simontrayler

Alright guys,

Hope your all well and good and geared up for Xmas! Far to much £'s on that rather than my motor.... Bar humbug lol.

As the title says guys, and please not another war on who's this and who's that, this is a genuine question to help me decide... Just can't make my mind up!

If you can, please choose who you'd use between Jamie @ Jam-Sport or Tommy at FMS, only out of these two though! Not who you use or a mate uses... Just decide which of these two you'd leave your car with for a 300bhp+ build. (It's on a 2.1 ZVH S2 RS FYI).

Spoken with both, both very knowledgeable, not far off on price, really liked them both too so a bit stumped.

Your opinions and input would help a lot.

Cheers in advance

simontrayler

And I'm going 2.1 as that's what's in there already! Just going to the next stage with it. Management (Gotech or Life), live map and setup, turbo (T34), forged pistons, forged rods, newman cam, stg 3 head... If that helps you decide and gives a better picture!

cossyking

id proberly use tommy as hes got yesrs of experience with tuning but a 300 bhp engine is not a hard engine to map so proberly use any of them as its only a mildly tuned engine

frayz

Tommy,

simontrayler

Seems a lean towards Tommy at the mo then... Let's see if that trend continues... But if I was pushed to decide before this thread, it likely would have been Tommy anyways.

300Bhp is, I'd personally say, a little beyond a "mildly" tuned engine for an RS Turbo though... I know a lot have gone up and above that now, but itll be no standard lump.

Jam-Sport were aiming for 300bhp, Tommy on the other hand is aiming for up to 350bhp (my current head depending).

Thanks for the input so far gents

mgtkr1

tommy field everytime.

dojj

iTrader: (3)

both have a "history" so i would chose neither

however, if you are only considering those two, please make sure that you get what you pay for in the time scale you've paid for it

simontrayler

Hmmm... Interesting. So who would you use then/recco? I'm in Hertfordshire so not a million miles away would be ideal.

dojj

iTrader: (3)

Distance should not be an issue when spending lots of money, just look at stu as an example out there in his beach hut on the Atlantic coast or the likes of rainbird and co in the proper banjo country wilderness

Not sure if he comes on here anymore but there used to be a chap called Christian who had a lightly fettled escort which was done by a jap tuner so it's not all about who does what

Back in the day I would have said power engineering but I'm not sure if they do engine building and stuff nowadays or are just doing the rolling road side of things

Cast your net far and wide and make sure you double check everything before you make your decision, 300 brake is a BIG ask from the cvh and you may find that going the zetec route may work out easier, cheaper, most cost effective in the long run as well as being more reliable

dojj

iTrader: (3)

And don't forget that if you already have the engine it may fetch a few quid when you sell it to add to the fund

Turbo Zetec

iTrader: (1)

I'd say fms, reason being that they have been building race engines for years, where as jamsport are more of a fast road tuning company. not saying they couldn't do it, just that i'd choose fms first because of experience.

packman

You only have to look who he has done engines for over the years..........

Field Motorsport.

ST Turbo

I would use Devil Developments if you end up going to a full zetec route, the guy certainly knows his shit, and has built some big bhp reliable zetecs.

He can still do CVH/ZVH though, and is very reasonably priced, so might be worth a phone call mate...
01903 731194

silky16v

iTrader: (1)

Neither both have bad history and its well documented on the Internet

More so Tommy than Jamsport

Jay,

iTrader: (4)

Yep agree both are cowboys
Karl Norris or turbo systems and msd

Adz82

I defiantly wouldn't use FMS after my dealing's in the late 90's & can't comment on Jam-Sport.

Howz about odd kidd creations ?

simontrayler

Thanks for all the input guys! A lot of food for thought there!

I've got no problems with travelling to a tuner, it's just always easier to find someone local, but I understand it's not always the best thing to do...

Looks like I may be back to sticking some calls out and seeing where I end up.

I guess as they say, if something's worth doing its worth doing properly and if it's easy, it's likely never going to be the best choice.

Cheers gents

c20tbo

iTrader: (1)

Every tuner has some sort of bad feed back, no one is perfect but its how its delt with on the aftermath which is important.

