Supermarket fuel - Is this true?

[Ellie]

hmmmm. Whatever im driving past/closest/most convenient for me, whici is usually Sainsburys. Im going to experiment now because Ive noticed recently im not even getting 250miles from a tank of fuel. Next few times i fill up ill got to a Shell and see if there is any improvement.

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[plynchy]

I work on fuel depots all over the country, i've seen every brand of tanker loading at every one i've worked at.

There are loads ofdifferent additives that go into the individual tankers depending on what the customer requirements are, these are very tightly controlled as they cost ££££'s.

As for the base fuel, I know of several places that blend butane/ethanol with unleaded to bring the octane level up, as the base fuel is basically off spec that is cheaper than full spec to buy. This goes to the same massive storage tanks that all the tankers draw from.

Diesel is only going to get worse IMO, don't get me wrong, it's cleaner than it's ever been, but the bio % of it is going to increase (5% currently) and the stuff used as a bio additive is corrosive and doesn't like pump seals etc (remember the 330d on the Top Gear 24hr race?), thats why most of your modern diesel cars state "do not use biodiesel" in the filler cap etc.

Lots of bollox spouted about fuel supplies, I don't know the answers myself, but if your car runs fine on what you're using, then carry on.

I've ran 2 Porkers, FRS and the Cossie on Tesco's 99, V-Power etc with no issues at all.

[clarke5700]

Originally Posted by Chip

Dont start thinking that mechanics have the first fucking clue about cars, that was your first mistake, they are just fitters!


FPMSL @ "reject fuel"

not all of us

[**caz**]

im gonna sound really thick now but...the term pinking....can someone explain what this and what the car would be doing if it was "pinking"

x

[jammerrs]

as i beleive pinking means, the fuel and air ignite before the spark plugs gives it a spark.

it does this because the fuel cant take the heat, the higher the RON the lesss likely to

a simple guide but think its right

[jemis]

use tesco's 99 in my cars with no probs as its the nearest to me if out and about I put v power or ultimate only in the cossie

[jammerrs]

Originally Posted by S1 JOHN S1

Dojj i know u said most circumstance's but,

Doesn't matter weather the car be mapped or not,

Look at the trial's with 5th gear,

I can't remember exactly but power gain's got stronger with the subaru in question i mean alot aswell just by the fuel used,It didn't need a re map to run better

I know they have what u would call self learning ecu's which adapt like but still i am sure it was a 25hp hike by the end of it Pretty good for just fuel

i watched that but they had to almost 'restart' the ECU to get it to use the fuel its best

subarus also work on whatever fuel they are given but if from new they have had 99 RON then they are given 95 then 99 again the map is still based on using 95 RON no matter how many times 99 is reused

Originally Posted by jammerrs

i watched that but they had to almost 'restart' the ECU to get it to use the fuel its best

subarus also work on whatever fuel they are given but if from new they have had 99 RON then they are given 95 then 99 again the map is still based on using 95 RON no matter how many times 99 is reused

Yeah self learning ECUs to a degree mate but still quite a difference don't ya think .

Show's the fuel does give more power and must be better for ya engine

[**caz**]

Originally Posted by jammerrs

as i beleive pinking means, the fuel and air ignite before the spark plugs gives it a spark.

it does this because the fuel cant take the heat, the higher the RON the lesss likely to

a simple guide but think its right

ok but what are the symptoms...how will i know if my car is "pinking" lol

x

Originally Posted by **caz**

ok but what are the symptoms...how will i know if my car is "pinking" lol

x

It won't usually turbo's (car's) that are affected by pinking knocking detanation

[**caz**]

then it dont matter what fuel i use

x

[jhot80]

I heard from bloke that teachs motorsport engineering at a uni. that the best fuels are tesco 99 and bp.

[orionmojo]

I've heard through the grapevine that asda fuel is shit too. I dont know how much truth there is in ti though.

Surely there must be a reason its 6-8p cheaper per litre than anywhere else?

Mine turbo always gets optimax / ultimate whatever the higner ron is anyway, as thats what it was mapped on, it runs better on it full stop. the daily gets the scrapyards' best at £15 a drum. i've had a few missfires and hiccups but nothing major.

