Dod IRL

Ok, long story short, I want to run a 1.8 Duratec in an Escort on standard injection for reliability and economy reasons. I've stripped the engine complete with all the wiring, front to back, heads to tail lights.

Now I've it all wired in and plugged up and the dash is lighting up properly but the starter won't engage. The only light to dim on the dash is the oil light.

First question, on the ECU plug there are 2 cables that look like they earth, are they earths?

big_wasa

They will be if they have an m6 ring on the end.

The ecu will have somthing like four earths. They will be black with a trace colour. Usually three through the loom and a seperate one direct to the chassis.
There will be two switched lives. Green with a yellow trace. One permanent live and that will be red or orange.

The starter motor solenoid is switched via the start inhibit relay. It's an extra layer of Immobilizer with the pats.

The ecu earths the relay.

What's the pats light in he clock doing ?

I wouldn't have bothered with the full loom.

Dod IRL

Thanks for the reply. The reason I'm going with the full loom is that the Escort is a bare she'll so no existing wiring whatsoever so I figured I may as well use this rather than start again from scratch, also I wasn't sure if the car needed body controll sensors etc to allow it to start.

As for the dash clocks, they light up with everything showing as they should but it's only the odometer and oul light that dim when I turn the ignition switch right round to "start".

As for the ECU, the wires I'm speaking about do have M6 rings but they're right next to each other?

What I've done is hook up all the earth points to a large bolt, tightened them all together and sprayed them with contact spray, hooked a jump lead from that to the negitavite on the battery and still no starter engaging

Where is the start inhabit relay located, is that realistically a potential culprit?

big_wasa

Depends what the pats is doing.

If the pats isn't disarming then it will never start.

This is a 2004 focus Rs ecu. But it's the same principle as yours.

Dod IRL

Ok, I see he's using an LED bulb, I have the complete dash cluster. Will there be a light on it showing the PATS is armed or disarmed?

big_wasa

The video above is mine. As is the one below.

The led in the mondeo would be found in the clock in the center of the dash.

My hoby is running ford engines out off the donor. Kitcars or even just on a pallet.
St170

Current project is turbo zetec on focus rs ecu. Next is an st220 and I also have ready a 2.0 duratec.

If I find time for them is then on to the ecoboost range

Dod IRL

You're my man by the sounds of it. So when armed the light in the clock should flash slowly and when it's disarmed it should go out conpletely as in the Video?

big_wasa

Yes.

Turn the key to run and the light goes solid for a couple of seconds then goes out.

If it starts flashing rapidly then you have triggered the Immobilizer.

Dod IRL

Great, I'll get on it in the morning. Now, another question, all wires not leading to the engine, eg, door looms, heater, ABS, engine compartment like wipers etc, they all plug into a seperate ECU, so I need any of this to make the engine run?

big_wasa

The engine ecu will run independent of the gems ecu, also known as the body control ecu.

But the gems unit is the active anti theft system and will stop the engine running due to power and earth distribution.

That's why I said I wouldn't have used the full Mondeo loom.

What Escort is it ? Mk3,4,5,6

My current project

Dod IRL

Laugh if you must, it's a Mk2 Escort.

At this stage is it better to go ahead as I am or should I simplify the loom and remove everything GEMs related?

RichieST

iTrader: (2)

If it were me I'd get it all in and running first, then start removing bits you dont need.

big_wasa

Nothing wrong with that I just assumed it was fwd.


I would just use the engine ecu. I normally do a pin out and guid and post it up but I've not done yours yet.

Pre pats silvertop.

Silvertop and Blacktop.

http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/view...php?tid=179921

St170.

http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/view...php?tid=190440

Zetec SE.

http://www.locostbuilders.co.uk/view...php?tid=199233

I've done the Focus Rs but havnt had a chance to write it up.


I've added the above because...although it's not specific to your engine the principles cross over.

Dod IRL

Good job, I've a Silvertop Zetec here to as a plan B so it's good to get that far ahead. I'll go with what I have at the minute here and post progress as I go.

Thanks everyone!

Dod IRL

Hi, it's taken a while but I goy back at it today. Seems the issue I had originally was an earth so now that's sorted I have the Red LED on solid from the minute the battery's connected but it still won't turn over. Is there anything I'm missng or a check list I can run through?

costina

iTrader: (1)

First thing i wanna see pics of the car.

