Cossie ECU Voltage

Neil S · 08-12-2005, 07:54 PM

With my engine running, my SECS monitor shows around 12.7V. I've confirmed this with a meter. Is this sufficient for the ECU, or should I have more (I gather that the ECU voltage has an effect on the fuelling).

I should also add that the voltage at the battery is 'only' 13.2-13.3V.

The voltage between the alternator casing and the output wire is a tad over 14V. Between the battery earth and the alternator output is the same, so I guess the earth is all good

Am I right in thinking that the only things that can cause this is bad wiring between the alternator and battery +ve, or the vehicle systems drain?

Am I making work for myself, or am I likely to have some kind of problem?

Any pointers would be ace!

Neil.

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**Stu @ M Developments** · 08-12-2005, 09:07 PM

Too Low IMO.
Wants to be battery voltage there really, but battery voltage should also be around the 14mark or at minimum 13.7 with electrics all off.

Look at teh battery "Fusible link tails" They look like 2 small crappy burnt out wires.... follow them 6" and learn that they are the main fusebox feeds!! Dead Common.

Neil S · 09-12-2005, 07:19 AM

Yeah, I had fun soldering new ones of those in last year!

I'll keep poking, see what I can find

Neil.

Neil S · 09-12-2005, 01:53 PM

Does anybody else have any input on this?

How can the condition of the fusible links affect battery voltage?

Neil.

Anonymous · 09-12-2005, 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil S

Does anybody else have any input on this?

How can the condition of the fusible links affect battery voltage?

Neil.

Cause the voltage is going up them before it gets to the ECU mate

Replace them with a proper bit of wire and a decent seperate huse holder located by the battery

Neil S · 09-12-2005, 05:03 PM

I meant BATTERY voltage, i.e. measured at the battery

I can see that the fusible links are a likely cause of the drop to the ECU, thing is, this ECU voltage is only about 0.5V less than battery. I repaired them last year, but I'm thinking that your way might be a useful mod

I've run a jump lead from the alternator to the battery positive tonight, this didnt affect the voltage at all. I can't see how the battery voltage is so far down from the alternator voltage

The only way I can imagine it is that the rest of the vehicle electrics are dropping the voltage at the battery, or that the battery is poor...

Cheers for the input Chip

Neil.

DaveEscos · 09-12-2005, 05:05 PM

look at the alternator as well..

i think mines on its way out..

I have an optima top bollock battery and used to see 13.9's to 14's on my secs..

now im only getting 13.4's

trivial I know.. but i prefer it higher!

Neil S · 09-12-2005, 05:06 PM

Alternator voltage is just over 14V Dave

Neil.

DaveEscos · 09-12-2005, 05:07 PM

oops, didnt see that

Neil S · 09-12-2005, 05:10 PM

No bother

At least you tried

Neil.

Redkop · 09-12-2005, 05:41 PM

Two recent threads

http://www.passionford.com/forum/vie...843&highlight=

http://www.passionford.com/forum/vie...888&highlight=

Matt · 09-12-2005, 06:44 PM

neil, not sure how relevant it is, and i know shit all about electrics before you ask but mine sees 14.1 at the ecu according to the secs monitor when its running so based on that fact alone....too low lol

stu, you'll be able to elaborate more on the ecu compensating the fuelling for voltage drop, mine went banana's with the old wiring loom, fuelling at idle was all over the place, voltage dropped a good 2 volts with all electrics on (fuse links smoked and burned out!!). only drops half a volt now since new loom and proper loom fuses. karl did tell me why having a stable voltage was soo much better but im fooked if i can remember his nev like techy waffle

Neil S · 09-12-2005, 06:52 PM

Thanks Lynne - I had read those earlier this week, and am currently in the process of measuring the current draw

Matt - I think I'm headed towards re-wiring as per Karl and Chip. Any idea what/where Karl did, or could you find out?

Neil.

Matt · 09-12-2005, 07:05 PM

ding made me a new loom, then karl mapped it again, problem solved lol

Smit · 09-12-2005, 07:27 PM

Neil - For the sake of money for a new loom/alternator i'm going to keep an eye on your thread

alan rainbow · 09-12-2005, 07:32 PM

http://www.passionford.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=53903

take alook at this neil try the cable between alternator and battery mine was fooked and had the same problem and as stu says the links at the battery

Neil S · 09-12-2005, 09:07 PM

Alan - I was looking for that post earlier!

