Aircon issue, windows fogging up?

[slammedorion]

On my02 focus estate? I always run my cars with the aircon/ climate control on. Never had a issue until I got this focus. If you don't clean the inside of the windows every week it looks awful. I have no leaks, no wet footwell, aircon drain works, I have replaced pollen filter and seal. Once it starts to fog/ film up it won't clear with blowers or heated screens. Only way I can describe it is like the film you'd see inside a car thats smoked in. Could it be the aircon wants servicing/ cleaning? It's icey cold. It's starting to bug me!

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[matts1]

You used to be able to get a canister of stuff you let off in the car and leave the air con running for 10 minutes that cleaned the stystem, may be worth a try.

[slammedorion]

I'd rather have it serviced properly if people think it's my issue?
Anyone?

[foreigneRS]

doesn't make sense. if the a/c is working it dehumidifies the air it blows

[slammedorion]

Hence post. Any ideas?

[pee vee]

Originally Posted by foreigneRS

doesn't make sense. if the a/c is working it dehumidifies the air it blows

Does seem odd!


The other thing I'd check is the obvious one, that it's actually being blown at the screen!?

[DazC]

Are you sure it's not a slight heater matrix leak? Antifreeze won't be removed by the aircon as easily as moisture will and will leave an oily film on the screen.

[focusv8]

Is it all windows?

Have you had the A/c topped up since you've had the car?

Maybe a minute leak in the A/C coil in the heater and you're getting oil from the A/c system getting out.

[RichieST]

I had the same issue with my old 2 focus's. It would work fine, but then when you go back to the car and start it up with air con on again, it would mist all the windows up really heavily and take forever to clear.

Best solution I found was to switch the air con off about 5 minutes before the end of your journey to let the pipes etc come back up to normal air temperature before switching off, this would stop it misting up again next time. Could be something to do with condensation forming in the icy cold air ducts when the car is sitting which then is blown out over the windows when the car is re-started.

[Cossie Sean]

focus leak water in via n/s scuttle trim into heater box via polen filter, probebly the cause, the trims are ment to be sealed to the windscreen

[slammedorion]

Originally Posted by pee vee

Does seem odd!


The other thing I'd check is the obvious one, that it's actually being blown at the screen!?

It's fogging all the windows in the car.

[slammedorion]

Originally Posted by focusv8

Is it all windows?

Have you had the A/c topped up since you've had the car?

Maybe a minute leak in the A/C coil in the heater and you're getting oil from the A/c system getting out.

No.
This would make more sence as said this film on the windows won't clear with heated screens on.

[slammedorion]

Originally Posted by DazC

Are you sure it's not a slight heater matrix leak? Antifreeze won't be removed by the aircon as easily as moisture will and will leave an oily film on the screen.

Maybe but I'm not seeing a drop in coolant level?
There's no smell of anti freeze or water in the car.

The other week I did a 200 mile run in it, parked it up for the day fine in the am, come back to if 5-6 hours later with the front windows fogged/ hazed up.

[RichieST]

Originally Posted by slammedorion

Maybe but I'm not seeing a drop in coolant level?
There's no smell of anti freeze or water in the car.

The other week I did a 200 mile run in it, parked it up for the day fine in the am, come back to if 5-6 hours later with the front windows fogged/ hazed up.

Try what i suggested above...

[foreigneRS]

Originally Posted by RichieST

I had the same issue with my old 2 focus's. It would work fine, but then when you go back to the car and start it up with air con on again, it would mist all the windows up really heavily and take forever to clear.

Best solution I found was to switch the air con off about 5 minutes before the end of your journey to let the pipes etc come back up to normal air temperature before switching off, this would stop it misting up again next time. Could be something to do with condensation forming in the icy cold air ducts when the car is sitting which then is blown out over the windows when the car is re-started.

that can happen

[Glenn_]

Lol our focus does this.

Sometimes my cossie does it too.It used to have air con.

The way i can describe it is as if the steam is in the actual windscreen itself.My old K reg sierra hatch back never did it.


