Cossie guys running efr turbos and rwd...
#1
Advanced PassionFord User
Thread Starter
Cossie guys running efr turbos and rwd...
Question for those of you guys that are running efr turbos in rwd cossie's...
With the super quick spool up and initial huge increase in torque low down in the rev range how do you find traction?
Any better or worse than on previous T/GT series turbos?
Cheers Paul
With the super quick spool up and initial huge increase in torque low down in the rev range how do you find traction?
Any better or worse than on previous T/GT series turbos?
Cheers Paul
#2
10K+ Poster!!
My 205 was bonkers in 2wd mode on acskyline box, the tyres were not great but it spun up in 4th under full throttle, I suspect new tyres and a 6 degree beam would have been very different
#4
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Mark
#6
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The S200 is a great turbo but the efr 7670 will always outspool it out response it and out power it. It's not like going from a Gt to a s series turbo.
I actually think I may have a 2lt evo graph which does compare I will have to try and find it but it was over 5years ago.
Mark
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lee2cossies (21-10-2016)
#10
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Do you mean by progressively accelerating as in to be careful that traction is maintained?
I would of thought that a huge early on power rise so quickly would be worse for traction?
Cheers Paul
#11
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You don't get a sudden spike of power/ torque / boost so traction is better on the efr. Think of it like stamping on the throttle compared to feeding in the power quickly but more progressively
#12
Advanced PassionFord User
Thread Starter
So on a rwd big power car traction will def be better than with other turbos?
I still don't quite understand how though....
Someone must have a rwd car that's been recently converted?
Cheers Paul
I still don't quite understand how though....
Someone must have a rwd car that's been recently converted?
Cheers Paul
#13
cossie fan (unluckerly)
The way I'm reading what there saying is yes there's a large jump in power and torque. But it's not like an on off switch you can more accurately control the amount of power and torque you make and put down with the throttle?
Last edited by ajamesc; 22-10-2016 at 12:20 PM.
#14
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Tyres grip and slip like most things, if you want to remove something from a surface then a shock like a bash (shock loading) will make it come off more easily that just a constant force as it overcomes the inertia.
The way an old Skool turbo comes in is nothing then boom and that shock ungrips or unsettles the car. With an efr it comes in much earlier and more progressively, you get more power and torque throughout the rev range but without the big globs all at once.
Big turbos can sometimes help grip as the power comes in once the car is already rolling.
My car was converted this year and I had it 2w and 4wd switchable on the skyline box.
If you look at a modern twin scroll turbo BMW, (I had 2 twin scrolls) they are torque limited (held back on the maps) in 1st and second as they just produce too much power for the grip available.
The way an old Skool turbo comes in is nothing then boom and that shock ungrips or unsettles the car. With an efr it comes in much earlier and more progressively, you get more power and torque throughout the rev range but without the big globs all at once.
Big turbos can sometimes help grip as the power comes in once the car is already rolling.
My car was converted this year and I had it 2w and 4wd switchable on the skyline box.
If you look at a modern twin scroll turbo BMW, (I had 2 twin scrolls) they are torque limited (held back on the maps) in 1st and second as they just produce too much power for the grip available.
#15
Just because something can make boost early....doesnt mean you have to have that happen all the time.
The joys of boost control.
But if you've a laggy turbo....you aint gona make it spool up significantly faster via boost control.
The joys of boost control.
But if you've a laggy turbo....you aint gona make it spool up significantly faster via boost control.
#16
Advanced PassionFord User
Thread Starter
Why more so with an efr turbo than any other?
Cheers Paul
#17
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Thread Starter
Tyres grip and slip like most things, if you want to remove something from a surface then a shock like a bash (shock loading) will make it come off more easily that just a constant force as it overcomes the inertia.
The way an old Skool turbo comes in is nothing then boom and that shock ungrips or unsettles the car. With an efr it comes in much earlier and more progressively, you get more power and torque throughout the rev range but without the big globs all at once.
Big turbos can sometimes help grip as the power comes in once the car is already rolling.
My car was converted this year and I had it 2w and 4wd switchable on the skyline box.
If you look at a modern twin scroll turbo BMW, (I had 2 twin scrolls) they are torque limited (held back on the maps) in 1st and second as they just produce too much power for the grip available.
The way an old Skool turbo comes in is nothing then boom and that shock ungrips or unsettles the car. With an efr it comes in much earlier and more progressively, you get more power and torque throughout the rev range but without the big globs all at once.
Big turbos can sometimes help grip as the power comes in once the car is already rolling.
My car was converted this year and I had it 2w and 4wd switchable on the skyline box.
If you look at a modern twin scroll turbo BMW, (I had 2 twin scrolls) they are torque limited (held back on the maps) in 1st and second as they just produce too much power for the grip available.
Cheers Paul
#18
10K+ Poster!!
That just depends on who maps it, lots more is available lower down, just depends on how soon they ramp it up....the main thing is that you are not waiting for it to come to life all of a sudden, it is just building all the way from nowt.
#19
Happily retired
Running long gearing on mine helps with grip. I simply don't appear to have the probs most have with half the Power. However you need the Power to pull such gearing. I have a very tall 1st gear as well to increase Torque capacity of the box. Add- Proper Rear beam, Jag diff-loc, chassis connectors & decent coilovers with twin springs to stop squat + 235 wide 888's & you have grip even with 800+bhp & a GT42. You guys only seem to concentrate on the engine. Its a fast car you need not a fast engine they don't always go together.