I posted on there at the time as I had recently replaced one of the fusible links.

This time, I will strip the fooker right back and replace them all.

Soldering the large cables is a right ballache

Reading that post brings it all back!

After some fiddling, The residual current with everything off (doors closed etc) is about 40mA. Also I have 13.5V @ the battery at idle with no load. I'm happy with this for now.

Next step is to get the ECU voltage as close as possible to this.

Thanks all for taking the time to read the post and put some thought into it!

Neil.

Matt · 09-12-2005, 09:11 PM

this needs a post about fuelling voltage compensation!

Neil S · 09-12-2005, 09:13 PM

Agreed - I'd like to read the reason behind it!

Neil.

Anonymous · 09-12-2005, 09:14 PM

Neil i can tell you what to do without a new loom, as long as its in good condition.

I have got 14.32 volts to the pump from an alternator creating 14.35

I aint posting ths though will tell you on msn.

So know what I am doing.

Fiecos Dan · 09-12-2005, 09:18 PM

steve's back.

at my ecu, With dingy's loom i run 0.1 volt lower than @ the alternator.

and run same voltage @ fuel pump.

Neil S · 11-12-2005, 03:37 PM

OK, I'm pretty clear with how to get the ECU voltage up now thanks to Dingy

Whilst checking the rest of the lives, I found this:

This is the wiring to the 3 ABS relays, they supply the ABS valve block!

Must have been done before I got the car

Another job!!

Neil.

GARETH T · 11-12-2005, 03:58 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt

this needs a post about fuelling voltage compensation!

as battery voltage drops, responce time of the injectors gets slower, so the ecu needs to allow for this! so one of calculations the ecu does too the fuel base figure is battery adder!

DazC · 11-12-2005, 04:22 PM

Battery Adder!? Is that an electric snake or something?

GARETH T · 11-12-2005, 04:29 PM

DazC

Fiecos Dan · 11-12-2005, 04:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by GARETH T

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt

this needs a post about fuelling voltage compensation!

as battery voltage drops, responce time of the injectors gets slower, so the ecu needs to allow for this! so one of calculations the ecu does too the fuel base figure is battery adder!

Wot amount should the ecu be compensating?

i think wen mines runing with all the lights etc etc on, 13.4-6volts @ ecu, inj's and fuel pump.

wot % should the fulein be changed if voltage goes down to 12.5volts?

Neil S · 12-12-2005, 07:22 AM

Cool - Cheers Gareth

Neil.

GARETH T · 12-12-2005, 08:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fiesta cossie

Quote:

Originally Posted by GARETH T

Quote:

Originally Posted by Matt

this needs a post about fuelling voltage compensation!

as battery voltage drops, responce time of the injectors gets slower, so the ecu needs to allow for this! so one of calculations the ecu does too the fuel base figure is battery adder!

Wot amount should the ecu be compensating?

i think wen mines runing with all the lights etc etc on, 13.4-6volts @ ecu, inj's and fuel pump.

wot % should the fulein be changed if voltage goes down to 12.5volts?

im not sure how too work it back,, ive noticed on the secs ecu its 500 μs per volt

Neil S · 12-12-2005, 09:01 AM

Not mega then?

Neil.

GARETH T · 12-12-2005, 09:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neil S

Not mega then?

Neil.

your so right aswell

GARETH T · 12-12-2005, 09:24 AM

edited cos im a dick

Neil S · 12-12-2005, 03:51 PM

Edit it back cos now I look like the penis!

'We extend the injector duration by 500 mega seconds per volt, or 953 years, whichever is sooner'

Seriously though, just messing

I always enjoy reading the techy stuff

Neil.

GARETH T · 12-12-2005, 10:38 PM

i cant believe i wrote M for milli,,, what a cock,, only done electronics for 12 years

Neil S · 16-12-2005, 05:18 PM

OK, I've replaced the fusible links and now have 13V at the ECU. Battery Voltage is around 13.2V, so it's a bit better now

What should the alternator output be ideally?

Mine is 14V, sometimes just under.

Cheers!

Neil.

Fiecos Dan · 16-12-2005, 05:29 PM

i believe 13.8 - 14.0 @ any rev's over idle, and even with all lights & heater on.

trevCOSS · 08-01-2006, 05:53 PM

neil I have exactly the same reading as you did to start with! exept if i load the electrics i see about a 2v drop in all readings, did your fuseable links look dead mine look ok but i still suspect they may be to blame, what did you replace them with?

