r504490

Hi All

does anyone know where or how to check a boreham motorsport chassis number

I have purchsed the car and it comes with a receipt form malcolm wilson for the shell.. suppose to have had Carlos Saints names on the window when the shell was collected, just need to find some history reg is not with the car

Russell

Mad Matt

iTrader: (2)

Any pictures mate ? I guess its a 3dr, but more details would be welcome. Do you have the registration plate number ? Cozzfather might help you too heh

r504490

Cheers Matt. yes it is a 3 door I will get some pictures of it and post and give cozzfather a shout cheers

r504490

few pics
http://s497.photobucket.com/albums/rr339/r504490/

AndyPen

iTrader: (24)

The only place on my mates car is on the plate on the front of the slam panel. It only indicates that it is a motorsport shell, there is no seperate id / chassis number other than the one carried over from the original vehicle. Mind you this is an escos not a 3dr.

AndyPen

iTrader: (24)

btw looks like a great car!!

r504490

It has the boreham motorsport Id (not just motorsport), i just need to trace the history

cozzfather

iTrader: (1)

well calling malcolm wilson aka M-SPORT and asking for info may help for a start, first thing i would check is if the car has ever been lhd, as carlos did rally a 3dr cosworth and it was a left hooker, iirc mike taylor developments or mike little preparations, i'm more thinking mike taylor prepared the car, carlos was sponsored by malboro ciggaretts and won the spanish rally championship, all the best teams got parts from boreham chucked them in a van and took them back and fitted them up.

i have 2 mates who worked for both mlp and mtd doing 3dr's and 4dr sierra cosworths they worked on red's stuff too for some of the biggest names in british rallying.

if the car has no logbook v5 then it could possibly be a spare shell as top rally teams bitd always had 2 or 3 shells ready to be built up into a car in the event of accidents.

my mate slipped up on a ex russell brooks sierra cosworth that was a pukka andrews heat for hire car he helped build bitd when the car was sold the spare shell went to a north wales driver who put the car on a a reg sierra v5 and built it back up.
the shell was boreham factory specification group a, this is one reason why there is so many rally shells with no id's, yours could be one.
if it has a v5 i would do the dvla check and you will glean loads.
best of luck

PAUL S

iTrader: (8)

One way would be to do a colour scrape back to bare metal on a place that would not have been replaced due to accident damage, say the roof, that will identify its original colours then do an entry list search on google for any of the events that the scrutineer tags shown for 87/88 relate to, this should then narrow it down to only a handful of boreham 3drs, then do a detailed google search on those cars.

good luck, I am doing the same at the moment on a race car I own.

cozzfather

iTrader: (1)

good idea but, my mate who still works for rally engineering development R-E-D, preparing focus wrc bodyshells for M-SPORT regularly had sandblasted shells in for paintjobs.
you won't find anything if its been sandblasted, if its never been lhd and it usually says on the shell id it won't have had carlos in it unless someone gave him a lift.
carlos only drove lhd's.

stevecossy

It looks lhd to me in the photos.
Good luck with the search mate its nice car.

r504490

Cheers guys for the info, I will check today to see if it was a LHD fingers crossed it was ,to my thinking the fuel filler is on the passenger side which is bit of a give away.. will pull the car out today and take some more pictures, A.K.A might be worth giving Tony Ryan a call on the race car

joffy

iTrader: (1)

sorry to hijack but ive got a rhd 3dr shell and people have said its a motorsport one just cos it has no sunroof, is that true or just crap talk?? its missing the turrets the rear springs should sit round aswell??
sorry again!

PAUL S

iTrader: (8)

Im pretty sure all the boreham 3drs had that oblong shaped fuel inlet on the nearside, whether they were lhs or rhd.

Tony knows about my car, but its a single seater f3000 car so not his main area. I did a colour scrape and its originally yellow so probably one of the camel cars from 1988 but its had a variety of paint jobs since.

cozzfather

iTrader: (1)

gruppe a works spec sierra cosworth driven by King Carlos sponsored by malboro,and deffo like i said a left hand drive, rally is el corte ingles.

what a fookin big pic of a car that put carlos on to the world rally scene

AndyPen

iTrader: (24)

Great pic!! Interesting rear wheels??

cozzfather

iTrader: (1)

yes they are interesting but you wouldn't buy them, my mate who painted loads for the above had the same front wheels on his Group A Colin Mcrae/Russell Brooks Sierra Cosworth 4x4.

the pic goes big if you hit the zoom level on the bottom right of your computer.

i have seen in the last year a ex rothmans saijd al jahari 3dr shell, a ex bt mark lovell 3dr, the ex didier auriol export 33 3dr,and the andrews heat for hire 3dr driven by russell brooks, also for the european rally fans i kn ow where the Fina Robert Droogmans R-A-S prepared sierra cosworth group a car is for sale.

craigos

now where do you find a car like that time warp,and still pretty complete

AndyPen

iTrader: (24)

Any updates on the search mate?