[Ade]

I use bloody tons of fuel so I just buy it anywhere when I'm running low

I've also seen BP tankers unloading fuel in Sainsbury's forecourts a couple of times too!
Can't image there's any difference other than the odd additive.... and I doubt that any but the most highly tuned cars would ever notice the difference either....

[tsutton]

My local Waitrose's petrol station always have BP tanker delivering the fuel. And it's cheaper than the local BP's petrol station!

Originally Posted by tsutton

My local Waitrose's petrol station always have BP tanker delivering the fuel. And it's cheaper than the local BP's petrol station!

Just a theory,

Could it be possible they didn't have there tanker's or they broke down on route so in place they ask another garage to deliver in place,Like a back up plan of such???

Sorry just a thought

[tsutton]

Originally Posted by S1 JOHN S1

Just a theory,

Could it be possible they didn't have there tanker's or they broke down on route so in place they ask another garage to deliver in place,Like a back up plan of such???

Sorry just a thought

It's always the BP tanker everytime I see it. So either they don't have their own tanker for my area or paying BP to deliver the fuel.

[wirralphil]

Originally Posted by orionmojo

I've heard through the grapevine that asda fuel is shit too. I dont know how much truth there is in ti though.

Surely there must be a reason its 6-8p cheaper per litre than anywhere else?

Mine turbo always gets optimax / ultimate whatever the higner ron is anyway, as thats what it was mapped on, it runs better on it full stop. the daily gets the scrapyards' best at £15 a drum. i've had a few missfires and hiccups but nothing major.

Shell supply Asda, just less addative.

Originally Posted by Ade

I use bloody tons of fuel so I just buy it anywhere when I'm running low

I've also seen BP tankers unloading fuel in Sainsbury's forecourts a couple of times too!
Can't image there's any difference other than the odd additive.... and I doubt that any but the most highly tuned cars would ever notice the difference either....

The differance between the 2 is the addative, from what i have been told for a 200litre drum it's a fair few quid, this is added when the driver fills the tanker.

Originally Posted by tsutton

My local Waitrose's petrol station always have BP tanker delivering the fuel. And it's cheaper than the local BP's petrol station!

As above it's down to the addative. If BP put the same in everyone else's fuel then they would lose out.

Originally Posted by S1 JOHN S1

Just a theory,

Could it be possible they didn't have there tanker's or they broke down on route so in place they ask another garage to deliver in place,Like a back up plan of such???

Sorry just a thought

No they supply Sainsbury's amongst other garages. Our local refinary are low from what the delivery driver has said, he has to load up diesel in one place and get Petrol from another.

Originally Posted by tsutton

It's always the BP tanker everytime I see it. So either they don't have their own tanker for my area or paying BP to deliver the fuel.

As above.

I'd pay the extra for BP, Shell branded fuels for the simple fact of the addative.

All this 'watered down' talk is shit, it's more than likley the petrol station has a leak in the tank and is letting some water in. After all they are only steel tanks with an outer jacket with a water level in.

[mcst]

I only use Shell, in my little market town we only have one garage - Shell, i pass 2 other Shells every day though so its no issue to me.
I used to only use V power but now just supplement normal with it every few fill ups.
I never let it get below 1/4 tank either if i can help it.

I've always understood it that supermarket fuels are generally of poorer quality than the branded stuff.

The odd times i've had no choice on garage i've never had a problem with Morrisons fuel but BP makes mine run like shit. I've even tried Ultimate and its hesitant and sluggish, feels like its choking up. Topped up with shell and then next fill up with Vpower and after a week it was spot on.

[mcst]

Originally Posted by wirralphil

Shell supply Asda, just less addative.



The differance between the 2 is the addative, from what i have been told for a 200litre drum it's a fair few quid, this is added when the driver fills the tanker.



As above it's down to the addative. If BP put the same in everyone else's fuel then they would lose out.



No they supply Sainsbury's amongst other garages. Our local refinary are low from what the delivery driver has said, he has to load up diesel in one place and get Petrol from another.



As above.