Next thing is has the starter got a good earth from bellhousing to chassis then chassis to battery????

check with a test light or meter you have 12volts plus at the starter soleniod when cranking. If you have all good if not you need to look a little deeper.

big_wasa

The led should not be solid from the moment you put the battery on. It should flash, then go solid as you turn the ignition to run, then go out completely.

What sort of led have you used ? If not using the mondeo clock.
It should be pre wired with a resister. It should NOT be a flashing led, the ecu does that bit.

I wouldn't worry about it cranking or not untill you have the immobiliser sussed.

Dod IRL

The car isn't much to look to at the moment but it is group 4 spec'd. The engine is on the garage floor at the minute and its earthed correctly, I even removed and tested the starter and its fine. Now, as for the constant red light, that's my concern. I'm using the Mondeo time clock so it's not going to be a fault there.

Dod IRL

One other thing, there's 2 wires with bolted connectors (like earth wiring) coming out from the ECU and I'm unsure where these go, any help?

big_wasa

Got a picture ?

Can't think what else they would be other than earths.

Dod IRL

I do but I'm fecked if I can post it up! Do I need to host it through Photobucket?

Dod IRL

Any ideas guys? I'm really at a loss here.

RichieST

iTrader: (2)

Does a haynes manual have engine/ecu wiring schematics? Maybe visit a scrapyard and find a semi disassembled one to have a look at.

Dod IRL

I could visit the actual car the lot has been removed from... One thing I'm thinking is, I cut the diring going up the A pillar to the roof cloth thinking they were just for the interior light etc, is there something in the roof lining that could be immobilising it?

big_wasa

There is nothing up the A pillar for the immobilizer ie the Pats. But you are using the full loom with the active anti theft system.

Now this is just a guess as I don't bother with the full loom, you are missing somthing for this.

No information on security is published in a Haynes manual.

My recommendation, ditch the full loom and run the ecu as a stand alone unit.

I may be prepaired to help.

Dod IRL

Great! So how do I get round this and where do you come in?

big_wasa

The body ecu (Mem's) is very complicated. It's the active anti theft system ie the alarm it handles all sorts like windows, how long the interior light stays on and hundreds more functions that you don't need.

I would make or buy a simple car loom and add the engine loom as a stand alone package just like an omex, ms, dta ( insert any brand you like here).

Down side. It's more complicated than the above. And it's not viable to tune it much.

Up side. No mapping needed and it starts on the button. It will meet current mot emissions providing you use all the bits needed and it's very very cheap.

Where do I come in. Give me a shout if you go this way and need help.

costina

iTrader: (1)

For a loom try.

www.carbuildersolutions.co.uk

Dod IRL

I'm not overly concerned about tuning it just yet, I just want it in and running. As for simplifying the loom, how do I go about that? Can I dump the like of the interior looms, engine compartment (wipers, horn lights etc) or are there elements of this that I need?

big_wasa

you should have an ecu loom. An injector loom and probably a gearbox loom.

You may need a couple of plugs from the car loom in the engine bay. Some times the post lambda senor is lumped on to the car loom You will need the obd2 plug from under the dash and the pats aerial / antenna from around the ignition key with the plug and that's about it.

Let's be seing some pictures of the looms

Strip the cover of and your left with

Dod IRL

Do I need to use Photobucket to upload or can I do it directly on here?

Dod IRL

Ok, got it down! These are the 2 wires I can't identify on the ECU plug. The loom etc I'll picture tomorrow.

big_wasa

Yes black with a yellow trace and ring terminals are earths.

Dod IRL

Please, first few snaps. This is the dash and centre console looms, centre console houses the LED for the imobiliser.

Dod IRL

I'm sorry, this is gonna need to be 1 pic per post as I'm on the phone here.

Wiring on the left is the fuel pump, boot, electric seat and abs loom.

Middle is into the engine bay, wipers etc

Then is the dash and Centre console loom.

Dod IRL

and some more.....

big_wasa

The dashes on the dash show that it's not connecting to the ecu.

Dod IRL

Really? How can you tell?

big_wasa

If you power the dash up with out the ecu feeding it that's what it shows.

Dod IRL

Ok, I'm gonna get straight at it so