SapphyMike · 08-01-2006, 06:05 PM

is it worth replacing my links to my battery while i have no engine in place? LOL

pee vee · 08-01-2006, 06:35 PM

So these 'fuseable link tales'

are 2 wires coming off the battery to the fuse box??

sorry just adding things to my list of checks for my car
over the winter!!

SapphyMike · 08-01-2006, 08:06 PM

bump

Fiecos Dan · 08-01-2006, 10:06 PM

Well check voltage drop.

i test voltage at

alternator (usually 0.2 volt higher than battery
battery,ecu feed and outputs, fuel pump, inj. (all these about the same with in 0.1 volt, except fuel pump wen connected)

if you get low readings on something, put a better + and earth to it.

08-12-2005, 09:07 PM	#2
Stu @ M Developments PassionFords Creator Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (12) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Blackpool, UK Destination: Rev limiter Posts: 27,839 Rep Power: 39	Too Low IMO. Wants to be battery voltage there really, but battery voltage should also be around the 14mark or at minimum 13.7 with electrics all off. Look at teh battery "Fusible link tails" They look like 2 small crappy burnt out wires.... follow them 6" and learn that they are the main fusebox feeds!! Dead Common. __________________ Best Regards, Stu Click here to read my tuning articles. Click here to visit our webshop. Follow our dyno cell build On facebook and win a chance of a free power run in our competitions.

09-12-2005, 07:19 AM	#3
Neil S PassionFord Post Troll Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (1) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Cleveland Posts: 2,811 Rep Power: 13	Yeah, I had fun soldering new ones of those in last year! I'll keep poking, see what I can find Neil. __________________

09-12-2005, 01:53 PM	#4
Neil S PassionFord Post Troll Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (1) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Cleveland Posts: 2,811 Rep Power: 13	Does anybody else have any input on this? How can the condition of the fusible links affect battery voltage? Neil. __________________

09-12-2005, 05:03 PM	#6
Neil S PassionFord Post Troll Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (1) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Cleveland Posts: 2,811 Rep Power: 13	I meant BATTERY voltage, i.e. measured at the battery I can see that the fusible links are a likely cause of the drop to the ECU, thing is, this ECU voltage is only about 0.5V less than battery. I repaired them last year, but I'm thinking that your way might be a useful mod I've run a jump lead from the alternator to the battery positive tonight, this didnt affect the voltage at all. I can't see how the battery voltage is so far down from the alternator voltage The only way I can imagine it is that the rest of the vehicle electrics are dropping the voltage at the battery, or that the battery is poor... Cheers for the input Chip Neil. __________________

09-12-2005, 05:06 PM	#8
Neil S PassionFord Post Troll Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (1) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Cleveland Posts: 2,811 Rep Power: 13	Alternator voltage is just over 14V Dave Neil. __________________

09-12-2005, 05:05 PM	#7
DaveEscos BANNED BANNED Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Mongsville, wiping Jimbo.'s spastic arse. Posts: 23,056 Rep Power: 0	look at the alternator as well.. i think mines on its way out.. I have an optima top bollock battery and used to see 13.9's to 14's on my secs.. now im only getting 13.4's trivial I know.. but i prefer it higher!

09-12-2005, 05:07 PM	#9
DaveEscos BANNED BANNED Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Mongsville, wiping Jimbo.'s spastic arse. Posts: 23,056 Rep Power: 0	oops, didnt see that

09-12-2005, 05:10 PM	#10
Neil S PassionFord Post Troll Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (1) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Cleveland Posts: 2,811 Rep Power: 13	No bother At least you tried Neil. __________________

09-12-2005, 05:41 PM	#11
Redkop Member No: 39 Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: May 2003 Location: UK Posts: 8,263 Rep Power: 19	Two recent threads http://www.passionford.com/forum/vie...843&highlight= http://www.passionford.com/forum/vie...888&highlight=

09-12-2005, 06:44 PM	#12
Matt PassionFord Post Whore!! Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Doncaster Posts: 5,143 Rep Power: 16	neil, not sure how relevant it is, and i know shit all about electrics before you ask but mine sees 14.1 at the ecu according to the secs monitor when its running so based on that fact alone....too low lol stu, you'll be able to elaborate more on the ecu compensating the fuelling for voltage drop, mine went banana's with the old wiring loom, fuelling at idle was all over the place, voltage dropped a good 2 volts with all electrics on (fuse links smoked and burned out!!). only drops half a volt now since new loom and proper loom fuses. karl did tell me why having a stable voltage was soo much better but im fooked if i can remember his nev like techy waffle __________________