We had an 11 reg polo courtesy car that also did this.That was really bad though.

[Brendan]

This happend to me a long time ago, It was a pin hole in the heating matrix so your A/C blows nice hot but water laden air into the car, this then condeses out on the cold(er) windows!

If you can, presure test your heater matrix! To do this bung one side up, conect the other side to a compressed air suply, and put the matrix under water with washing up liquid in it! then check for bubbles!

good luck!

[2star]

My SEAT does this.

Thought it was just dirty windows (all of them inside) so cleaned them and they were that grimey i had to use soapy water to de-grease them.

The moment i put the blowers on, the aircon or it rains it just fogs up inside and the greasy filmy type layer on the windows returns, it does clear itself, but when you touch the windows again or put them up and down, it leaves smear marks !

[Brendan]

The cooling fluid in your car is not pure water!! It has glycerin glycol antifreeze and other things in it like rust / corrosion inhibitors! These can leave grime on you windows, car interior and lungs.....

[slammedorion]

Originally Posted by Brendan

This happend to me a long time ago, It was a pin hole in the heating matrix so your A/C blows nice hot but water laden air into the car, this then condeses out on the cold(er) windows!

If you can, presure test your heater matrix! To do this bung one side up, conect the other side to a compressed air suply, and put the matrix under water with washing up liquid in it! then check for bubbles!

good luck!

Just a update. I decided to go with the above theory of a slight pinhole in the heater matrix as noticed the water level had dropped by a couple of mm since owning it.
The fix 1 bottle of BARSLEAK. Within a couple of days use noticed the difference, a week on and it seems perfect.
Ideally want some decent weather again as it seemed worse in the warm weather with the a/c on cold.
But fingers crossed its sorted.

[Brendan]

spot on!

[slammedorion]

Cheers

[Glenn_]

Will be interested to see if you have cured it.

[slammedorion]

Misses has had the car today. She's come back from work in it with ac on icey cold and the front screen has fogged up again.
So problem hasn't gone yet.
Carpets are still bone dry, I have no coolant losses.
Deffo now seems a ac issue when on cold.
Any ideas?

[slammedorion]

Where's the aircon drain?
Might try clearing it through, also trying it without ac on for abit to see if it clears.
Only seems a issue when ac is on cold, only fogs up when parked up and won't clear without using glass cleaner.

[slammedorion]

I've run it for a few days without ac on and it's still fogging up.
It's been left on a sunny car park all day and the misses has come back to it all fogged up.

Maybe something or nothing.
But the clutch pedals got a slight fluid leak on it.
Clutch fluid wouldn't be causing this would it?
I don't think so but don't wanna rule anything out just yet.

[Cossie Sean]

so have you checked the windscreen trims, this leads to the pollen filter, then heaterbox like i said in one of the first posts?

clutch fluid would cause this if it was leaking about half a litre a day, but im guessing it dont do this

[slammedorion]

Originally Posted by Cossie Sean

so have you checked the windscreen trims, this leads to the pollen filter, then heaterbox like i said in one of the first posts?

clutch fluid would cause this if it was leaking about half a litre a day, but im guessing it dont do this

Pollen filter was replaced along with new seal and is fine.
No leaks.
Just loosing alittle clutch fluid which is only dripping onto the rubber floor mat. I've got replacement yet to fit.
???

[Farmer Giles]

Is the car still damp inside from a previous leak ?

Might be worth getting all the carpets out on a sunny day and dry it all out. Bit of a ball ache but at least you'll know it's properly dry inside.

2p

[Brendan]

Sorry been away on holls for a bit! Even if the aircon is switched off the heating matrix can still cause you problems. This is because on cars with A/C there are 2 matrix's! the first one that the air flows through is the cooling one, this is cooled by the A/C compressor if it is switched on. This system contains Aircon Gas (R134a). If this one is leaking your A/C will not cool and you might get a warning light or fault code in the ECU. This matrix also DRY's the air as it cools it as the water in the air condenses out on the Very cold matrix, then should run out of a small pipe onto the ground under the car somewhere.

