp – meant that the RS was going to have to be properly special. The teaser pic showed swollen arches, a gaping hole in the front bumper and bonnet vents. A few months earlier, Ford put out a press release saying that it had appointed Jost Capito as its new vehicle line director for Ford Performance Vehicles – a man with an illustrious motor sport career history. This was it: the new Escort Cosworth.
Advertisement [Go Advertisement Free]
But, yet again, it looks like the prospect of a proper tarmac terrorist with a blue oval on its nose is going to be nothing more than a day dream. This month’s issue of CAR proudly proclaims – in an interview with Capito no less - that the new RS will not be a stripped out road racer and, most disappointingly of all, the new RS will not have four wheel drive.
Which does beg the question: what on earth is the point?
It seems that all we’re getting from Ford is a warmed over ST. Capito says that “The majority of people don’t want stripped-out cars. These days they expect creature comforts.” A fair point, but are the ‘majority’ of people going to buy an essexed-up Focus with a big rear wing, flared arches and no back doors? Are the ‘majority’ of people going to want a car that does 15mpg? Are the ‘majority’ of people going to think, “Yes, I think I will pay a Ł5-10k premium over the ST for a few extra bhp, a badge and a bodykit”? The answer to all those questions is: no, probably not.
When you put a 300 brake horsepower engine into the front of a family car you are, whether you like it or not, aiming at a very specific audience: the enthusiast. Manufacturers don’t make cars like this to make money – they either do it for motor sport homologation or, the other 999 times out of 1,000, to bath the rest of the range in a warm glow of desirability so they can make more money from the lesser models.
So why not go the whole hog? Capito says, “There’s absolutely no need for four-wheel drive” but I’m afraid that is complete rubbish. Even if he thinks that putting 300bhp through the front wheels of a car is a good idea, or that in engineering terms it’s the most elegant solution, from a desirability point of view (which is what these cars are all about) it makes no sense whatsoever. You only have to look at the success of the Evo and the STi, never mind the fact that a decent Escort Cosworth still sells for Ł25k, to see that having four-wheel drive adds an exotic element that simply cannot be achieved with only two wheels being driven.
It’s not even a money thing – and that just makes it even more infuriating. The Focus shares its platform with the Volvo C30, which has both the capability to accept a four-wheel drive transmission and a four-wheel drive system that fits it – it would require very little development to put it in a high-power Focus.
I just can’t understand why Ford are taking this approach to the new RS – there is so much potential, both from the point of view of tying the completely irrelevant World Rally Championship into the road car operation and creating another timeless Ford legend.
I had hoped that I was going to missing the Cosworth badge, not everything that the car should have been. Let's hope this is a very ellaborate smoke screen.
The new Focus RS is set to make its debut at the British Motor Show in August.
#35
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Originally Posted by ryan_belfast
Boys pull your heads out of the sand...
taken from crash.net
When Ford announced that it would be producing an RS version of the first generation Focus, fast Ford fans all over the world worked themselves into a frenzy of anticipation. It had been ten long years since the Escort Cosworth, and it was about time that we saw another truly fast Ford. The car that arrived was eventually accepted by those in the know as being one of the truly great hot hatchbacks – despite the infamous, and ongoing, diff fiasco. However, in spite of its eventual critical acclaim and cult status, I don’t think anyone would pretend that they weren’t gutted that it wasn’t a true spiritual successor to the late, great Escort ‘Cosseh’. Put simply, it wasn’t a rally car for the road – just another very decent hot hatchback. This was no super saloon to compete with the motor sport cachet of the Evo, Impreza and Cosworth-badged Fords.
A generation on and Ford released the successor to the RS, the ST, alongside yet another completely irrelevant WRC machine at the Autosport Show. The dropping of ‘RS’ signalled that Ford was planning another model to slot into the range above this one – possibly one with a Rallye Sport badge. Possibly four-wheel drive. Possibly something to tie the road cars in more closely with the company’s WRC programme. Possibly 300bhp. Possibly a true successor to the last Cosworth.
Just before Christmas, Ford showed a teaser picture of the new RS to whet our appetites and forums across the internet went mental. The existence of the ST – a car that already has over 200bhp and, following an announcement from Ford, will soon be available with 260bhp – meant that the RS was going to have to be properly special. The teaser pic showed swollen arches, a gaping hole in the front bumper and bonnet vents. A few months earlier, Ford put out a press release saying that it had appointed Jost Capito as its new vehicle line director for Ford Performance Vehicles – a man with an illustrious motor sport career history. This was it: the new Escort Cosworth.