Can you not personally visit them, normally this gives a good feeling on the company?

simontrayler

Yeah I'm going to pop down and see Tommy in the New Year! He's left the best impression on me (along with Jam-Sport) but is a long term friend of my father in law too so I'd feel more comfortable with that setup when handing over thousands for a build.

Thank you all again for your thoughts, advice and help.

Merry Christmas too chaps

Harris.

I know a few people on here who use the same guy i do ... Joe at GSMOTOSPORT in collier row romford . I wouldnt let anyone touch my car other than him, very very honest and his engines/workmanship is 1st class . He built my engine 6 years ago and its never missed a beat . If your serious and want his details feel free to pm me


I doint go by name as everyone says oh use bla bla . Ive heard shit storys about both the above . I look for whos going to build my car how i want it .

nevsrevs

Lee at devil gets my vote too, should give him a call, honest bloke and is well priced

Gadget

There's so many tuners to choose from.
I think the main thing is once you have chosen, if you are happy, stick with them, and them only.
Everyone has different ways of doing things and others don't always agree with the way it's been done so will want to change it before they carry on with there bit.

Harvey at SCS isn't too far from you either!

Rod-Tarry

300bhp at Jam is the same as 350 at Field they dont call him optimistic Tommy for nothing steer well clear of him for sure. If its a RSTurbo then NMS are proven to know there stuff dont like the guy but his cars do the numbers.

primedog

lol optimistic tommy...

as previously said im sure every tuner has had issues etc but i spoke to jamie at jamsport a wile bak as going to get my series one mapped ther as running gotech. i asked him about the "hidden costs" that i was warned about with jamsport, (thought id ask as its my money, wernt trying to be rude) but jamie simply told me that people drop shabby cars round his with things not bolted on or sensors/switches not working and bodges done etc.... he then sorts a sensor thats needed to enable him to commence mapping then that goes on the bill innevitably. so he told me to make sure all things work as supposed to and a quote will stay the cost.

everyone will have different oppinions so just go with your instinct after meeting both parties maybe?

zvh

well tommy feild supplied and fitted my b2 raychem loom and p8 ecu and waisted spark kit and efi conversion and custom manifold and fitted it its spot on as is the mapping and the fueling andd mine is a 2.1 zvh with 334bhp 298@ the wheels with 398bft
off the biutton and get lots of wheelspin in 4th at 120 im 100% happy

ozmk1cos

Cant please all the people all the time

Fraggle...

iTrader: (1)

From exp ive used field only the once mind, and the work was spot on.

Only had a helicoil fitted but Mr F bought my head out to me personally, and took a good 15mins explaining the pro's/con's of the work id asked before being done, and the best ways to be sure that the repair done would be safe/secure and get me outta trouble till a more thourough repair could commence, a new head was the plan but was too skint at time, just need it to run for a few weeks.

Cant say fairer than that imop.


Re- Jamsport...

Went to view a S2 that had been done by them, fella wanted shot as "apparently" JS had fcuked it up big time, and the cash consumed was frightening so wanted shot.

Got talking to the owner(had driven 2hrs to view after being told that it was good apart from the JS work...) and after only 2mins he proceeded to tell me he'd "forgot " to mention the car was a 3i...

Once i started poking it i was shocked at the state of the car in general...
Rotten chassis legs, wiring only a snail could create, bits falling off everywhere...then the actual motor, well, i cried tbh

apparently all this was JS's fault(??).....


well if id have drove that to them, i wouldnt have been surprised if the bill had climbed a touch() so why he had the hump was a mystery...
I think they had told him to not bother but he pushed it through anyway...

Think he simply hadnt a mechanical clue so easier to blame than accept.

Yet when ive spoken to them they have been very helpfull so who knows.

Good and bad in all much like TOTD's rep..
yet chris and the guys there were very good to me...
untill i studied the graph and there was a very sharp spike for all of 100rpm....headgasket had popped

yet upon inspection the previous owner had fitted it upside down so how it got there at all is a mystery, and they wernt to know, same as we didnt..
had about 6hrs work done for 3hrs cost, was chuffed despite the outcome.

fkin went well on the rollers though



Pays ya money an takes ya choice, maybe look at other tuners too op...

pays to shop about sometimes.

