Ebonycossie4x4

iTrader: (4)

Hi Guys..

Am i being a doughnut here.

I am getting ready to do the rear end swap in my car and have bought an escos back end with all the shafts/diff etc

however its in pretty poor condition and i dont want to do anything i dont have to.

so i start thinking about it and remember that all escorts were were shortened sierra 4x4s so surely that means the rear ends are the same.

obviously the diffs are different and because the 4x4 diff is bigger surely the shafts in a 4x4 are shorter which i have.

am i to assume that whoever done the RWD conversion wouldnt have bothered changing the back end and would have just changed diffs and shafts etc as they will bolt straight in.

due to the messing around and condition of current beam i am really hoping the beam in the car is 4x4 as its in much better condition.

so is there any way to tell? and am i right with my knowledge?

Regards

Rob

paul16v

2wd diff and shafts are bigger then the 4x4 stuff mate.

Ebonycossie4x4

iTrader: (4)

ah ok, so the 4x4 ones are smaller then and not bigger but yet its unlikely someone would change the rest of it, beam etc?

Ebonycossie4x4

iTrader: (4)

and if it has got a 2wd beam the 4x4 bits will fit easy and there is no reason to change any more than the shafts and the diff?

paul16v

I'm not quite sure what you are getting at to be honest mate, do you know for sure what rear end your car has in it at the min? is it the 7.5" 2WD diff beam & shafts or the 7" 4X4 stuff?

Ebonycossie4x4

iTrader: (4)

if i am completely honest i have no idea mate.

what im saying basically is i have no idea what is in the car but i also have a 4x4 beam, arms, diff and shafts.

what i am saying is i want to get away with doing as little work as possible and the beam thats in the car is a million times better than the one on my garage floor (the 4x4 one)

the car was 2wd so i imagine it has 2wd diff thats what i was told and if it has diff it has to have shafts doesnt it?

is there n easy way i can tell if its a 4x4/2wd diff.

and if it is a 2wd as suspected can i just swap diff, mount, and shafts? and keep my far better beam and arms?

Ebonycossie4x4

iTrader: (4)

or if it is a 2WD bigger diff should i just keep that anyway? and bolt the 4wd prop in

paul16v

Yes mate if it is already 2wd diff & shafts they are stronger then the 4x4 bits anyway, personally I would leave it and I'm 99% sure the ratios are nearly enough the same so you don't have to change the drop down gears.

boy-racer-1

2wd and 4wd look very similar but are different, drive shafts are different, beam is different, diff sizes are different, not sure about the arms but the hubs i think are different aswel? i thought you could still use a 2wd rear end even if converting the rest of the car to 4x4 anyway?

booner999

I can confirm it has a 2wd rear beam setup

booner999

The car had when you purchased it

205 sierra cosworth engine
Full 2wd sierra cosworth running gear including rear beam and diff.
The front end is still 4x4 minus the diff and drive shafts. I believe some kind of blanking plate was inserted into the hubs which are 4x4 on the front.

If your going for a bigger dif. Look into the supra diffs. Cheap and handle massive power, they have made a fitting kit to the 2wd rear beam so bolts straight into what you have.

Ebonycossie4x4

iTrader: (4)

Thanks guys.

I'm 99.9% sure the beams and arms are exactly the same.

Thanks for the advice on the supra bits, for a long while I won't be going for big power so probably no need to change. I might stick with the 2wd setup at the rear then as it's stronger and isn't different enough to worry me about being genuine as with 4wd it's genuine enough.

I'm pretty sure my old red one had a 7and a half diff in it and everyone thought that was a worthwhile mod!

Thanks again everyone.

Ebonycossie4x4

iTrader: (4)

Where do people get their supra diffs from then if I was to go for one as it's all up in the air haha.

fraser9764

iTrader: (3)

The arms are the same, the beam is different in that the 2wd has a half inch wider opening for the diff. As said, you can leave the 7.5" 2wd beam diff and shafts in and bolt the prop up to it.

boy-racer-1

i can tell you 100% the beams are different, they call the 2wd diff a 7.5 inch one because the mounting point is 7.5 inches wide apart, whereas the 4wd one is 7 inches apart, the beam section is not interchangeable!

