Anonymous

..off ebay and a bargain a Body Tek elite..let the electric shock treatment commence

It is NOT a substitute for body building its an addition to get every last drop out of you ...Although it garantees after 3 weeks you will look better even if you just use this...Partcualary good for martial arts peaple for brute strength without any weight training.

If anybody knew about Bruce Lee he was seen using one of these many many years ago and is quoted to say "20 minutes of EMS on the relevant muscles is the equivilant of 200 pushups" Would you disbeleif Bruce Lee??

FastFordChris

my chiropractor uses a ems machine for treatment, always works a treat though he tends to put it on full wack for me

Anonymous

Fucking hell i am just starting out on this..i have deceided just to do bicep and tricep to see if this baby works.

Well my biceps after 20 minutes feel like they have been worked like nothing else..its SUCH a weird feeling I can actually say i did double the push ups i could do before use str8 after EMS I literally feel stronger and have proved to be

I am the biggest skeptic so i will put it all down to new toy so i WANT it to work.

Lets see after a few weeks.

Gonna do 20mins on beceps and triceps everyday for 1 month and weight train sat/sun every week..then after a month just use it 20 mins before work out.

ballin

iTrader: (1)

what an absolute fucking crock of shit.

sorry phil.

Anonymous

Ballin..how wrong you really are.

These are NOT gonna do anything on there own..so why on earth diss them Its a medical fact they contract the muscle far more than YOU can..on its own it wont do anything but add this to training and it works..its logic.

Unfortunately many have been put off by the con men saying that these ork on there own WRONG.

TRY IT put it on yor biceps for 20 miniutes and then tell me you cant lift more str8 after....You are VERY wrong.

DaveMCMkIII

Mate, EMS is used as a tool by physios and physians as a treament tool. It can indicate overtraining when muscle fibres respond greater to ems (suggests central muscle fatigue) and an also be used to improve the neuromuscluar responses of muscles. However, these same responses are saw during the first four weeks of a normal resistance training programme, making these items a waste of money, even to a niave subject, and pointless to a trained person. I studied ainto this during a particular piece of work during my degree. Im afraid you have been tricked by stupid advertisement and there is no scientific fact behind these products being beneficial to people already doing resistance training. Unfortuately the industry is splattered with so many idiots who think they know everything regarding training and state untrue unsubstansiated claims

Anonymous

Mate i got it off ebay cheap..i wasnt gonna pay retail..LOL.

Lets see if any results come then as research says they do work in conjuction with weight training.

The claims where you could look like Arnie by sitting on your couch The instructions to this model state it will only tone the muscle and harden it providing you are actually doin a proper program and eating correctly..how on earth is that a con? Seems pretty feasable to me..plus i can tell you if you tried it you wouldnt beleive how far you can contract the muscle..maybe proffexxional people can do that without the machine but i certainly thinks it will help in my training..and THINKIN it works is the key to success mate

ballin

iTrader: (1)

spot on.

I haven't studied this particular subject so can't give scientific replies although Dave has pretty much said it all!

They are a physio device, not a muscle building device....and to suggest that using one then instantly allows you to double your intensity is purposterous lol - think about Phil, you're a man of reason (most the time!) how could that possibly be true!?

Anonymous

Where have a said they build muscle? They give such a contraction that you are immediately stronger ofater 20 minutes..obviously it will wear off very quickily..you need to try it mate as i only ever speak from PRACTICE not THEORY

I think you have got confused with the ab belts that are going around that used to promice the best abs in the world in 3 weeks

I will garantee you you aint EVER had a muscle as pumped as from one of these..you can go so intense its just painful You wouldnt be able to physically lift a weight to work the muscle as this can..hence if you use it before training you WILL lift more..and it the actual weights and diet that build the muscle this is just a TRAINING AID for a better work out.

DaveMCMkIII

It may seem that way but its not true. If it was, every single elite athlete would be using these and as far as I am aware, EMS is not used in applied sport science to aid training responses.

Anonymous

Thats where your wrong mate


Its a common used appliance..for example its proved to keep a muscle in trim if you dont work it for a while.For example they are used when you say have a severe broken leg..to stop the muscle waisting away this keeps it active.

Bruce Lee said it works and to me thats gospel...the hospitals and atheletes that say its of use mean nothing to me

dexterc

Umm...didn't he say that already?

Its definitely not going to have any value in making you any stronger, it cannot place a maximal load on the muscle, nor will it stimulate the CNS.