Cossfather, I too have 7 or eight of the front wheels but those rears look very special

r504490

Hi no updates at the moment spoke to malcolm wilson but there were no records kept of the shell number so hitting a brick wall at the moment but a guy up north wants to purchase the shell for a restoration he is doing ... we will see another question does anyone have a front and rear bumper for this car i might as well carry and get the sainz coulour scheme on the car..

r504490

Also might just sell as I have just purchased a new race car

r504490

Well update.. decided to put the car back to a rally car and in sainz colour scheme, I have the bits and just purchased a 3dr replica for the bits i don't have. a friend is going to do all off the graphics for me should be quite nice when it is finished.. any body got any of the wheels, or might just run it on the 9x17 race dynamic wheels I have. will post some pics on my progress..

righthooker

looking forward to seeing your progress ,keep us posted mate

markc777

Hi,

I have been restoring one of the ex Didier Auriol 33 export cars for the last 18 months. Mine was converted from left to right hand drive by replacing the complete front panel. This made it quite difficult to spot when the paint/sealer was round it but very obvious after stripping down. Also the seat runners can give you a clue, the navigators side is usually further back than the drivers, on my car this was the case when it was left hand drive and was not changed when converted.

If you need any help locating parts etc let me know.

Regards

Mark

cozzfather

iTrader: (1)

red built the export 33 car,they were "the sierra cosworth specialists" and won many championships with sierras. i would hate to own a car driven by a famous world champion that was converted to rhd if it was originally lhd, Malcolm Wilson owns the other famous Auriol sierra,the one that won a World championship round.
there was 2 specs for group a sierra 3dr's too.

markc777

I am debating whether to have it converted back to LHD but it was done by ACS very professionally back in 1988 so it was in the period. The car was prepared and run by RED, this is where Pete Doughty bought it from before having it converted to RHD. It was run on a ex-works plate of C236 HVW which Pete also owned at the time.

Can you shed any more light on the two specs for Grp A?

r504490

Hi mark
yes the seat mountings are in different place, also had it confirm by a ex Boreham engineer that is was a full works shell at some time buy all of the mounting brackets and the fuel filler, but the are no records of the shell numbers to chassis numbers to reg plates , which is a shame but will keep digging

r504490

opps for the spelling

cozzfather

iTrader: (1)

i'll have to dig out my info on the 2 group a specs to be 100% accurate, bitd there was a rally team from by me who were about the best in buying ex works sierras,they were called Welsh Area Rally Spares, i'm pretty sure they had the Pete Doughty 3dr and that on virtually the last homologated International rally on the Isle Of Mann the car was entered by Welsh Area's owners Sean and Adrian Farrell and did very well for a 2wd car,iirc it was top 5 placed.
i remember seeing the car in the workshop and wishing it was mine.
R-E-D still are going and so my mate who painted many cars for R-E-D back when R-E-D used to use his bodyshop in Ellesmere Port Cheshire.
he now paints cars for them in R-E-D'S new premises in Flint North Wales.
He used to paint and then service cars for Mike Taylor Developments, Mike Little Preparations MLP, and Rally Engineering Developments.
he also owns the ex Brooks and McRae car that was featured in Colins video clips from right after he died,it was the Sierra that Colin tested to destruction yet R-E-D kept it going and it finished the R-A-C that year,it was possibly that drive that led Colin to getting a Works seat with Prodrive Subaru the following year.
here is a pic of my mates R-E-D prepared Cozzie




This car was also seen in a more famous livery driven by Russell, it was black and sponsored by Texaco

markc777

Hi,

The car was sold to WARS after Pete had finished with it, I think it might have done some Belgium events as well. It ended up rallying in Ireland where I'm afraid to say it was not kept in the best of conditions, spending 5 yrs in a barn. The good thing is it has retained many of the original Grp a parts including the dog leg getrag, 9 inch diff and suspension and brakes. Unfortunately the rears have been condemned by AP so I am looking for some replacements.