I'd pay the extra for BP, Shell branded fuels for the simple fact of the addative.

All this 'watered down' talk is shit, it's more than likley the petrol station has a leak in the tank and is letting some water in. After all they are only steel tanks with an outer jacket with a water level in.

All makes sense to me........

[wirralphil]

Also forgot to add, our boss only has maxximum 3000 litre's of BP Ultimate, lowest is around 950 Litre's bearing in mind it's only filled every 2 months goes to show how long fuel can be in their for.

[Chopshop85]

The way I look at is, petrol is petrol. I cant be arsed to drive another 8 miles and pay an extra 20-30p to get v-power everytime I want to fill up! Its all gonna get burned either way.

[focusrrx87]

Originally Posted by S1 JOHN S1

Dojj i know u said most circumstance's but,

Doesn't matter weather the car be mapped or not,

Look at the trial's with 5th gear,

I can't remember exactly but power gain's got stronger with the subaru in question i mean alot aswell just by the fuel used,It didn't need a re map to run better

I know they have what u would call self learning ecu's which adapt like but still i am sure it was a 25hp hike by the end of it Pretty good for just fuel

yeah that scob went from like 235hp to 248hp the torque went from 225nm to 258nm

was really impressive. unless u own a polo. lmao

[Fudgey]

i use either sainsburys or bp in the works wagon, as at 80ood litres a pop, im caining the nectar points

[the youth]

there is some shite on this thread, on the site I have worked on for the last 15 years is a petroplus refinery, we have texaco, tesco and petroplus tankers lined up together getting fed from the same tank and loading arm, so chuck all your theories out the window and get to the supermarket for some cheap fuel!

steve

[plynchy]

Originally Posted by the youth

there is some shite on this thread,

steve

Not till you posted there wasn't...

Originally Posted by plynchy

Not till you posted there wasn't...

LMAO,

Originally Posted by focusrrx87

yeah that scob went from like 235hp to 248hp the torque went from 225nm to 258nm

was really impressive. unless u own a polo. lmao

Exactly mate just on the basis of fuel only .

So that prove's the fact V-Power has to be better for a turbo motor

Stick to V-POWER turbo owner's,That or possibly pinking det issue's,Then that could be your engine just over a few penny's on fuel or a mile out of your way

[alistairolsen]

Originally Posted by S1 JOHN S1

Exactly mate just on the basis of fuel only .

So that prove's the fact V-Power has to be better for a turbo motor

Stick to V-POWER turbo owner's,That or possibly pinking det issue's,Then that could be your engine just over a few penny's on fuel or a mile out of your way

no it doesnt, it proves that an engine mapped for higher octane fuel loses power if you run it on a lower octane fuel due to knock sensing. If you run the fuel it was mapped for then you get the power it was mapped at because the ecu lets you have the full ignition advance.

Octane isnt a magic power booster, it just allows more ignition advance before det. If your engine was mapped on 95 then using 97/98/99 is a total waste of time.

[Greggyboy]

I used to use vpower but got fed up of shell being closed due to no fuel every other week,my mate has a decent powered gt4 and he uses tesco 99ron and says his power fc picks up nothing different on the knock sensor etc to when he used vpower the knock sensor picked up a bit more when he had to put standard tesco n when 99 wasn't available but i dont think it was that bad really i only use 99 now though

Originally Posted by alistairolsen

no it doesnt, it proves that an engine mapped for higher octane fuel loses power if you run it on a lower octane fuel due to knock sensing. If you run the fuel it was mapped for then you get the power it was mapped at because the ecu lets you have the full ignition advance.

Octane isnt a magic power booster, it just allows more ignition advance before det. If your engine was mapped on 95 then using 97/98/99 is a total waste of time.

So ok mate,

We take a scooby and do the 5th gear challenge yet again,

95 shit power and 98+better power simply the fuel has to be better in a way allowing a better bang

Indeed map it on 95 and it wouldn't matter as it would pre set then mate,

Ok let's map the car on 98+ and then run it on 95 would it pink????

[RichieST]

Originally Posted by S1 JOHN S1

Ok let's map the car on 98+ and then run it on 95 would it pink????