Steve the Plumber

iTrader: (11)

Tommy if it was me, my old 3 door track car had one of his engines, never let me down and was always used very hard!!!

scotty86d

Some tuners are unlucky and get heaps of shit dropped off to them from some typical chav ford owners who cannot maintain their cars properly and spend their money on the wrong things and rag them to death, then have the cheek to blame the tuners for something that may not have been even remotely obvious or even close to their fault.

Choose your tuner and if happy stick to them. They will try and take care of you if half decent as you are paying their mortgage at the end of the day and they want repeat business.

Whichever one you get the best impression from if you want a local tuner crack on with. Loads of these tuners have had well known cars that produce good results so they are all capable within reason.

simontrayler

All very valid points of views guys, thank you.

I guess it's the same old story isn't it, do something well and slowly gain a good reputation for years of work, then (as is with life and the odds game!), something goes wrong through no fault of the tuner (just law of the sod!) and that gets around like wild fire and is forever brought up.

I think your right chaps, I've spoken to many tuners at length now, but I guess in the NY it's time to go and sit down and have a cuppa with these guts and see what my gut tells me.

Both clearly very capable in their own rights, guess I'll just see which one tickles my pickle after a chat and full quote...

Thanks again guys! Merry Christmas again too!!

drsrst2zvh

Si get some pics of the car up! Also jamsport or nms would be my advice. Just from experience just look at the cars nms have built and mapped very good cars!

simontrayler

I will do buddy as soon as its all done and dusted. Hopefully be done by March time now... Just finding the time (and funds!) to get it done!
Yeah NMS have got a very solid rep, but they are a trek if something needs doing... Jamie @ Jam Sport did leave me feeling very comfortable too though...

One thing that's appealing to me about FMS is the fact they use Life Management. It's really trick, maybe even overkill on a road car, but that's never stopped a boy wanting more toys

You rate Jam Sport up there with Karl Norris then Danny? Glad you weighed in on this actually mate

rstdave

iTrader: (3)

Never had any work done by them personally, but phoned nms about a valve float problem on my biggish spec cvh and karl couldn't have been more helpful telling me what the problem was likely to be, and even told me a few 'trade secrets' i guess and sent me another set of valve springs.
Didn't have to give me any advice so to speak as i'd already built the engine and had a mapper for the omex, so wasn't going to spend big money with them.....but just that experience alone made me think if i'd had the money would have been a great place to take my car, as rs turbo wise they seem to be about the best
Tuners are a bit of a minefield and the rate bills can mount up is shocking, you need to meet them personally imo and not 100% listen to internet forums lol

M K

iTrader: (9)

There both 2 different types of company

1 is a Road car engine builder and Tuner and 1 is a competition engine builder so depends what your after

drsrst2zvh

Well jamsport mapped my focus and also my dads mk2 frs, the power delivery on the js400 set up is just immense! It's such a nice car to drive and Jamie is always a top bloke willing to help people out and is an honest tuner. If something's shit he will tell you rather than telling you what you want to hear. Karl Norris is extremely talented with cossies and Rst's the gunship map is out of this world to get that power surge from a standard t3 on a Cosworth is special. And as said above he has done some proper race engines that have down very well. If the car was still mine it would be having a live map from nms. But it's your car mate so your decision. Just please don't go anywhere near msd!!!

drsrst2zvh

And what you said about travelling si! I'd rather travel somewhere further away and have it done right first time than have to keep going back somewhere local cos your not happy with it or its going wrong.

D16PJM

okc knows he around around RST's and won't have your pants down either

simontrayler

Having had a good response to this thread and with the research I've been doing, there seems to be pros and cons to every tuner, good and bad stories (Don't get me wrong, all very good within their own rights, and as Mark MK says, depending on what you want!) But there is one resounding person who no one has ever said a bad word about, ever, is Karl @ NMS...

I think I'll be giving him a call in the New Year too then and see what he has to offer/say.

Gotta say, this forum and group of members doesn't half provide a huge knowledge base!! Cheers for taking the time to give your opinions chaps

Ow! Also considering speaking with Si @ Sitech as I've been following a build thread of a ZVH he's doing that's mental!! 444bhp and 400Ilbs!! Any input there?

simontrayler

Ow and your right Danny! Do it right the first time, travel, spend the money and be happy with the result!!

Dal_

iTrader: (2)

Any tuning done by Jambodge and then rolling roaded on their own road will be 10-20% higher than anywhere else I've been reliably informed.