Advertisement [Go Advertisement Free]
But, yet again, it looks like the prospect of a proper tarmac terrorist with a blue oval on its nose is going to be nothing more than a day dream. This month’s issue of CAR proudly proclaims – in an interview with Capito no less - that the new RS will not be a stripped out road racer and, most disappointingly of all, the new RS will not have four wheel drive.
Which does beg the question: what on earth is the point?
It seems that all we’re getting from Ford is a warmed over ST. Capito says that “The majority of people don’t want stripped-out cars. These days they expect creature comforts.” A fair point, but are the ‘majority’ of people going to buy an essexed-up Focus with a big rear wing, flared arches and no back doors? Are the ‘majority’ of people going to want a car that does 15mpg? Are the ‘majority’ of people going to think, “Yes, I think I will pay a Ł5-10k premium over the ST for a few extra bhp, a badge and a bodykit”? The answer to all those questions is: no, probably not.
When you put a 300 brake horsepower engine into the front of a family car you are, whether you like it or not, aiming at a very specific audience: the enthusiast. Manufacturers don’t make cars like this to make money – they either do it for motor sport homologation or, the other 999 times out of 1,000, to bath the rest of the range in a warm glow of desirability so they can make more money from the lesser models.
So why not go the whole hog? Capito says, “There’s absolutely no need for four-wheel drive” but I’m afraid that is complete rubbish. Even if he thinks that putting 300bhp through the front wheels of a car is a good idea, or that in engineering terms it’s the most elegant solution, from a desirability point of view (which is what these cars are all about) it makes no sense whatsoever. You only have to look at the success of the Evo and the STi, never mind the fact that a decent Escort Cosworth still sells for Ł25k, to see that having four-wheel drive adds an exotic element that simply cannot be achieved with only two wheels being driven.
It’s not even a money thing – and that just makes it even more infuriating. The Focus shares its platform with the Volvo C30, which has both the capability to accept a four-wheel drive transmission and a four-wheel drive system that fits it – it would require very little development to put it in a high-power Focus.
I just can’t understand why Ford are taking this approach to the new RS – there is so much potential, both from the point of view of tying the completely irrelevant World Rally Championship into the road car operation and creating another timeless Ford legend.
I had hoped that I was going to missing the Cosworth badge, not everything that the car should have been. Let's hope this is a very ellaborate smoke screen.
The new Focus RS is set to make its debut at the British Motor Show in August.
taken from crash.net
When Ford announced that it would be producing an RS version of the first generation Focus, fast Ford fans all over the world worked themselves into a frenzy of anticipation. It had been ten long years since the Escort Cosworth, and it was about time that we saw another truly fast Ford. The car that arrived was eventually accepted by those in the know as being one of the truly great hot hatchbacks – despite the infamous, and ongoing, diff fiasco. However, in spite of its eventual critical acclaim and cult status, I don’t think anyone would pretend that they weren’t gutted that it wasn’t a true spiritual successor to the late, great Escort ‘Cosseh’. Put simply, it wasn’t a rally car for the road – just another very decent hot hatchback. This was no super saloon to compete with the motor sport cachet of the Evo, Impreza and Cosworth-badged Fords.
A generation on and Ford released the successor to the RS, the ST, alongside yet another completely irrelevant WRC machine at the Autosport Show. The dropping of ‘RS’ signalled that Ford was planning another model to slot into the range above this one – possibly one with a Rallye Sport badge. Possibly four-wheel drive. Possibly something to tie the road cars in more closely with the company’s WRC programme. Possibly 300bhp. Possibly a true successor to the last Cosworth.
Just before Christmas, Ford showed a teaser picture of the new RS to whet our appetites and forums across the internet went mental. The existence of the ST – a car that already has over 200bhp and, following an announcement from Ford, will soon be available with 260bhp – meant that the RS was going to have to be properly special. The teaser pic showed swollen arches, a gaping hole in the front bumper and bonnet vents. A few months earlier, Ford put out a press release saying that it had appointed Jost Capito as its new vehicle line director for Ford Performance Vehicles – a man with an illustrious motor sport career history. This was it: the new Escort Cosworth.