Anonymous

Isnt that what i said?

People really do want to bring me down

Can noone have a normal convo without hate?

DaveMCMkIII

Im not trying to bring you down, im trying to get you to undestand the truth

As you said its used when people are injuried and inactive help maintain some muscular activity (by helping to maintain the level of neuromuscluar function), but this is a treatment tool as using weight loads cannot be possible due to the risk of further injury. You cant take celebs words for things, bruce lee was prob paid thousands to back it up and with due respect, since when does he know about physiology, hes a martial arts man. You have to understand that the only near thing to 'gospel' is the findings of the scientific studies submitted to many peer reviewed journals.

Im not trying to burst your bubble, im just trying to get through to you its not like many people think.

Retro Al

iTrader: (1)

fooking ell they had them when bruce lee was alive

Anonymous

When Bruce Lee used one he certainly did NOT advertise it....it was in a documentry of his work out..i remember at the time thinkin what a fucking nutter to electricute himself He would NEVER use something as a gimmick....you obviously didnt really know about the man Dave.

DaveMCMkIII

Correct, I know bugger all about bruce lee, but i know a dam sight about physiology and sport science

skeg

It doesn't matter what you know or think you know. So you studied up on a little bit of it for a particular module in your degree course and now you can write off all products? Even ones that are used by premiership footballers, atheletes etc.

The bodi tek ones are supposed to be the best on the market and geared towards sports people not disabled or seriously injured people. Its not one of the overpriced dodgy looking items you see advertised in the tv guide aimed at couch potatoes. Atheletes actually support and endorse it. And before you start yes they get paid but then so do those rock stars that use a certain instrument and endorse it. Does it mean its not any good? Quite the opposite and why they are used as an example to promote it. Because the best rate it the best.

Training at the gym 3-4 days a week is all well and good so too is running in the morning for cardio vascular fitness but these particular units do offer benefits, on the tone setting it helps to keep the bulk you gain at the gym defined and the various masage settings do wonders for the back that squats has set off. I never use it on the building/enhance setting though.

Its simple logic really, in its various settings and strengths it tenses your muscle so many times in a set period, how is this not going to improve your psyique or strength? And the original poster is correct, some of the settings tense that certain muscle far far harder than the reletive physical exerise would do, ie. running, swimming, press ups, sit ups, etc. No one who hasn't used one before could put it on maximum on certain muscle and take it for 30 minutes. (1400 or so times) After using one a couple of nights you can tell the difference in feel, a lot hader.

As for bruce he did use it but not that exact one obiously, it was featured on the film about his life with Jason scott lee with imput from his wife. Dragon.

Have you seen how atheletes like sprinters look? They try anything and everything to get the edge, sometime even illegal methods.

DaveMCMkIII

Alright, didnt read your whole post but i'l reply to the three main things.

1. EMS covers the topics of obviously the product its self and applied physiology, somthing which i spent three years studying, not a few lectures.

2. You said how cant it make your gain strength?Easy, if you read the thread I say it only causes neuromuscular adaptations which improve your strength (e.g. increased firing on motor neurones, greater sensitivity of the neuromuscular junctions etc). BUT, these adaptations only occur during the first 4-6 weeks of training, this is why novices see such an early rapid increase in strength when they begin training. Therefore as ems causes neuromuscluar changes these changes only occur in a subject who is either a novice or been inactive for a period (e.g. athlete returning from recoverey) and even in this instance, will provide no further benefits after 4-6 weeks.

3. Premiership clubs will use this probably but as a physio tool, not a pure fitness tool. As ive said a number of times, physios use them to help sustain muscular strength during a period of inactivity in an athlete (help reduce loss of strength) or to gradually bring an athlete back from injury.

In conclusion, the best indication of how effective these products are is research as they rule out placebo, internal intrests, influences etc etc. And these suggest EMS can be effective in improving neuromuscular ability, which in hand increases strength, but only in novice subjects or those who are injuried, during the early stages of training

EDIT

By the way, just want to make it clear im not trying to put people down or anything for buying these, at the end the day if you want to buy one and try thats fair enough. However, all im trying to do is respond to posts which i think give inaccurate or jaded information regarding stuff like this and give people an insight in to the scientific stance on such a subject, if they are considering buying such a product

skeg

Well i disagree. You say you're posting for the benefits of those considering purchasing these units as they only work for novices or the injured for 4-6 weeks. This is incorrect. I train (gym) and run in the morning regular and get benefits from this. So whats you explanation? Am i a special case, a one off?