09-12-2005, 06:52 PM	#13
Neil S PassionFord Post Troll Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (1) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Cleveland Posts: 2,811 Rep Power: 13	Thanks Lynne - I had read those earlier this week, and am currently in the process of measuring the current draw Matt - I think I'm headed towards re-wiring as per Karl and Chip. Any idea what/where Karl did, or could you find out? Neil. __________________

09-12-2005, 07:05 PM	#14
Matt PassionFord Post Whore!! Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Doncaster Posts: 5,143 Rep Power: 16	ding made me a new loom, then karl mapped it again, problem solved lol __________________

09-12-2005, 07:27 PM	#15
Smit The 60ft Launch King Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (5) Join Date: May 2003 Location: In the countryside eating lots of straw and hay. Get off my laaaaaaaaaaand! Posts: 23,518 Rep Power: 34	Neil - For the sake of money for a new loom/alternator i'm going to keep an eye on your thread __________________ Smit. 340bhp 4x4 Moonstone Saff Quarter Mile 12.621 @ 110mph. 0-60foot 1.631. 0-60mph 3.92secs. Datron timed, No Arse dyno here LOL Motorsport Developments 01253 508400 PlayStation 3 Network Username : SmittyBear

09-12-2005, 07:32 PM	#16
alan rainbow I've found that life I needed.. It's HERE!! Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: May 2003 Location: nottingham Posts: 1,363 Rep Power: 12	http://www.passionford.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=53903 take alook at this neil try the cable between alternator and battery mine was fooked and had the same problem and as stu says the links at the battery __________________ tuned and mapped by www.norrismotorsport.co.uk

09-12-2005, 09:07 PM	#17
Neil S PassionFord Post Troll Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (1) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Cleveland Posts: 2,811 Rep Power: 13	Alan - I was looking for that post earlier! I posted on there at the time as I had recently replaced one of the fusible links. This time, I will strip the fooker right back and replace them all. Soldering the large cables is a right ballache Reading that post brings it all back! After some fiddling, The residual current with everything off (doors closed etc) is about 40mA. Also I have 13.5V @ the battery at idle with no load. I'm happy with this for now. Next step is to get the ECU voltage as close as possible to this. Thanks all for taking the time to read the post and put some thought into it! Neil. __________________

09-12-2005, 09:11 PM	#18
Matt PassionFord Post Whore!! Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Doncaster Posts: 5,143 Rep Power: 16	this needs a post about fuelling voltage compensation! __________________

09-12-2005, 09:13 PM	#19
Neil S PassionFord Post Troll Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (1) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Cleveland Posts: 2,811 Rep Power: 13	Agreed - I'd like to read the reason behind it! Neil. __________________

09-12-2005, 09:14 PM	#20
Anonymous Banned Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: Dec 2002 Posts: 146 Rep Power: 0	Neil i can tell you what to do without a new loom, as long as its in good condition. I have got 14.32 volts to the pump from an alternator creating 14.35 I aint posting ths though will tell you on msn. So know what I am doing.

09-12-2005, 09:18 PM	#21
Fiecos Dan PassionFord Post Whore!! Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: S/E Kent, Thanet Posts: 4,770 Rep Power: 14	steve's back. at my ecu, With dingy's loom i run 0.1 volt lower than @ the alternator. and run same voltage @ fuel pump. __________________ 07 Yamaha R1 race bike, and Fiecos still in bits. Only difference I'm a leg and arm down, thanks tractor... Cossie 11.1@124mph & 0-60@3.04 - xr2tt 13.6@100mph

11-12-2005, 03:37 PM	#22
Neil S PassionFord Post Troll Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (1) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Cleveland Posts: 2,811 Rep Power: 13	OK, I'm pretty clear with how to get the ECU voltage up now thanks to Dingy Whilst checking the rest of the lives, I found this: This is the wiring to the 3 ABS relays, they supply the ABS valve block! Must have been done before I got the car Another job!! Neil. __________________

11-12-2005, 04:22 PM	#24
DazC 10K+ Poster!! Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (1) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Lancashire Posts: 12,737 Rep Power: 23	Battery Adder!? Is that an electric snake or something? __________________ Air to air injectors for sale. See here.