I know it did the Donegal in 1992 and 1994 as it had the scrutineers stickers on the roll cage but I am struggling to find any pictures or video footage of it so far.

I will post some pictures when it gets back from the body shop and looks a bit more respectable.

r504490

Hi there thanks for the info as per the picture it has 1988,1988 adverstising permits which is a good sign... well hopefully i can find some more info as time goes on

cozzfather

iTrader: (1)

only just seen this,

its funny talking about a car i have seen rally and saw up close at welsh area rally spares's unit in st martins oswestry which was down the a483 right by me,the car was in top shape as them 2 brothers only rallied the best and iirc the car came in via a px with pete doughty aka dpe engineering the cosworth transmission specialist,wars sold dpe stuff and knew pete. its no surprise that the car ended up over in the emerald isle as they delt loads with the irish and they had big ads in the motoring news with all their cosworth stuff for sale.
rest assured the car would of been to the highest spec and condition back then as pete and the farrells could afford it.
i would like to see a pic of how it looks now as its been probably 17 years since i last saw it

AndyPen

iTrader: (24)

Interesting stuff - sorry to go a little off topic but it was WARS who had my car too.

cozzfather

iTrader: (1)

i sold a car to a woman from oswestry a few months ago who would of been around the same age as the farrells (welsh area) and she said they are still around oswestry.
i see sean at car auctions occasionally,what he's doing fucking around with boring stuff when he honestly was into the best cosworths in the world back in the day is a mystery,the other one adrian last i heard was into wine bars.

i'll have to dig out some of my old motoring news and scan some of their old ads up so you can see just how much ex works direct out of boreham stuff they had.
iirc it was sean who did the driving and adrian who did the navvying and they were good together. them rallying was good for buisness as they would be competeing with a lot of their clients.
i used to buy stuff from welsh area,i had a lhd mk2 rs2000 off them as they were well into mk1 and mk2 escorts before cozzies

AndyPen

iTrader: (24)

Didn't they do deals with Geoff Dewitt too? I seem to recall being told that as I took them to be more competitors than mates? I don't think Geoff's team would know about three doors but maybe I could check if anyone thought it worthwhile? They trade locally still but do mainly Jap stuff these days.

ian sibbert

Carl,

You dont half know some colourful characters....Sean and Adrian are actually from our neck of the woods they used to trade as ABS motorsport in the 80's doing RS2000's and the like Sean was ASAIK living here in Lancaster.....Adrian i've never seen for years....when I first got into Cossie's seriously they had some real machinery and you had the likes of Jon Joannadies and Rob Barry all out in top notch cars.....

cozzfather

iTrader: (1)

ady used to navvy for jj and my mates built with lyndsey shaw a 4x4 cos for the rac rally,my mate said jj paid up 75 grand in cash for the car and had never seen so much money . i used to spend loads of my wages with the farrells Ian

my mates used to repair jj's stuff,wars stuff,red's stuff,lyndseys stuff,rob barry's stuff too and serviced for barry mcguigan and yeah they repaired his fook ups .
god knows why wars gave it all up.

cozzfather

iTrader: (1)

the story went iirc that ford give 10 brand new sierra 3dr cosworths to ford dealers to be prepared into rally cars for the securicor challenge which was on the telly back in the old days on either bbc1 or itv. it was a big thing and a certain oo ahh hereford rally car builder called phil collins put a seat adjuster on the dash of his brand new cozzie and put somthing like 400 bhp to the far right and people were amazed and going on about it and the tv cameras video'd it.

you better watch this for a peek of c236hvw

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pmo22...eature=related


for any of the new school cosworth brigade imagine me still at school and me dad has a mk2 rs2000 and the cozzie came out and the rumour was you could chip them and they go faster,the music on the video is the miami vice music which was so cool at the time by jan hammer.

cozzfather

iTrader: (1)

i found this very very rare pic of the same car on the manx international 1991.
there was a few texaco sponsored cossies and this was texaco havoline,carello,andrews sykes, and dunlop sponsored.
russell brooks and world champion co driver neil wilson



sorry about the quality but its copyright protected

AndyPen

iTrader: (24)

Strange angle aint it? Is that a shortcut being taken?

I also remeber that car - more as you see it here. Oh. and I still have my Jan Hammer tape