This means in wet conditions you can then use the second matrix (the heater one) to reheat the now dry air before it come into the car so you can de mist the car and dry you self out if it is raining! If this matrix has a leak it will put a fine mist of water into the air as it get its heat from the water cooling system of the engine (weather the thermostat is open or closed). This then undoes all of the drying the a/c does to the air and makes it humid, so fogging up your windows.

As I also mentioned earlier it is not controlled by the engine thermostat like the radiator is but is always on so a pig to test. IF you can try squeezing the pipes to the heater matrix to stop the flow of hot water to them this could give you a clue,
as some heating systems let the water through this matrix continue even when cold air is selected as they divert air through an alternate path to the inside of the car, (my old one does this 1992) so it can still affect you even if you turn off the A/C and select cold!


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[slammedorion]

Ac is nice and cold.

I've done abit of a DIY test with some brake fluid in a pot, and a big glass bowl over the pot of brake fluid and left it in the sunshine all day.
Come back to it this evening with the glass bowl all fogged up.

Gonna get this clutch fluid leak sorted and see if things change.

[Brendan]

I need to talk to my best man..... he is a research chemist... he is back in the UK this weekend.

[slammedorion]

Just a quick pic of what I'm left with within 24hours of cleaning this windows inside.






You should be able to see where I've wiped my finger down the window to give you a idea of the visibility issue.
It's a case of cleaning ever window inside once a day or not seeing!

[slammedorion]

Warmer weathers back and so are my foggy windows.
I've changed pollen filter & seal. Regassed aircon, had interior wet vac'd, changed leaky clutch master cylinder and it's still doing it!

[slammedorion]

Pics.


Windows were minted up last night.











Doesn't fog up while being driven, seems to happen when parked up in the sun?
Help me, someone must have had this issue.

[markk]

you have defo got a leak, just feeling the carpets is rarely enough to confirm/deny water/fluid ingress, you need to strip the car and test is properly

[xr4x4rs]

if you only have a slight leak the carpet wont be wet, but the bottom of the sound proofing underneath will be

when my car was warm the windows misted up very quickly, couldnt find a leak anywhere, lifted carpets up and found it was damp, heater matrix had sprung a tiny leak causing the misting up

so check behind your dash, dont know where it is on the focus im afraid, but its worth lifting carpets at bulkhead and searching, as when heater matrix doe go 98% they leak into the car

[slammedorion]

Originally Posted by markk

you have defo got a leak, just feeling the carpets is rarely enough to confirm/deny water/fluid ingress, you need to strip the car and test is properly

Carpets are bone dry.
Windows have to be polished to get the fog off?
It seams to be worse when the weather warms up, as it fogs up when parked up?
Ie today all ns windows and rear screen were fogged up as these have been in direct sunlight most of the day.
The os was parked up against a wall, these windows plus front screen were fine.

[markk]

I still say you have a leak, Ive dealt with more water ingress vehicles than care to remember, yours does sound like a small coolant leak, forget feling the carpets mate, there a 30mm gap min below them on most cars to begin with.

[slammedorion]

Someone's just posted this on ffoc.


Taken from TSB No. 24/1999 13.04.2000

Should a customer express concern about poor interior ventilation and misting of windshield, door windows and rear window, the probable cause is insufficient forced air extraction in the area of the rear bumper, combined with insufficient blower motor power. To rectify this concern, install a modified cover on the forced air extractors, remove part of the bumper padding to improve the air flow rate and install a modified blower motor resistor.

Note:
After reworking the vehicle as described in this bulletin, make sure that the customer is fully conversant with the operation of the temperature and air distribution controls, as described in the Owner's Guide.


Parts Required:
Forced air extraction cover (two off) ..4043548 NOW 1573138 @ £6.48 Each plus vat
Blower motor resistor ......................1110969 NOW 1311115 @ £16.63 plus vat


Anyone heard or know of this issue?