Advertisement [Go Advertisement Free]
But, yet again, it looks like the prospect of a proper tarmac terrorist with a blue oval on its nose is going to be nothing more than a day dream. This month’s issue of CAR proudly proclaims – in an interview with Capito no less - that the new RS will not be a stripped out road racer and, most disappointingly of all, the new RS will not have four wheel drive.
Which does beg the question: what on earth is the point?
It seems that all we’re getting from Ford is a warmed over ST. Capito says that “The majority of people don’t want stripped-out cars. These days they expect creature comforts.” A fair point, but are the ‘majority’ of people going to buy an essexed-up Focus with a big rear wing, flared arches and no back doors? Are the ‘majority’ of people going to want a car that does 15mpg? Are the ‘majority’ of people going to think, “Yes, I think I will pay a Ł5-10k premium over the ST for a few extra bhp, a badge and a bodykit”? The answer to all those questions is: no, probably not.
When you put a 300 brake horsepower engine into the front of a family car you are, whether you like it or not, aiming at a very specific audience: the enthusiast. Manufacturers don’t make cars like this to make money – they either do it for motor sport homologation or, the other 999 times out of 1,000, to bath the rest of the range in a warm glow of desirability so they can make more money from the lesser models.
So why not go the whole hog? Capito says, “There’s absolutely no need for four-wheel drive” but I’m afraid that is complete rubbish. Even if he thinks that putting 300bhp through the front wheels of a car is a good idea, or that in engineering terms it’s the most elegant solution, from a desirability point of view (which is what these cars are all about) it makes no sense whatsoever. You only have to look at the success of the Evo and the STi, never mind the fact that a decent Escort Cosworth still sells for Ł25k, to see that having four-wheel drive adds an exotic element that simply cannot be achieved with only two wheels being driven.
It’s not even a money thing – and that just makes it even more infuriating. The Focus shares its platform with the Volvo C30, which has both the capability to accept a four-wheel drive transmission and a four-wheel drive system that fits it – it would require very little development to put it in a high-power Focus.
I just can’t understand why Ford are taking this approach to the new RS – there is so much potential, both from the point of view of tying the completely irrelevant World Rally Championship into the road car operation and creating another timeless Ford legend.
I had hoped that I was going to missing the Cosworth badge, not everything that the car should have been. Let's hope this is a very ellaborate smoke screen.
The new Focus RS is set to make its debut at the British Motor Show in August.
Whoever wrote that above writes absolute perfect sense; a FWD MK2 FRS is complete madness, no matter how much electrical trickery is thrown at it. As I've said before, the ST is the only car it'll end up competing against, not the EVO or Impreza (which would be hilariously ironic), and the fact you can get an easy 300BHP out of an ST anyway adds more fuel to the proverbial fire. I'm sure this isn't lost on Ford though, and I can't believe that they've overlooked or ruled-out the Volvo drive-train just yet.
#36
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4WD is the only answer for an RS.
As above, the only other car it will compete against will have the same (Ford) badge....CRAZY....And more crazy is the fact that I'll still buy one (probably)
Can we not all start sending e-mails with our concerns of it being not what the potential buyers want...Lets find capitoooosss (or what ever he calls himself) e-mail address and post it on FSTOC /RSOC and anyone else who wants it......That should make them think twice about having two wheels drive it.
As above, the only other car it will compete against will have the same (Ford) badge....CRAZY....And more crazy is the fact that I'll still buy one (probably)
Can we not all start sending e-mails with our concerns of it being not what the potential buyers want...Lets find capitoooosss (or what ever he calls himself) e-mail address and post it on FSTOC /RSOC and anyone else who wants it......That should make them think twice about having two wheels drive it.
#38
PF's Guitar God!!!
Personally I'm going to side with Ryan on this. I can't justify spending 25-28K on a front wheel drive car that is supposed to be a rally car for the road. If i was going to spend that kind of cash i'd personally save another 20K and by the new GTR.
#39
PassionFord Post Whore!!
If it does happen, im almost sure it will around 300bhp, 4wd !! there not going to make the mistake again, they want to do it like mitsubishi and subaru! theres a market for these cars
If there going to do it they will do it right i think
If there going to do it they will do it right i think