Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

... Do they fit in our 1.6 heads?



Just thinking anything that will help reduce cam wear, and these have no bases to dish or burr over, if they do fit will the roller be too hard for our cam lobes is my other thought though?

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

Sorry waste of a thread...
Just done a search and although they do fit they reduce the opening time and will be too hard for a non roller lifter cam.....

chaffe

what about the 1.8 head? ive thought of this before! there is something different with the lifters, something stops them from turning too if i remember

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

1.8 Head does not have a suitable cam profile available for a turbo charged application (although a custom one could be made of course), dont know if there are any other probs with it?

chaffe

cool, was worth a punt though

botters

iTrader: (2)

doesnt jano use these in his engine builds? he may be the man to ask

DazC

iTrader: (1)

You lose duration as said so you'd have to have a specific cam profile ground for them. These and roller rockers should have been on the CVH as standard IMO!

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

Yeah I agree, would save a lot of bottom ends!

I'm sure Newmans would produce a cam if a profile was supplied (they are not the best at designing profiles from what i've been told).
Roller rockers can be bought from the states for the 1.9CVH's IIRC.

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

Found these produced by Harland Sharp and have been available since July 2009 for 1 set $327USD or for 3 sets $280USD.





I assume they are for the 1.9, are they the same ratio as our 1.6?

DazC

iTrader: (1)

Interesting!! Roller rockers hadn't been available for quite some time! They 'look' the same ratio but without measuring it's be impossible to tell.

I've had a high lift short duration cam ground for my Dad's car by Newman before so they will cut you a cam to your own spec.

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

Yes they do look the same...
My first thoughts are Sierra roller lifters, Harland Sharp roller rockers, and a custom Newmans grind.... just need someone to alter say the stock Newmans profile to accomodate the loss of duration, which should be quite simple if you know what you are doing.

DazC

iTrader: (1)

That could only be calculated by having everything in front of you and measuring. Or by having the original duration and cam profile figures of bothe the roller cam and non-roller cam.

I'd estimate about another 10 to 15 degree of duration but that is only a rough guess.

Rob_DOHC

iTrader: (4)

Karlos i will try and find a link to a thread from a while ago, had quite a bit of info on, and if those roller rockers from the states are the correct ratio etc let me know and i will but a set, 1/3 you need

Rob,

**EDIT**

Click HERE there is loads of info, especially from a guy called canada1 who has built a turbo 1.9 with roller lifters

Rob_DOHC

iTrader: (4)

Karlos, if you use roller lifters the cam lobe is normally slightly different too, normal lobes for flat lifters are slightly tapered to promote lifter spin and equal wear.

and if you cut through the waffle of the thread i posted, the American spec HO 1.9 cam is VERY similar to the newmans profile, in the end i was too far off from building my head to trial anything, i think jano uses roller lifters on a standard type cam with no problems??? you have to machine the head to take the roller lifters too.

In the end i decided it would probably be easier to rig up some kind of spray bar to properly lube the cam and bucket, or import a hole 1.9 HO head from the states.

Rob,

DazC

iTrader: (1)

Correct, and with the rollers you would want a reduction in the peak of the lobe to make it flatter and keep the valve at peak lift for a reasonable amount of time (making the lobe more rounded).

I'll buy a set too if we're going down this route! Gus might be interested in some too.

botters

iTrader: (2)

im interested also

Rob_DOHC

iTrader: (4)

lol, what have you started karlos!

botters

iTrader: (2)

the future of cvh turbo valve train technology!

Rob_DOHC

iTrader: (4)

Hahah indeed, still quite a bit of agro tho if you want roller lifters,

Rob,

Rob_DOHC

iTrader: (4)

Pics stolen from canada1, showing the lifter and its retaining flats,

Rob,

gus

iTrader: (1)

i think karl at nms would be the one to speak to about this

he use to have sets made but has gone back to using the standard rocker

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

It was just a thought! lol

Thing is it's the roller lifters that are of greatest benefit, as it's the lifter bases and cam lobes that fall apart! The roller rockers will just reduce friction losses (whic is nice of course), never seen a lifter top or a rocker tip break up D: lol

Gus, yeah perhaps I'll give Karl a ring and see what he knows too.

Rob_DOHC

iTrader: (4)

My point exactly mate,

At the very least you will have to machine the head for lifter retaining clips, and thats if a standard cam lobe is suitable (which i personally doubt), im pretty sure the lifters are the same dia....

So one route could be a custom grind nemans (or someone) cam, standard springs and sierra roller lifters and a bit done to the head.... sounds like 4-600 quid to me? with out roller rockers.

Rob,

rsmark86

iTrader: (3)

oddkidd does a kit for a cvh but he recommends it with a kent cvh 37 with solid lifters and uprated springs might be worth someone picking his brain..... as its something im holding out on untill i find the best spec for the rest of my engine...

this is what ive been recommended by jano but others say get a newman.

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

Standard cam lobe is not suited too soft and wrong profile, I've emailed Newmans for a price on a custom profile, so it's juts the machining of the head to fit the retainers thats an unknown quanitity.
How and where do these retainers sit, I've not seen any before?
CVH37 is a hydraulic profile cam, and not deisnged for roller lifter use either


What are the Sierra CVH heads like, valve sizes, port shapes, etc.? As they use them as standard.

rsmark86

iTrader: (3)

i think he has had a custom profile done that acts like a cvh37 but i will know soon as ive pm'd him on his site about it and i will know for sure and i will get prices ect .

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

Well Newmans want Ł150+VAT for a custom grind so thats not bad, just need to find out about the headwork.

rsmark86

iTrader: (3)

well keep us posted karlos as i still need a cam kit so we can do some testing with mine mate

rsmark86

iTrader: (3)

keep us posted karlos as i still need a cam kit so we could test it out on mine

gus

iTrader: (1)

did you speak with karl?

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

No Gus sorry, I have not done any more about it, the engine i'm building is on hold until more money is available so it's on the back burner.

But I'll try and remember to give him a bell in the next week, would be good to get whatever info he can give anyway!

homer j

iTrader: (1)

just to clear it up guys, Jano uses ROLLER ROCKERS on his xr3 engine with solid lifters of the standard type, not roller lifters.

regards

Tom

rsmark86

iTrader: (3)

guys ive been talking to jano and he is having custom ones made and they work with normal solid lifters and he has had kent make a cvh37 for solid lifters and its good prices for the cam kit and hes gunna let me know prices on the roller rockers .

so i will post up details when i have them

botters

iTrader: (2)

good man

rsmark86

iTrader: (3)

i think there will be alot of people intrested in them as the standard ones let go at around 7k ...

and i want my rev limit at 7-7.2k but want the rest of my engine to be safe

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

Yeah but as Homer J said Jano uses roller rockers not roller lifters, roller rockers aside from reducing pumping losses dont do anthing for cam/lifter wear... this is why I was looking at roller lifters.

What lets go at around 7k? Rocker arms?

rsmark86

iTrader: (3)

its what i was told when i snapped one

Karlos G

iTrader: (4)

You snapped at rocker arm?? Had you fogotten to refit the shim it sits on? It's normally the studs that pull from the ally head I thought, first time i've heard of a arm snapping! Well done mate! lol

rsmark86

iTrader: (3)

it was with my old s2 it had a turbo systems chip with rev limit set at 7200rpm and i was bouncing on the limiter in a 2nd gear wheel spin and it smashed my engine to bits...

that 5th injector and 23psi

gus

iTrader: (1)

think mk snapped a rocker arm on his xr2