Have you ACTUALLY used this unit for a significant period of time? I'm guessing no. Besides i doubt your 3 year course was relevant to EMS all the way though as you claim. You wouldn't have had time for any other modules.

I'm not saying you gain fitness or sports people use it for fitness, i mean you don't break a sweat/breath like Cardio vascular exercise like running or biking but it does work the muscle harder which does benefit muscle shape. After all tensing is tensing, weather its lifting weights, running, manually tensing or TRICKING your muscles to tense, its all the same. If we sit on the sofa and don't move what occurs? Fat and Atrophy. The fact is atheletes and sports people reportedly use it and not just for injury recovery as you claim. So why try to shrug it off. Using this unit to recover from injury would mean you would have to have it on vry low and build it up over time. Putting it on mid to high would likely to injure you further.

You obviously have knowledge but a 3 year course covering sport does not make you an expert or give you the right to wipe off things without testing it, i would much prefer to hear the views of those WHO HAVE USED the particular product in question rather than those of a generic course. After all the internet it full of people who will post "someone my mate knows has used it/driven it and its...." Well i have used it for a long period and i know it goes well with the other stuff to offer even more benefit.

I've been to Uni and no way did it cover all aspects in my field. 3 years is just not enough.

Bottom line is, test a 1000 people with the Unit for 6 months on tone or enhance and test another 1000 with situps, pressups, light running and similar exercises and then see whos mucles look the most worked, the most in shape and defined. I don't use it for fitness or strenth as there are other methods for that so i don't care about that.

*However i bet it would increase your strength but unless you use just the unit on its own its hard to tell.

DaveMCMkIII

at no stage have i said im an expert or said im right so clear off, i said it is my opinion. Unless you have studied what i have at uni its impossible to comment on what i have learnt as subjects differ.

secondly my opinion is based on findings of scientific studies which have a load more validity than personal opinion which can be effected by so much. No i havent used one, but why should i have to when the most valid conlusions on these machines is from research

skeg

This is getting boring now so lets wrap it up shall we. Without the uni spiel which of the following are you stating?

1. Bodi tek EMS does not improve strength
2. It does not improve perfomance
3. It doesn't improve the muscle definition, hardness and tone.
4. All of the above

For me i would say 1 is up for debate, 2 is maybe no and 3 is definitely without a doubt. 1 and 2 i couldn't care about to be fair and i would assume the majority of people buying these systems do so for reason 3.

Anyway if you click the link below and go on the "about" page then clients, research and approval it will show you some important things to back it up. Showing that the unit has many uses on its various programs and is used for muscle improvement as well as recovery. With people using it like:

http://www.bodi-tek.co.uk/

Michael and Ralf Schumacher, Juventus, Wimbledon, RAF, Army, NASA, daley tompson and Thames valley university. So forgive me if i chose not to belive the views of some Uni student who has never used it. Especially when i have and seen the results. But admitedly i was not argreeing with the original posters claims that you could lift more after using it before weigths just that it does improve muscle definition etc. Your comments made it look like you were saying the unit/technology is worthless and that is incorrect.

skeg

Certain peoples research can be wrong though as the past has shown us. How many times are food products cleared to be safe and turn out not to be in the end. What about research that claimed it would be ok and not fatal for people to participate in the recent drugs trials with side affects being minial. Again they got it wrong and people were seriously ill. Even governement research and intelligence can be proved inaccurate and thats the highest level.

For you its a case of being passed on information and studies, for me i have actually used it and am saying it works as do many others out there but still you won't have it. Like employment its the old Uni vs experience debate. Which is better.

Realistically if i was an ousider looking in would take the word of those who have used it not just someone generalising the whole technology. If we listented to only reseach we would never try anything. I prefer to listen to all the views then go and and try it for myself, make up my OWN mind. And these units do have positive research!

the-grumpy-one

post a pic of one of these things.....i dont know what your talking about!

skeg

the-grumpy-one

ohhhhhhhhhh, one of them!!!

my mums had one of those for years, it only works on skinny people tho

it dont work for the cubbier person

skeg

What that exatct brand (boditek) or one of the other ones? Theres lots out there, some cheap and nasty some great. That one is very very powerful.

the-grumpy-one

dont have a clue m8, its up in the loft now....its atleast 7-10 yers old tho!