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turbotrev (22-10-2016)
#20
Too many posts.. I need a life!!
Si
#21
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Running long gearing on mine helps with grip. I simply don't appear to have the probs most have with half the Power. However you need the Power to pull such gearing. I have a very tall 1st gear as well to increase Torque capacity of the box. Add- Proper Rear beam, Jag diff-loc, chassis connectors & decent coilovers with twin springs to stop squat + 235 wide 888's & you have grip even with 800+bhp & a GT42. You guys only seem to concentrate on the engine. Its a fast car you need not a fast engine they don't always go together.
Out of interest what ratio diff do you have Rod?
Ever thought of getting a custom sequential box done Rod?
Cheers Paul
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#24
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Have any of these customers mentioned traction being better/worse than in previous turbo setups?
Do you spec the suspension, transmission, etc or these cars as well?
Still waiting for my pal to pull his finger out and get his car done and mapped by you etc so he can take me for a spin in it, prob won't be till next year now though
Cheers Paul
Do you spec the suspension, transmission, etc or these cars as well?
Still waiting for my pal to pull his finger out and get his car done and mapped by you etc so he can take me for a spin in it, prob won't be till next year now though
Cheers Paul
#25
PassionFord Post Whore!!
Have any of these customers mentioned traction being better/worse than in previous turbo setups?
Do you spec the suspension, transmission, etc or these cars as well?
Still waiting for my pal to pull his finger out and get his car done and mapped by you etc so he can take me for a spin in it, prob won't be till next year now though
Cheers Paul
Do you spec the suspension, transmission, etc or these cars as well?
Still waiting for my pal to pull his finger out and get his car done and mapped by you etc so he can take me for a spin in it, prob won't be till next year now though
Cheers Paul
Mark
#27
Advanced PassionFord User
Thread Starter
I could be converted.....
But I was genuinely interested in traction issues
Cheers Paul
#28
10K+ Poster!!
Tyres have a massive impact and also I think a lot of riffs would benefit from a refresh as don't lock as well as they should. The beam and shocks are also very important for traction.
The only consideration with an get is if you can afford the turbo, manifold, downpope, injectors to suit and the mapping, if all are YES then accept no substitutes
The only consideration with an get is if you can afford the turbo, manifold, downpope, injectors to suit and the mapping, if all are YES then accept no substitutes
#29
Part of the Furniture
iTrader: (1)
Mark recently mapped my 2wd with EFR 8374.. it has very good driveability on max boost setting 2.4bar
OK is has wheelspin in 1st when you floor it from rolling start, but after changing to second gear the wheelspin is disappearing with no wheelspin from there.
The driveline is Tremec TKO600 gearbox with Ford motorsport 9" inch diff 3.6 ratio 520Nm tarmac and 235/40/17" Toyo R888's tyres.
Rear beam is a 6 degree one which has been set to 1 degree camber at the rear.. coilovers are Black Art Design ones
OK is has wheelspin in 1st when you floor it from rolling start, but after changing to second gear the wheelspin is disappearing with no wheelspin from there.
The driveline is Tremec TKO600 gearbox with Ford motorsport 9" inch diff 3.6 ratio 520Nm tarmac and 235/40/17" Toyo R888's tyres.
Rear beam is a 6 degree one which has been set to 1 degree camber at the rear.. coilovers are Black Art Design ones
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turbotrev (24-10-2016)
#30
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Mark recently mapped my 2wd with EFR 8374.. it has very good driveability on max boost setting 2.4bar
OK is has wheelspin in 1st when you floor it from rolling start, but after changing to second gear the wheelspin is disappearing with no wheelspin from there.
The driveline is Tremec TKO600 gearbox with Ford motorsport 9" inch diff 3.6 ratio 520Nm tarmac and 235/40/17" Toyo R888's tyres.
Rear beam is a 6 degree one which has been set to 1 degree camber at the rear.. coilovers are Black Art Design ones
OK is has wheelspin in 1st when you floor it from rolling start, but after changing to second gear the wheelspin is disappearing with no wheelspin from there.
The driveline is Tremec TKO600 gearbox with Ford motorsport 9" inch diff 3.6 ratio 520Nm tarmac and 235/40/17" Toyo R888's tyres.
Rear beam is a 6 degree one which has been set to 1 degree camber at the rear.. coilovers are Black Art Design ones
The following users liked this post:
turbotrev (24-10-2016)
#31
Advanced PassionFord User
Thread Starter
#32
Too many posts.. I need a life!!
Mark recently mapped my 2wd with EFR 8374.. it has very good driveability on max boost setting 2.4bar
OK is has wheelspin in 1st when you floor it from rolling start, but after changing to second gear the wheelspin is disappearing with no wheelspin from there.
The driveline is Tremec TKO600 gearbox with Ford motorsport 9" inch diff 3.6 ratio 520Nm tarmac and 235/40/17" Toyo R888's tyres.
Rear beam is a 6 degree one which has been set to 1 degree camber at the rear.. coilovers are Black Art Design ones
OK is has wheelspin in 1st when you floor it from rolling start, but after changing to second gear the wheelspin is disappearing with no wheelspin from there.
The driveline is Tremec TKO600 gearbox with Ford motorsport 9" inch diff 3.6 ratio 520Nm tarmac and 235/40/17" Toyo R888's tyres.
Rear beam is a 6 degree one which has been set to 1 degree camber at the rear.. coilovers are Black Art Design ones
Do you have a RR graph
Cheers si