No, because the knock sensor would adjust for the lower octane fuel and prevent it from pinking.

Originally Posted by Rich170

No, because the knock sensor would adjust for the lower octane fuel and prevent it from pinking.

Ok so if that's the case how come's some car's pink then??

Why doesn't the knock sensor just take care of it

[alistairolsen]

Originally Posted by S1 JOHN S1

So ok mate,

We take a scooby and do the 5th gear challenge yet again,

95 shit power and 98+better power simply the fuel has to be better in a way allowing a better bang

Indeed map it on 95 and it wouldn't matter as it would pre set then mate,

Ok let's map the car on 98+ and then run it on 95 would it pink????

aaaaargh! what you're trying to tell everyone is that their car will GAIN power by running higher octane fuel. this is utter bollocks.

The example you're quoting is a Subaru losing power when run on 95 because it wasn't mapped for it and then miraculously getting it back again when it's run on the CORRECT fuel

Fuck me it's not a difficult concept!

Originally Posted by alistairolsen

aaaaargh! what you're trying to tell everyone is that their car will GAIN power by running higher octane fuel. this is utter bollocks.

The example you're quoting is a Subaru losing power when run on 95 because it wasn't mapped for it and then miraculously getting it back again when it's run on the CORRECT fuel

Fuck me it's not a difficult concept!

Hmmm,

Sorry to sound dumb then,What about silverstone which sell's there own fuel 105octane aint it? And what about (red) 4 star what octane rating was that

Why bother selling higher rated fuel if it make's no difference as your so saying mate???

Gotta ask

[alistairolsen]

Originally Posted by S1 JOHN S1

Hmmm,

Sorry to sound dumb then,What about silverstone which sell's there own fuel 105octane aint it? And what about (red) 4 star what octane rating was that

Why bother selling higher rated fuel if it make's no difference as your so saying mate???

Gotta ask

For instance rod's saff is mapped on race fuel (commonly 102, 105 or 109 ron depending afaik) as are a lot fo race cars where there isnt a restriction in force for the series. Here very bhp counts and as you say, better fuel = more power because the ignition curve is mapped to suit!

4 star was like super (97) but with lead in it to preserve the shit valve seats everyone used to use.

Originally Posted by alistairolsen

For instance rod's saff is mapped on race fuel (commonly 102, 105 or 109 ron depending afaik) as are a lot fo race cars where there isnt a restriction in force for the series. Here very bhp counts and as you say, better fuel = more power because the ignition curve is mapped to suit!

4 star was like super (97) but with lead in it to preserve the shit valve seats everyone used to use.

Ok mate

So if i take my cossie and map it on 109 octane and then go back and map it on 95octane,There would be no difference in HP then????

Gotta ask lol.

[AlexF]

To supply all the fuel in the UK there are several refineries. Each one of these is owned by an oil company. So for example Shell own the Shell Haven refinery in Essex. All the local BP stations will be filled at the Shell refinery.

The reason for this is that the base petrol is regulated very tightly and so is the same regardless of refinery. It’s the additive pack that changes from company to company.

Exceptions to this include Optimax (Shell might have changed this, but when launched this information was correct). This is(was) made at one refinery and then shipped out to all stores across the country.

Supermarket Fuel

Fuels destined for any supermarket is the same base fuel as any other petrol station. The reasons it is cheaper is that it will contain a cheaper additive pack and the fact that a supermarket buys its fuel in bulk!

Typically the fuel will not perform as well as a oil companies own brand, but like most things you get what you pay for!

[M7 COS]

Thanks for all the replies guys, this has actually turned into a pretty interesting thread with some good points and discussions.

I'll tell my mate that he's not killing his ST and that the mechanic that worked on his car is obviously a bit of a plum!

CheeRS

[alistairolsen]

Originally Posted by S1 JOHN S1

Ok mate

So if i take my cossie and map it on 109 octane and then go back and map it on 95octane,There would be no difference in HP then????

Gotta ask lol.

There would be a huge difference in power.

If you mapped it on 95 and then randomly filled the tank with 109 it would make piss all difference in just the same way as filling a car mapped on 95 with v power will only give you a placebo effect