11-12-2005, 04:29 PM	#25
GARETH T Professional Waffler Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: May 2003 Location: barry-south wales Posts: 30,936 Rep Power: 41	DazC __________________ Sadly don't drive anything worth showing here!

12-12-2005, 07:22 AM	#27
Neil S PassionFord Post Troll Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (1) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Cleveland Posts: 2,811 Rep Power: 13	Cool - Cheers Gareth Neil. __________________

12-12-2005, 09:01 AM	#29
Neil S PassionFord Post Troll Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (1) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Cleveland Posts: 2,811 Rep Power: 13	Not mega then? Neil. __________________

12-12-2005, 09:24 AM	#31
GARETH T Professional Waffler Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: May 2003 Location: barry-south wales Posts: 30,936 Rep Power: 41	edited cos im a dick __________________ Sadly don't drive anything worth showing here!

12-12-2005, 03:51 PM	#32
Neil S PassionFord Post Troll Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (1) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Cleveland Posts: 2,811 Rep Power: 13	Edit it back cos now I look like the penis! 'We extend the injector duration by 500 mega seconds per volt, or 953 years, whichever is sooner' Seriously though, just messing I always enjoy reading the techy stuff Neil. __________________

12-12-2005, 10:38 PM	#33
GARETH T Professional Waffler Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: May 2003 Location: barry-south wales Posts: 30,936 Rep Power: 41	i cant believe i wrote M for milli,,, what a cock,, only done electronics for 12 years __________________ Sadly don't drive anything worth showing here!

16-12-2005, 05:18 PM	#34
Neil S PassionFord Post Troll Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (1) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Cleveland Posts: 2,811 Rep Power: 13	OK, I've replaced the fusible links and now have 13V at the ECU. Battery Voltage is around 13.2V, so it's a bit better now What should the alternator output be ideally? Mine is 14V, sometimes just under. Cheers! Neil. __________________

16-12-2005, 05:29 PM	#35
Fiecos Dan PassionFord Post Whore!! Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: S/E Kent, Thanet Posts: 4,770 Rep Power: 14	i believe 13.8 - 14.0 @ any rev's over idle, and even with all lights & heater on. __________________ 07 Yamaha R1 race bike, and Fiecos still in bits. Only difference I'm a leg and arm down, thanks tractor... Cossie 11.1@124mph & 0-60@3.04 - xr2tt 13.6@100mph

08-01-2006, 05:53 PM	#36
trevCOSS Advanced PassionFord User Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (6) Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: plymouth Posts: 2,357 Rep Power: 12	neil I have exactly the same reading as you did to start with! exept if i load the electrics i see about a 2v drop in all readings, did your fuseable links look dead mine look ok but i still suspect they may be to blame, what did you replace them with? __________________ My Cossie Fat people love Cake

08-01-2006, 06:05 PM	#37
SapphyMike PassionFord Post Whore!! Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Sheffield Posts: 9,085 Rep Power: 20	is it worth replacing my links to my battery while i have no engine in place? LOL

08-01-2006, 06:35 PM	#38
pee vee PassionFord Post Whore!! Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Wiltshire, Bath, chippenham area! Posts: 7,347 Rep Power: 16	So these 'fuseable link tales' are 2 wires coming off the battery to the fuse box?? sorry just adding things to my list of checks for my car over the winter!! __________________ Focus RS number 1215.

08-01-2006, 08:06 PM	#39
SapphyMike PassionFord Post Whore!! Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: May 2003 Location: Sheffield Posts: 9,085 Rep Power: 20	bump

08-01-2006, 10:06 PM	#40
Fiecos Dan PassionFord Post Whore!! Garage is empty, add now Trader Score: (0) Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: S/E Kent, Thanet Posts: 4,770 Rep Power: 14	Well check voltage drop. i test voltage at alternator (usually 0.2 volt higher than battery battery,ecu feed and outputs, fuel pump, inj. (all these about the same with in 0.1 volt, except fuel pump wen connected) if you get low readings on something, put a better + and earth to it. __________________ 07 Yamaha R1 race bike, and Fiecos still in bits. Only difference I'm a leg and arm down, thanks tractor... Cossie 11.1@124mph & 0-60@3.04 - xr2tt 13.6@100mph

08-01-2006, 10:06 PM
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