timsrs

Ok lets start with the layout i have....

The connections for the swirl pot are...

BOTTOM... FEED THE MAIN PUMP
NEXT UP....SWIRL POT SUPPLY FROM LIFT PUMP
NEXT UP....RETURN FROM SWIRL POT TO TANK
TOP..........RETURN FROM ENGINE FUEL RAIL

SO
I have a facet red top feeding a swirl pot from my tank this is then returned to tank.
I have a 044 from the swirl pot feeding the engine with a return at the top of the swirl pot.

the problem is it seems the 044 is being starved of fuel...
I have confirmed this by isolating the 044 & priming the swirl pot with facet.
Then when the car starts the pump is nice and quiet until 5-6 mins later it starts getting noisey and faster.

it looks like the facet cant keep up with the 044, but have seen many setups like this.

HELp im getting confused with why

timsrs

This is my setup, BUT my return to main tank & return from engine are the other way around

timsrs

Anyone ????????

jamie956

You have two of the connections the wrong way round, but I don't think this is the issue.

The
Lowest point in the swirl pot feeds the 044
next one up supply/feed from main tank (facet pump)
next one up return from engine
highest point return back main tank


I think the facet is a little small to keep up with a 044 if you look at the specs the 044 can flow 80 gallons per hour and the facet only 35 GPH.


You might want to look at a twin facet set up or a holly pump red or black.

What size pipe work are you using on the low pressure side feed from tank, also assume you have a fuel pressure regulator in the return from the engine.

timsrs

Thanks for some help the feed to the facet is -8 then -8 into the swirl pot.

I will post some pics up tomorrow.

If i isolate the 044 and run the facet on its own to fill the pot, then put both pumps back in use the 044 pump is quiet for 5 mins.

this is only on tickover aswell...

jamie956

-8 is good for the feed size its the facet causing the issue swap it for a holley red top, I wouldn't run it any more as you will kill the 044 running it with no fuel going through it,

timsrs

thanks mate for your help

markk

iTrader: (2)

Theres no way on idle you should be able to empty that swirl chamber. How big is the return from the swirl pot to the tank? It needs to be smaller than the feeds to keep the pot almost pressurised.

timsrs

The return from swirl to tank is smaller, from memory 4mm
I will post a pic today of the setup.
i recorded the noise the pumps making on my phone but cant seem to download it to the computer

luke19790_3

How big is the swirl pot?

markk

iTrader: (2)

Size of the pot should make no difference on idle. The 044's return from the rail woul be enough to fill the pot aline.

timsrs

Pot is 2 L capacity..

What should the pressure be at the fuel rail with the vac pipe dis-connected

timsrs

pictures of system setup

timsrs

Ok so been messing with the car most of the day.....

Found the fuel pressure at 62 psi with the vac pipe removed, dropped to 52 psi and when the pipe was fitted dropped to 40-41psi.

reset the co as it was VERY lean after this.
The pump still does hunt a bit but when cold its very quiet, seems to only happen when it gets warm...

timsrs

It sounds JUst like this that i found on the internet.....

FROM 20 SECONDS ONWARDS

That hunting sort of sound

timsrs

Thoughts anyone

timsrs

bump, anyone

timsrs

Anyone have an idea if the noise from the pump in the video is how it should sound

Billy_RS

iTrader: (5)

I Havent read though all the comments but the swirl pot should be like this;



BOTTOM = FROM FUEL TANK
NEXT UP = FEED TO ENGINE
NEXT UP = RETURN FROM ENGINE
TOP = RETURN TO FUEL TANK

Unless your engine is making 500bhp+ then I'm pretty sure a lift pump followed by a Genuine Bosch 044 Would be able to flow ample amounts of fuel to the rail.

Billy_RS

iTrader: (5)

Just read through and the comment about the facet pump not being man enough is wrong. The return from the rail will be enough to practically fill the swirl pot by itself (044)

timsrs

Thanks for the help, have you listened to the video, my concern is the constant change of pitch when the pump is running.
It sounds just like the car in the video from 20 seconds onwards

timsrs

Still having issues with this, it sounds like air is being sucked by the 044....
i do not have a sight glass for the swirl pot, but confident its full of fuel.

I have no leaks.

i am starting to thing there is a restriction in the line somewhere or the 044 needs more fuel pushing into it.

Help please, with thoughts

timsrs

Ah...Just occured to me........
My inlet to the pump is slightly higher than the outlet on the swirl pot......

Could this be it ??????

Will lift the swirl pot tomorrow and give it a try.

jamie956

Don't think that will make any difference, as the swirl pot will have a slight positive pressure pushing the fuel in to the 044.

Try taking the return to tank pipe off the swirl pot and run a clear piece of hose back into the tank filler, this way you can see if the flow from the swirl pot going back to tank, if the flow is continuous then the 044 must have a maintained supply.

De4n0

The bosch 044 pump is well known to be very noisy, if the engine isn't showing any signs of fuel starvation I'd just assume everything is working ok, make sure your return the the main tank is the fitting at the top of the tank, to check the pump is getting enough fuel you could always run it until the noise comes back then turn everything off, take the top fitting off and see if you can see how much fuel is in the pot.

timsrs

I have checked and there is fuel returning to the main tank, so i am confident that the 044 has a good suply of fuel.

spoke with Bosch today and they think it might be air being agitated with the fuel

sam131

Who made the braided lines and were they washed out before fitment have seen the swarf from cutting the lines block a pump before would give you a noisy pump just an idea.

timsrs

No lines were / are spotless, i have checked the filter in the bottom of the pump also nothing is there....

timsrs

Ok done some more investigating, and think i have found the problem, but stuck on how to fix it...

I undid the feed to the 044 pump and fuel was only seeping out, i then undid the return to tank and fuel started to flow properly and a very good rate.

It seems that the swirl pot instead of being pressurised is possible has a vaccum stopping the pump from pulling through.

HELP i am REALLY stuck on this one.

Cheers Guys

jamie956

Did you un do it at the pump or the pot, looking at the photo above could the pipe have a kink in it where it dose a 90 turn, I also had an issue with a header tank I had made where the fitting was welded on not lined up with the hole in the tank so had to drill through the fitting to open the hole up.

timsrs

It was undun at the pot, it defo look like the pot is getting a vacuum of some sort, as when it was equalised by undoing the other pipe fuel flew through.

timsrs

Right another update....I started to strip hose's down and found the feed from the swirl pot to the 044 had an internal bore size of 9.5mm.

It looks like a massive restriction for the fuel to feed the 044.

Could this be why i have been having all this trouble

De4n0

I doubt it, has your fuel tank got a good breather? If not that may be were the vacuum is coming from, have you got the standard bosch 044 check valve fitted? Could always try replacing that?

timsrs

Yes the fuel tank has a breather, i have blown down it and it clear.
Its a standard 044, is not the check valve on the high pressure side.
The pump is new aswell.

De4n0

What are you using as the lift pump? Standard? I do know that the bosch pump is known to be loud, have you tried disconecting the line at the injector rail, run the pump and see how well the fuel flows? Not the best way to test it i know but atleast youll know if its working properly and your not getting worried about nothing.