Ebonycossie4x4

iTrader: (4)

All I'm saying is what I have read in Many different places, apparently to fit a 7 and a Half inch diff in a escos all you need to do is shave a bit off the diff, so I can't see the mounting points being different

The hole it fist in might be for some reason. I suppose it may be worth taking both diffs out to compare but in all the time I have read about the differences I was told the beams were completely interchangeable and technically the same.

Would be great for others to confirm, even with pics to show the differences

Ebonycossie4x4

iTrader: (4)

I'm just gonna keep the diff and beam anyway I thing. Seems like the cleverer thing to do as it's a mod a lot of people do anyway.

fraser9764

iTrader: (3)

The top mounting bolt on the diff, where the long bolt passes through is 7" wide on a 4x4 beam/diff and 7.5" on a 2wd beam/diff To fit a 2wd diff in a 4x4 beam you have to 'shave' half an inch of the diff casing on the top mount.

fraser9764

iTrader: (3)

Agreed

Ebonycossie4x4

iTrader: (4)

Thanks for the help mate, I had heard about the whole shavig off bit.

booner999

You can pickup a diff for cheap at most scrap yards from a supra... It has to be a non turbo diff if I remember correctly. Have a look on Escos.com or speak to MK Motorsport (I think it was them) They have made the kit and sale the diffs with it. The dif is cheap as chips at a couple hundred.. or they was at least.

Apparently builet proof.... but you then have to start upgrading other parts as they then become the weak part of the system. The diff it had in there took anything I threw at it and the two previous owners to that. The engine, diff, gearbox and beam etc all came from the same car which was known by the guy who built it. He sold his ST 200 block engine and replaced with that one, had it mapped and off he went.

That car would spin happily in third gear in the dry

primedog

long and short of this...... if going TO 4wd FROM 2wd you can leave rear end alone and bolt prop up to it???????

as im thinkin of doin the same thing. leaving only the front end parts to buy.

fraser9764

iTrader: (3)

Yes.

3dormatt

As Mark has already confirmed. The rear end is all from an '88 2wd Saff

primedog

good stuff!!!! nice one bruv!

booner999

This is the best guy to speak to regarding this car.

Ebonycossie4x4

iTrader: (4)

at this rate the car is not going to be anything like it was lol...

thanks again everyone, yes Mark i get the whole spinning in 3rd bit but thats not really what floats my boat, with the power it had it really shouldnt be spinning in 3rd in the dry, I will eventually go with an uprated rear beam but i want to get the car how it should be first and replace a lot of the tired and worn bits underneath.

ive also got to do the engine bay as i really disliked it, ill get the monies out soon though and start buying all the bits i want, hopefully it will be transformed by next show season.

the bodywork is all still nice since the rust repairs so its just a case of getting the rest how i want.

must go leather too, looks so much better.

all ready for front shafts to arrive and go in and we are back to 4x4

its coming along

dojj

iTrader: (3)

The ratios are different though between the 2 and 4wd riffs
3.64:1 and 3.62:1
Not really enough to fuck the transfer box but you need to be aware nevertheless
The 4wd rear beam uses the smaller 7 inch diff which is actually much smaller because it houses a 7inch set of gears inside while the 7.5 inch diff houses, as the name would suggest, a larger set of everything
The output flanges are also bigger as they have a pcd of 108mm which only the 2wd cossie cars came fitted with, the 4wd cars came with 100mm flanges the same as the rest if the rwd ford range from the Granada and the sierra and the escos
The shafts are also thicker as well as the flanges on the hub ends
The beam plate is also welded in a different place so that the diff can fit but seeing as its only one place where it differs you just need to use a longer bolt and make a spacer to fit it up

Ebonycossie4x4

iTrader: (4)

thanks for the info dojj,

as said there seems to be a few people using the 2wd diff in 4x4, i can change it all i just dont want to if im putting weaker bits in, i know people see that as the whole 4x4 bit putting weaker bits in but i want it how it should be, however im not against upgrades which surely the bigger rear diff is an upgrade?

dojj

iTrader: (3)

if you are going back to 4wd then it "should" be fine and dandy, it will certainly be stronger than the 4wd setup

the info was to enable you to make the best judgement call in case you were going to sell it on as they are obviously more sought after and you can measure the various different parts that will make sure that you have a specific 2wd cossie back end to any potential seller (as well as clarifying the points to look out for when someone else will in the future ask the same questions)

Ebonycossie4x4

iTrader: (4)

yeah thanks again dojj,

will be a case of strengthening the front diff next i suppose to try and get that as strong as the rear